Author Topic: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"  (Read 18746 times)

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Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #45 on: May 29, 2022, 04:28:59 PM »
https://www.concertarchives.org/bands/ramage-inc


Ramage Inc. Concert History
5 Concerts
Ramage Inc. is a progressive metal band from Edinburgh that formed around 2003. The band was formed by Bryan Ramage for the purpose of bringing life to his musical work on stage. Together with his faithful musical companions, the music takes on a new level of energy and elegance in a live environment. Devin Townsend, Vast, Nine Inch Nails, Deftones and Opeth are all cited as being big influences.


Actually they formed together before 2004. Here is a little further information for you that I have been supplied with. The drummer who played at the 'gig' that LM went to with Jodi Jones was a relative of Jodi's thus the reason they went to see them. The band needed a replacement drummer to help at the time.

Hope that clarifies matters for you

It doesn’t clarify things at all. It simply makes your claim murkier.

‘Around 2003’? Rather ambiguous. Sounds as if the person writing the article doesn’t really know. As to the rest, yet again you fail to provide any proof beyond your word. Concrete proof of your claims may indeed clarify things.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #46 on: May 29, 2022, 04:33:43 PM »
Thanks once again for your reply, parky41. I never doubted that the German army badge was mentioned by those 3 women . . . it's just that I'd hitherto never read a single solitary thing about it. Did you read about it on that private group you are a member of? The group which has members who were at the actual trial?

And I agree about LM's hair colour appearing darker or lighter, depending on the weather. For example, in the pics of LM at Jodi's grave with his mother & LW, his hair appears a lot lighter and radiant -- like a platinum blonde colour -- due to the very sunny weather that day. This is in stark contrast to the colour of his hair in the pic of him leaving his house in NB Abbey Crescent wearing parka jacket number 2 (the probable replacement jacket that was bought about a week after the murder). In that pic, it was a very dull day and LM's hair looked considerably darker that it did in the graveside pic -- so much so that you could definitely excuse someone for describing his hair colour as dark (and even more so when matted down with hair gel as those 2 women mentioned when they saw the suspicious-looking youth at that gate on the NB Rd that day at 1745).

And on the subject of parka jacket number 2 -- what do you all think about it being purchased? It's very strange, isn't it? Obviously LM liked it, and was coddled and indulged by his mother (i.e, what Luke wanted, Luke got). Wasn't he and his mother worried that purchasing it would come back to bite them? LM was obviously aware that there was a strong chance that people saw him wearing it that day between 1645 - 1745. He and mother Corinne were probably very confident at that point that the purchase of a new jacket wouldn't be problematic as they had (probably, imo) destroyed the first jacket completely in a fire (or got SM to dispose of it some 7 or 8 miles away; it was ascertained that SM was at a petrol station 7 miles away on 30.06.03). They knew the jacket would never be found and knew there were no photos of Luke wearing it (if there were any such photos, they were probably burned too?). Perhaps purchasing that second parka jacket was a decoy of sorts, in that the Mitchells probably assumed the police would have assumed they wouldn't be so stupid to buy an identical jacket to the one LM was wearing when he murdered his girlfriend? Who knows. At the end of the day, I think the Mitchells underestimated the police and circumstantial evidence. What are your thoughts on the purchase of this second parka jacket?

So beyond Parky’s reassurance you still have no concrete proof of the German claim or perhaps you’re seeing something I’m not.

Could you please point out what concrete proof you see that I don’t?

I hope you don’t mind me asking you another question? Of course you don’t have to answer but it is obvious you have doubts, pertinent doubts, about the evidence in this case and you make some excellent points. However you seem to be rather easy to convince that those doubts are not justified, without being given even the merest scintilla of provable facts. Why is that? What are you more interested in, simply upholding the status quo or actually knowing the truth?
« Last Edit: May 29, 2022, 04:59:40 PM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #47 on: May 30, 2022, 09:52:11 AM »
Therefore yes, I assume it is one and the same band, certainly called the same although my brain cottoned on to 'Ink' as opposed to 'Inc' - Most definitely "Ramage --" and certainly that the drummer was a stand in at the time and connected to Jodi Jones.

Quite a coincidence that. So who was the drummer connected to Jodi…this stand in? Was it Mat Orrock, who was the band’s drummer from it’s formation until 2007, or Casey McManus, his replacement, or perhaps some other drummer who made one, random, appearance and was, almost unbelievably, connected to the murder victim?

And not one report in any of the newspapers of any witness from this concert, not one, which is odd as the jacket played such a pivotal role in the prosecution’s case.

It would be useful if you could provide a link to this, interestingly, secret group where the ‘real’ evidence is allegedly discussed that others believe that you have access to. Odd that you haven’t done it up until now.
« Last Edit: May 30, 2022, 09:59:54 AM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Mr Apples

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #48 on: May 31, 2022, 10:15:49 PM »
So beyond Parky’s reassurance you still have no concrete proof of the German claim or perhaps you’re seeing something I’m not.

Could you please point out what concrete proof you see that I don’t?

I hope you don’t mind me asking you another question? Of course you don’t have to answer but it is obvious you have doubts, pertinent doubts, about the evidence in this case and you make some excellent points. However you seem to be rather easy to convince that those doubts are not justified, without being given even the merest scintilla of provable facts. Why is that? What are you more interested in, simply upholding the status quo or actually knowing the truth?

Firstly, the German army badge matters not a jot in the grand scheme of things. Eight separate witnesses testified in court that he owned a green parka jacket that AB, RW & LF saw him wearing on 30.06.03 (and these 3 women unequivocally & positively id'd LM on that fateful day; I am 100% convinced it was LM at both ends of that path between 1655 and 1745 -- 50 mins to murder, hide and carry out those mutilations). Secondly, I don't have doubts. You are putting words into my mouth. I've stated many times on here that the circumstantial evidence against  was overwhelming and I'd be extremely surprised if he didn't do it. However, it was a purely circumstantial case, so there is still the possibility that LM, in fact, wasn't responsible (about a one in a million chance, imo, as per the circumstantial evidence).

I knew nothing of this case until the C5 doco last year. After only 2 weeks of research, I was convinced that LM was guilty. After a further 9 months, I was absolutely certain he did it. Yes, I concede that Parky41's extensive, eloquent and informative posts have been, to an extent, instrumental in shaping my opinion. But, I do not treat his posts as some kind of Bible. As you say, it would be nice if he would confirm what this private group was/is and provide cites for these seemingly obscure pieces of evidence  (eg, SM being at a petrol station 7 to 8 miles away that night, LM appearing cleaner than normal that night, LM's bedroom looking as though it had been cleaned when the police swooped on it and raided it, LM's bike being spotted at a school gate, those women referencing the German army badge on the green parka jacket and, last but not least, those multiple partial profiles thought to be from LM as per the law of averages).

Offline Mr Apples

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #49 on: June 01, 2022, 08:45:08 PM »
Rather than create a separate thread, can someone confirm if Luke and Jodi had had an argument in school that day (30.06.03)? I read on the blue forum that they had and that apparantely they were spotted by fellow school mates in the China Gardens, unusually, with their backs to one another and not talking. Can anyone expand on this? It's quite important as it ties in with what her best friend Kirsten Ford said of her being quieter than normal at school that day (cite below) and AB seeing them arguing at 1655 hrs at the entrance to the Easthouses end of RDP. Their argument earlier at school had continued when they met up at this point and reached its horrific climax at 1715, whereupon LM snapped and murdered Jodi in an episode of uncontrollable rage and psychosis -- rage and psychosis largely induced by excessive cannabis usage?

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/JODI+JONES%3A+HER+SOULMATES+My+Luke+has+all+these+knives+in+his...-a0127512558
« Last Edit: June 01, 2022, 08:47:59 PM by Mr Apples »

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #50 on: June 05, 2022, 11:43:22 PM »
Firstly, the German army badge matters not a jot in the grand scheme of things. Eight separate witnesses testified in court that he owned a green parka jacket that AB, RW & LF saw him wearing on 30.06.03 (and these 3 women unequivocally & positively id'd LM on that fateful day; I am 100% convinced it was LM at both ends of that path between 1655 and 1745 -- 50 mins to murder, hide and carry out those mutilations). Secondly, I don't have doubts. You are putting words into my mouth. I've stated many times on here that the circumstantial evidence against  was overwhelming and I'd be extremely surprised if he didn't do it. However, it was a purely circumstantial case, so there is still the possibility that LM, in fact, wasn't responsible (about a one in a million chance, imo, as per the circumstantial evidence).

I knew nothing of this case until the C5 doco last year. After only 2 weeks of research, I was convinced that LM was guilty. After a further 9 months, I was absolutely certain he did it. Yes, I concede that Parky41's extensive, eloquent and informative posts have been, to an extent, instrumental in shaping my opinion. But, I do not treat his posts as some kind of Bible. As you say, it would be nice if he would confirm what this private group was/is and provide cites for these seemingly obscure pieces of evidence  (eg, SM being at a petrol station 7 to 8 miles away that night, LM appearing cleaner than normal that night, LM's bedroom looking as though it had been cleaned when the police swooped on it and raided it, LM's bike being spotted at a school gate, those women referencing the German army badge on the green parka jacket and, last but not least, those multiple partial profiles thought to be from LM as per the law of averages).

After two weeks of research you were convinced of Luke’s guilt?

After weeks of hearing ALL the evidence for and against Luke the jury still couldn’t come to a unanimous decision with regard to his guilt. Yet here you are convinced of his guilt after reading snippets of testimony in the tabloids and unverifiable ‘information’ from Parky. Can you see the problem?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #51 on: June 05, 2022, 11:46:13 PM »
Rather than create a separate thread, can someone confirm if Luke and Jodi had had an argument in school that day (30.06.03)? I read on the blue forum that they had and that apparantely they were spotted by fellow school mates in the China Gardens, unusually, with their backs to one another and not talking. Can anyone expand on this? It's quite important as it ties in with what her best friend Kirsten Ford said of her being quieter than normal at school that day (cite below) and AB seeing them arguing at 1655 hrs at the entrance to the Easthouses end of RDP. Their argument earlier at school had continued when they met up at this point and reached its horrific climax at 1715, whereupon LM snapped and murdered Jodi in an episode of uncontrollable rage and psychosis -- rage and psychosis largely induced by excessive cannabis usage?

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/JODI+JONES%3A+HER+SOULMATES+My+Luke+has+all+these+knives+in+his...-a0127512558

Can you provide a cite regarding your claim that AB had said the couple she saw looked like they were arguing?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Mr Apples

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #52 on: June 06, 2022, 08:54:22 PM »
Can you provide a cite regarding your claim that AB had said the couple she saw looked like they were arguing?

The info in this article regarding AB's eyewitness testimony is a tad ambiguous, but, as per the circumstantial evidence in its totality,  I'm of the opinion that the the two people 'who didn't look like they were coming to meet' were Luke and Jodi. Yes, we know that Jodi left her home to meet Luke in a happy mood, but they had an argument to resolve that began in school earlier that day (if someone could confirm that this young couple had had an argument in school earlier that day, that would be great). I believe the argument started again almost as soon as they met up again at that path. I don't think a random stranger with murder on their mind would be standing with their hands by their side gesticulating to their potential target/victim in broad daylight at the top of a path that was facing on to a busy road; and, likewise, I don't think Jodi would be standing looking, even momentarily, at a total stranger who was inside a pathway heading into a secluded path bordered by fields and a woodland strip. Bit of a coincidence that the guy had messy, shoulder-length hair sticking up at the back, had that jacket on that numerous people testified in court that he had owned and worn prior to 30.06.03, that Jodi had arranged to specifically meet LM earlier than normal and him alone, that his very own brother said he never saw him in the house at that crucial timeframe between 1645-1715 and that his own brother admitted that he would not be looking at those images (porn downloaded from his PC) and masturbating had anyone else been in the house at that time, that, above all else, AB said she was as sure as sure as she could be that it was LM in that book of photographs the police presented, that she said she was taken aback by how much the person she saw in a pic in a newspaper looked like LM. Far too many coincidences, imo. It was LM, imo.

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/I+HEARD+STRANGLING+NOISE+NEAR+JODI+PATH%3b+Cyclist+tells+death+trial+of...-a0125547921

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #53 on: June 06, 2022, 10:30:28 PM »
The info in this article regarding AB's eyewitness testimony is a tad ambiguous, but, as per the circumstantial evidence in its totality,  I'm of the opinion that the the two people 'who didn't look like they were coming to meet' were Luke and Jodi. Yes, we know that Jodi left her home to meet Luke in a happy mood, but they had an argument to resolve that began in school earlier that day (if someone could confirm that this young couple had had an argument in school earlier that day, that would be great). I believe the argument started again almost as soon as they met up again at that path. I don't think a random stranger with murder on their mind would be standing with their hands by their side gesticulating to their potential target/victim in broad daylight at the top of a path that was facing on to a busy road; and, likewise, I don't think Jodi would be standing looking, even momentarily, at a total stranger who was inside a pathway heading into a secluded path bordered by fields and a woodland strip. Bit of a coincidence that the guy had messy, shoulder-length hair sticking up at the back, had that jacket on that numerous people testified in court that he had owned and worn prior to 30.06.03, that Jodi had arranged to specifically meet LM earlier than normal and him alone, that his very own brother said he never saw him in the house at that crucial timeframe between 1645-1715 and that his own brother admitted that he would not be looking at those images (porn downloaded from his PC) and masturbating had anyone else been in the house at that time, that, above all else, AB said she was as sure as sure as she could be that it was LM in that book of photographs the police presented, that she said she was taken aback by how much the person she saw in a pic in a newspaper looked like LM. Far too many coincidences, imo. It was LM, imo.

https://www.thefreelibrary.com/I+HEARD+STRANGLING+NOISE+NEAR+JODI+PATH%3b+Cyclist+tells+death+trial+of...-a0125547921

Let’s look at the actual evidence you have presented.

You have posted no evidence that AB ever claimed that the couple she saw were arguing.

You extrapolate Jodi’s friend’s comment that, with hindsight, she was quiet on the day of her murder to validate your claim that she and Luke had argued that day. Even if Jodi had been quieter on that day there are numerous reasons why this could have been the case. With the greatest respect your conclusion is simply not supported by the known facts.

As I’ve pointed out before there is multiple problems with AB’s sighting, or at least the sighting that was latterly used in court. AB never at any time claimed the youth she saw wore a parka jacket, in fact she specifically said that it wasn’t. That she also described the clothing worn by the female she saw as crucially different from Jodi’s known attire is also problematic. That she thought the male she saw was in his early 20s when all photographs of Luke at the time prove that he did not look older than his age should also give those studying this case pause for thought. I think it’s one of the most telling moments of the trial was when AB refused to identify Luke as the youth she saw.

The timings of AB’s journey to and from the supermarket that day also only make sense if the ones she gave in her first statements are correct. Of course that being the case she could not have seen the couple she saw at the time the prosecution said.

The time Jodi left the house is also disputed by at least one of her neighbours.

As to AB’s identification of Luke via the photograph presented by the police, multiple experts have said that the way this identification was carried out was against police guidelines. Further after AB had made her initial identification, even if it was heavily weighted against Luke, it is then no surprise that she identified him again in the newspaper. I’d have been surprised if she hadn’t.
« Last Edit: June 07, 2022, 09:31:48 AM by faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Chris_Halkides

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #54 on: June 07, 2022, 07:20:59 PM »
I thought I read that Jodi was "chuffed" to be meeting Luke that afternoon.  That suggests to me that either they did not fight at school or that it was trivial.  The problems within the testimony of AB were also discussed at the International Skeptics Forum under the Luke Mitchell section of the Trials and Errors sub-forum.

Offline Parky41

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #55 on: June 07, 2022, 09:02:35 PM »


But there you have, does it matter if you believe anything I may say - Absolutely not. The irony of course that you claim I am spreading disinformation, how could you possibly know that Faith? You don't and I am not.  So this truth, this absolute fact, that LM with Jodi Jones attended a 'gig' mid-June 2003 to see that band. That and again, absolute fact, LM was wearing said coat, never to be seen again from the day of the murder.

Your 'nowhere in the media does it say -------' Exactly the point once more, that reliance for manipulation to play around what can be sourced, and banking upon that which one hopes can not be sourced. Intelligent? Over four hours of evidence each day, and isn't it just terrible that the media did not choose to report every word, deciding to put out other news too!

Absolute fact once more, that even limited intelligence can digest. Now I wonder why the defence did not retain every single word, of every statement they accessed. How much proof of that jacket would serve beneficial to trying to cast doubt about him having one!! In excess of 8 people from different occasions/connection chosen to represent each, from groups of more. One teacher, do you actually believe there was only one who gave a statement of seeing Mitchell in that coat - Of course you don't, not even you are that gullible, surely? Fact again, his closest friend, would NOT and could NOT state they had never seen Mitchell in his lovely 'magic coat'

The reliance and manipulation of media articles, tabloids included of course. They mystery man, where the author works solely from the information obtained from a newspaper report. Has NOT read any statements from the two independent people, from the time. Guesswork and one big IF of when they MAY have come forward. Statements are dated. The attempt at ripping to shreds the outstanding eye witness testimony, of three people, not one, seeing LM that day in that lovely green khaki coat. To Ms Leans manipulation of an impossible identity made upon a male from Jodi's funeral. Vague she claims this witness was towards the SCCRC, no Faith it is the author who has to be vague, in the same fashion as no bike being seen at any V break, the manipulation around an impossibility. The only thing that actually matters is what that person actually did say some 9 weeks later and why it was not credible.

The utter hypocrisy, wilful deceit put out to cause harm to other human life, that same kindred spirit, enabler riding on the back of a convicted killer, doing his bidding. NO member of Jodi's family carried that girls coffin, it was the funeral directors. At no point was there any type of identity parade like the real deal where she manipulates this into ' a group of males all dressed the same' or from 'footage where they saw males at different points' to the ultimate 'I am not sure carrying the coffin is accurate'  - Dam right it is not, not that the person did not say this, simply that it was far from accurate, impossible.

To your, and again that reliance to manipulate, banking on what exactly? That people have simply remained mute over the years! That if the truth is brought to light then it must be opposed, cites demanded or some guessing game as to how they know the actual truth. Your blind faith or manipulation of the truth? A neighbour saw Jodi Jones going home one day, walking along the Easthouses road after coming off the school bus, the time was around 4:10pm. A girl who knew Jodi by sight also saw her just after 4pm, just after getting off the school bus on Easthouses road.

NO Jodi Jones identified as walking along the Easthouse's Road around 5pm on the day she died. And as the author clearly states when moving on to her next contradictory point. "There was no evidence whatsoever of the route Jodi took that day" There is good reason for this Faith, for there were NO positive, confirmed sightings of that girl. The girl with the pushchair saw NOTHING, took her time in going forward, for she was NOT there around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003. The high five guy Faith HAD been on that stretch of road, exactly where the person claimed to see them, just NOT around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003.

So a media article, a totally discredited sighting in every sense, has today those arms and legs, that attack upon human life, due to lies and manipulation, of [Name removed] and a claimed photo of him carrying his sisters coffin, a backpack carrying a "whopping big bowie knife" - The deceit, the comedy of errors born from manipulation and reaching its climax with LM's new legal rep! in the shape of Malcolm X.

This is the clear type of people/person that is needed, enablers to carry out all sorts of attacks on behalf of LM - credible! honest! Give over will you.  But as you say, the press did not report on it, so it must be lies! Soaking up every word accurate or not, leading from the sensationalism of a headline to draw the reader in, and still the limited braincells fail to connect!

Conned is the word and Nicholas is spot on with innocence fraud. But please, it you keep bleating out for cites, then why the hell are you even making any type of decision upon this case, with limited resource and pure blind faith, with no proof, no cites, nothing. This case has those spearheading it for a reason, it is not going to gain some review, the only thing that will be picked up upon any support gained, is the tactics, the deception in conning people.

level of intellect and the new group slogan "A Fact a day keeps the false facts away" - I rest my case ;-)

Chris - Really? Do you actually keep up with the hypocrisy around eye witness testimony in this case? Later.

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #56 on: June 07, 2022, 10:16:39 PM »
But there you have, does it matter if you believe anything I may say - Absolutely not. The irony of course that you claim I am spreading disinformation, how could you possibly know that Faith? You don't and I am not.  So this truth, this absolute fact, that LM with Jodi Jones attended a 'gig' mid-June 2003 to see that band. That and again, absolute fact, LM was wearing said coat, never to be seen again from the day of the murder.

The point is that you are spreading misinformation. I have a close relative, rather younger than me, who followed the band you mentioned. There were no gigs mid-June where a stand-in band member was needed…that’s a fact. Having asked I’m told that the band didn’t perform live until much later than you’ve claimed and that their drummer was in place from their formation until 2007 and that he played each and every live gig.


Your ‘nowhere in the media does it say -------' Exactly the point once more, that reliance for manipulation to play around what can be sourced, and banking upon that which one hopes can not be sourced. Intelligent? Over four hours of evidence each day, and isn't it just terrible that the media did not choose to report every word, deciding to put out other news too!

What is interesting is that almost all the information you supply appears to only have been mentioned by you. Not the newspapers, not news reports, no members of forums, in fact no one else but yourself. And are we really meant to believe that there is a secret forum that no one else interested in this case has ever had access to which, handily, has members who were actually at the trial? Really? That is manipulation of course, trouble is you’re not very good at it. 

As to the khaki jacket, all these witnesses testifying about a vital plank of the prosecution’s case and it’s not reported..ANYWHERE?


Absolute fact once more, that even limited intelligence can digest. Now I wonder why the defence did not retain every single word, of every statement they accessed. How much proof of that jacket would serve beneficial to trying to cast doubt about him having one!! In excess of 8 people from different occasions/connection chosen to represent each, from groups of more. One teacher, do you actually believe there was only one who gave a statement of seeing Mitchell in that coat - Of course you don't, not even you are that gullible, surely? Fact again, his closest friend, would NOT and could NOT state they had never seen Mitchell in his lovely 'magic coat'

It’s not what I or you believe but what we can provide evidence for and I’m afraid with you that is more often than not not much. Further surely if Luke had worn his beloved parka as often as suggested then his closest friend would have been in no doubt about its existence. ‘Would not and could not state that he had never seen’ surely is really just saying ‘I could have seen him but I’m not sure’?

The reliance and manipulation of media articles, tabloids included of course. They mystery man, where the author works solely from the information obtained from a newspaper report. Has NOT read any statements from the two independent people, from the time. Guesswork and one big IF of when they MAY have come forward. Statements are dated. The attempt at ripping to shreds the outstanding eye witness testimony, of three people, not one, seeing LM that day in that lovely green khaki coat. To Ms Leans manipulation of an impossible identity made upon a male from Jodi's funeral. Vague she claims this witness was towards the SCCRC, no Faith it is the author who has to be vague, in the same fashion as no bike being seen at any V break, the manipulation around an impossibility. The only thing that actually matters is what that person actually did say some 9 weeks later and why it was not credible.

How many of the original witness statements have you had access to?

The utter hypocrisy, wilful deceit put out to cause harm to other human life, that same kindred spirit, enabler riding on the back of a convicted killer, doing his bidding. NO member of Jodi's family carried that girls coffin, it was the funeral directors. At no point was there any type of identity parade like the real deal where she manipulates this into ' a group of males all dressed the same' or from 'footage where they saw males at different points' to the ultimate 'I am not sure carrying the coffin is accurate'  - Dam right it is not, not that the person did not say this, simply that it was far from accurate, impossible.

Deflection.

To your, and again that reliance to manipulate, banking on what exactly? That people have simply remained mute over the years! That if the truth is brought to light then it must be opposed, cites demanded or some guessing game as to how they know the actual truth. Your blind faith or manipulation of the truth? A neighbour saw Jodi Jones going home one day, walking along the Easthouses road after coming off the school bus, the time was around 4:10pm. A girl who knew Jodi by sight also saw her just after 4pm, just after getting off the school bus on Easthouses road.

NO Jodi Jones identified as walking along the Easthouse's Road around 5pm on the day she died. And as the author clearly states when moving on to her next contradictory point. "There was no evidence whatsoever of the route Jodi took that day" There is good reason for this Faith, for there were NO positive, confirmed sightings of that girl. The girl with the pushchair saw NOTHING, took her time in going forward, for she was NOT there around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003. The high five guy Faith HAD been on that stretch of road, exactly where the person claimed to see them, just NOT around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003.

So a media article, a totally discredited sighting in every sense, has today those arms and legs, that attack upon human life, due to lies and manipulation, of [Name removed] and a claimed photo of him carrying his sisters coffin, a backpack carrying a "whopping big bowie knife" - The deceit, the comedy of errors born from manipulation and reaching its climax with LM's new legal rep! in the shape of Malcolm X.

This is the clear type of people/person that is needed, enablers to carry out all sorts of attacks on behalf of LM - credible! honest! Give over will you.  But as you say, the press did not report on it, so it must be lies! Soaking up every word accurate or not, leading from the sensationalism of a headline to draw the reader in, and still the limited braincells fail to connect!

Conned is the word and Nicholas is spot on with innocence fraud. But please, it you keep bleating out for cites, then why the hell are you even making any type of decision upon this case, with limited resource and pure blind faith, with no proof, no cites, nothing. This case has those spearheading it for a reason, it is not going to gain some review, the only thing that will be picked up upon any support gained, is the tactics, the deception in conning people.

level of intellect and the new group slogan "A Fact a day keeps the false facts away" - I rest my case ;-)

No cites, no proof, just your word. I think it is rather you who demands blind faith.

Chris - Really? Do you actually keep up with the hypocrisy around eye witness testimony in this case? Later.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Myster

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #57 on: June 08, 2022, 07:34:37 AM »
I thought I read that Jodi was "chuffed" to be meeting Luke that afternoon.  That suggests to me that either they did not fight at school or that it was trivial.  The problems within the testimony of AB were also discussed at the International Skeptics Forum under the Luke Mitchell section of the Trials and Errors sub-forum.
Things can change in an instant... especially if they argued about Luke's bit on the side, at their evening tryst.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline faithlilly

Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #58 on: June 08, 2022, 06:23:59 PM »
Things can change in an instant... especially if they argued about Luke's bit on the side, at their evening tryst.

They can but there is no evidence that they did. BTW when did Jodi find out about Luke’s ‘bit on the side’? She was described as upbeat when she left the house.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline mrswah

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Re: "Laughable eyewitness testimony"
« Reply #59 on: June 08, 2022, 11:33:45 PM »
But there you have, does it matter if you believe anything I may say - Absolutely not. The irony of course that you claim I am spreading disinformation, how could you possibly know that Faith? You don't and I am not.  So this truth, this absolute fact, that LM with Jodi Jones attended a 'gig' mid-June 2003 to see that band. That and again, absolute fact, LM was wearing said coat, never to be seen again from the day of the murder.

Your 'nowhere in the media does it say -------' Exactly the point once more, that reliance for manipulation to play around what can be sourced, and banking upon that which one hopes can not be sourced. Intelligent? Over four hours of evidence each day, and isn't it just terrible that the media did not choose to report every word, deciding to put out other news too!

Absolute fact once more, that even limited intelligence can digest. Now I wonder why the defence did not retain every single word, of every statement they accessed. How much proof of that jacket would serve beneficial to trying to cast doubt about him having one!! In excess of 8 people from different occasions/connection chosen to represent each, from groups of more. One teacher, do you actually believe there was only one who gave a statement of seeing Mitchell in that coat - Of course you don't, not even you are that gullible, surely? Fact again, his closest friend, would NOT and could NOT state they had never seen Mitchell in his lovely 'magic coat'

The reliance and manipulation of media articles, tabloids included of course. They mystery man, where the author works solely from the information obtained from a newspaper report. Has NOT read any statements from the two independent people, from the time. Guesswork and one big IF of when they MAY have come forward. Statements are dated. The attempt at ripping to shreds the outstanding eye witness testimony, of three people, not one, seeing LM that day in that lovely green khaki coat. To Ms Leans manipulation of an impossible identity made upon a male from Jodi's funeral. Vague she claims this witness was towards the SCCRC, no Faith it is the author who has to be vague, in the same fashion as no bike being seen at any V break, the manipulation around an impossibility. The only thing that actually matters is what that person actually did say some 9 weeks later and why it was not credible.

The utter hypocrisy, wilful deceit put out to cause harm to other human life, that same kindred spirit, enabler riding on the back of a convicted killer, doing his bidding. NO member of Jodi's family carried that girls coffin, it was the funeral directors. At no point was there any type of identity parade like the real deal where she manipulates this into ' a group of males all dressed the same' or from 'footage where they saw males at different points' to the ultimate 'I am not sure carrying the coffin is accurate'  - Dam right it is not, not that the person did not say this, simply that it was far from accurate, impossible.

To your, and again that reliance to manipulate, banking on what exactly? That people have simply remained mute over the years! That if the truth is brought to light then it must be opposed, cites demanded or some guessing game as to how they know the actual truth. Your blind faith or manipulation of the truth? A neighbour saw Jodi Jones going home one day, walking along the Easthouses road after coming off the school bus, the time was around 4:10pm. A girl who knew Jodi by sight also saw her just after 4pm, just after getting off the school bus on Easthouses road.

NO Jodi Jones identified as walking along the Easthouse's Road around 5pm on the day she died. And as the author clearly states when moving on to her next contradictory point. "There was no evidence whatsoever of the route Jodi took that day" There is good reason for this Faith, for there were NO positive, confirmed sightings of that girl. The girl with the pushchair saw NOTHING, took her time in going forward, for she was NOT there around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003. The high five guy Faith HAD been on that stretch of road, exactly where the person claimed to see them, just NOT around 5pm on the 30th of June 2003.

So a media article, a totally discredited sighting in every sense, has today those arms and legs, that attack upon human life, due to lies and manipulation, of [Name removed] and a claimed photo of him carrying his sisters coffin, a backpack carrying a "whopping big bowie knife" - The deceit, the comedy of errors born from manipulation and reaching its climax with LM's new legal rep! in the shape of Malcolm X.

This is the clear type of people/person that is needed, enablers to carry out all sorts of attacks on behalf of LM - credible! honest! Give over will you.  But as you say, the press did not report on it, so it must be lies! Soaking up every word accurate or not, leading from the sensationalism of a headline to draw the reader in, and still the limited braincells fail to connect!

Conned is the word and Nicholas is spot on with innocence fraud. But please, it you keep bleating out for cites, then why the hell are you even making any type of decision upon this case, with limited resource and pure blind faith, with no proof, no cites, nothing. This case has those spearheading it for a reason, it is not going to gain some review, the only thing that will be picked up upon any support gained, is the tactics, the deception in conning people.

level of intellect and the new group slogan "A Fact a day keeps the false facts away" - I rest my case ;-)

Chris - Really? Do you actually keep up with the hypocrisy around eye witness testimony in this case? Later.



Parky, with all due respect, providing cites and links is part of the forum's rules !!!