Perceptions!

[Holly Goodhead]

It is interesting to observe how we all perceive things differently.

I've just been reading the posts on Blue (I can't help myself  )  Anyhow earlier today someone posted the following:

6 August 2002 Stokenchurch investigation. Room 101 Trenchard House. DS 21 Stanley Jones speaking to DCI Jeannette McDiarmid about the kitchen telephone.

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Every known photograph of the ivory coloured kitchen phone, including those on this website, shows the phone in pristine condition. What could Jones have meant by "the state of it"? Blood all over it?

The responses can be read here:

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8404.msg400313.html#msg400313

As we know the official line is that the ivory telephone found in the kitchen was blood free.  This fits with my reconstruction as to what happened so I guess I might be seeing things differently.  The OP in the above seems to be suggesting there was blood on the phone.   To my mind what DS Jones meant when he said

 “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Is that he would feel uncomfortable using the phone given the state of the kitchen ie NB perched precariously on a chair with his head in the coal skuttle having sustained a number of gsw's, significant other injuries, blood all about his person with a pool on the floor, his pyjama trousers around his ankles, clearly dead and most probably a rather unpleasant smell developing.  I wouldn't particularly want to have a phone conversation in such an environment unless it was absolutely essential.  I guess it could even be considered disrespectful to do so.

[Myster]

It is interesting to observe how we all perceive things differently.

I've just been reading the posts on Blue (I can't help myself  )  Anyhow earlier today someone posted the following:

6 August 2002 Stokenchurch investigation. Room 101 Trenchard House. DS 21 Stanley Jones speaking to DCI Jeannette McDiarmid about the kitchen telephone.

Jones) “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Every known photograph of the ivory coloured kitchen phone, including those on this website, shows the phone in pristine condition. What could Jones have meant by "the state of it"? Blood all over it?

The responses can be read here:

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8404.msg400313.html#msg400313

As we know the official line is that the ivory telephone found in the kitchen was blood free.  This fits with my reconstruction as to what happened so I guess I might be seeing things differently.  The OP in the above seems to be suggesting there was blood on the phone.   To my mind what DS Jones meant when he said

 “I can’t even see anybody using the phone in that kitchen, the state of it, do you know what I mean. There’s no way I want to use that phone”

Is that he would feel uncomfortable using the phone given the state of the kitchen ie NB perched precariously on a chair with his head in the coal skuttle having sustained a number of gsw's, significant other injuries, blood all about his person with a pool on the floor, his pyjama trousers around his ankles, clearly dead and most probably a rather unpleasant smell developing.  I wouldn't particularly want to have a phone conversation in such an environment unless it was absolutely essential.  I guess it could even be considered disrespectful to do so.

A no-brainer from a straw-clutcher on blue... it's patently obvious what SJ meant.

A clean phone fits into everyone's reconstruction except Jeremy Bamber's. Colin Caffell's recollection of what he said at the cottage...

[Nicholas]

Great post by Jane today on blue re the alleged "trick of the light"

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8855.msg422371.html#msg422371

"It probably -at the time- ran along the lines of

 Jeremy. "What was that?"

 Police. "What? Where?"

 Jeremy. "In the bedroom. I think I saw something! Look! There it is again!!  Can you see it?"

 Police. "I can't be certain. Maybe it's a trick of light?"

 Jeremy. "No, no! It could be someone moving"

 Police. "Maybe you thought you saw something but there's nothing there now"

By the time it came to relaying it, no one could recall who said what. There had been a conversation but nothing concrete was established.

[Nicholas]

Which reminds me of Barry Georges sisters comment re movement in the farmhouse

"Jeremy, their son, was outside with police who were trying to communicate with someone inside the house who had been seen pacing back and forth in front of an upstairs window and carrying a firearm. The reporter said that police were reluctant to get too close to the house for fear of causing that person to become more agitated, thereby, escalating the danger to the family. I watched for an hour or so but there was no resolution and, heavily pregnant, I became exhausted and had to go off to bed.http://jeremybamber.blogspot.co.uk/2016/08/justice-is-never-served-by-conviction.html


"Oh! What A Tangled Web We Weave When First We Practice To Deceive" https://www.enotes.com/topics/marmion/quotes/oh-what-tangled-web-we-weave-when-first-we

[Nicholas]

Kaldin today-

"Thanks Lucy. I knew that he had said PC Myall thought he saw movement, but he also claimed that it was Jeremy who said it, which I didn't know.
What do you believe, I can't keep up with all this changing lol
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8855.msg422438.html#msg422438

Great post by Jane today on blue re the alleged "trick of the light"

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,8855.msg422371.html#msg422371

"It probably -at the time- ran along the lines of

 Jeremy. "What was that?"

 Police. "What? Where?"

 Jeremy. "In the bedroom. I think I saw something! Look! There it is again!!  Can you see it?"

 Police. "I can't be certain. Maybe it's a trick of light?"

 Jeremy. "No, no! It could be someone moving"

 Police. "Maybe you thought you saw something but there's nothing there now"

By the time it came to relaying it, no one could recall who said what. There had been a conversation but nothing concrete was established.

[steve_trousers]

Stephanie, you are quite right this incident came about by Jeremy's own suggestion.

It was crucial that Essex constabulary accepted Jeremy's version of events first, it was all part of his plan. At that stage PC Myall had no reason to suspect what had taken place, so naturally when Jeremy claimed he saw movement in the window Myall made a note of it.

After the event Bamber grasped at this as proof there was someone alive in the house when they arrived, of course PC Myall confirmed it was just utter bollocks.

[Holly Goodhead]

Stephanie, you are quite right this incident came about by Jeremy's own suggestion.

It was crucial that Essex constabulary accepted Jeremy's version of events first, it was all part of his plan. At that stage PC Myall had no reason to suspect what had taken place, so naturally when Jeremy claimed he saw movement in the window Myall made a note of it.

After the event Bamber grasped at this as proof there was someone alive in the house when they arrived, of course PC Myall confirmed it was just utter bollocks.

PC Myalls was the first person to identify 'movement' at the window.

[Nicholas]

PC Myalls was the first person to identify 'movement' at the window.

AFTER Bamber planted the seed of doubt

He KNOWINGLY skewed PC Myalls perception - it was ALL part of his plan

Bamber even managed to skew Michelle Bates/Diskins perception (sister of Barry George)

Which reminds me of Barry Georges sisters comment re movement in the farmhouse

"Jeremy, their son, was outside with police who were trying to communicate with someone inside the house who had been seen pacing back and forth in front of an upstairs window and carrying a firearm. The reporter said that police were reluctant to get too close to the house for fear of causing that person to become more agitated, thereby, escalating the danger to the family. I watched for an hour or so but there was no resolution and, heavily pregnant, I became exhausted and had to go off to bed.http://jeremybamber.blogspot.co.uk/2016/08/justice-is-never-served-by-conviction.html


"Oh! What A Tangled Web We Weave When First We Practice To Deceive" https://www.enotes.com/topics/marmion/quotes/oh-what-tangled-web-we-weave-when-first-we

[John]

AFTER Bamber planted the seed of doubt

He KNOWINGLY skewed PC Myalls perception - it was ALL part of his plan

Absolutely.  Just put oneself in the position of those first police officers who did the recce around the farmhouse with Jeremy Bamber in tow.  Bamber told them there were several guns in the house and that there had been a disturbance an hour earlier yet now there was silence, nobody to be seen.  They would be on edge as they tiptoed around the farmhouse, expecting at any time to hear a shot, a scream, a window open.  No wonder therefore that any slight movement was perceived as an imminent danger with their imaginations running riot.

[Nicholas]

Absolutely.  Just put oneself in the position of those first police officers who did the recce around the farmhouse with Jeremy Bamber in tow.  Bamber told them there were several guns in the house and that there had been a disturbance an hour earlier yet now there was silence, nobody to be seen.  They would be on edge as they tiptoed around the farmhouse, expecting at any time to hear a shot, a scream, a window open.  No wonder therefore that any slight movement was perceived as an imminent danger.

And Bamber was cool as a cucumber

Talking to a police officer about purchasing a car then later toddled off for a full English

Or as he referred to it in 2010:


"You ask me whether I would have done things differently, as if I had control over how I coped with the grief of losing my whole family"

“I am certainly not alone in turning to alcohol in sorrow – nor in seeking the company of others who cared about me.”
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/convicted-killer-jeremy-bamber-feels-239967

[John]

Which reminds me of Barry Georges sisters comment re movement in the farmhouse

"Jeremy, their son, was outside with police who were trying to communicate with someone inside the house who had been seen pacing back and forth in front of an upstairs window and carrying a firearm. The reporter said that police were reluctant to get too close to the house for fear of causing that person to become more agitated, thereby, escalating the danger to the family. I watched for an hour or so but there was no resolution and, heavily pregnant, I became exhausted and had to go off to bed.http://jeremybamber.blogspot.co.uk/2016/08/justice-is-never-served-by-conviction.html


"Oh! What A Tangled Web We Weave When First We Practice To Deceive" https://www.enotes.com/topics/marmion/quotes/oh-what-tangled-web-we-weave-when-first-we

Just goes to show, one should never take for granted anything you hear from a reporter.  To be honest, I thought Michelle Diskin-Bates knew better!

[John]

And Bamber was cool as a cucumber

Talking to a police officer about purchasing a car then later toddled off for a full English

Or as he referred to it in 2010:


"You ask me whether I would have done things differently, as if I had control over how I coped with the grief of losing my whole family (interesting how he uses the word control).

“I am certainly not alone in turning to alcohol in sorrow – nor in seeking the company of others who cared about me.”
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/convicted-killer-jeremy-bamber-feels-239967

Any person in a genuine situation would have had to have been held back.  Bamber made no effort to rush to the farmhouse, claiming he actually stopped his car and got out to put on a cardigan.  Who in their right mind would come up with such garbage?

[Nicholas]

Just goes to show, one should never take for granted anything you hear from a reporter.  To be honest, I thought Michelle Diskin-Bates knew better!

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=7824.0

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php?topic=8126.0

[Nicholas]

Any person in a genuine situation would have had to have been held back.  Bamber made no effort to rush to the farmhouse, claiming he actually stopped his car and got out to put on a cardigan.  Who in their right mind would come up with such garbage?

This reminds me of the Billy (William) Middleton case and how his poor wife (at the time) desperately tried to get to her baby daughter

And where was Billy at the time? FFS

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/i-carried-baby-girls-lifeless-body-1013688

"Middleton blamed his wife for the fire"

Bambers supporters come up with every excuse under the sun that his behaviour was NORMAL - there was NOTHING normal about the way he bahaved and the way he has since behaved