Jeremy Corbyn for PM!!

[faithlilly]

See, I told you that you’d rubbish my reply and true to form you did.  What were were we debating again?

I didn’t rubbish it, I countered it with reasons why your post was like comparing apples to eggs. You are, of course, free to counter my post. It’s called debate.

[faithlilly]

Did Corbyn think we were better than Venezuela or did he think Venezuela was a model worth adopting?  Capitalism is not perfect but it works, which is more than can be said for the sort of socialism Jeremy so admires.

Is it worth pointing out that capitalism doesn’t work for those children living in poverty or indeed the working poor whose wages are so low that they have to be subsided by the taxpayer....a socialist solution....or foodbanks...another socialist solution.

It’s interesting that when capitalism doesn’t work and doesn’t meet the basic needs of its citizens it always looks to socialism for a solution.

[faithlilly]

Interesting comment in today’s Times

“Karie Murphy's proposed elevation is deeply offensive, and not only to Jews.  Running Corbyn's office, she was primarily responsible for ensuring that allegations of [ censored word]emitism by valued comrades gathered dust - a deliberate policy decision, including demanding that all such complaints went across her desk first.

A personal friend of Len McCluskey, in 2012 and 2013 she was intimately involved in a vote-rigging scandal, orchestrated by Scottish Unite officials, surrounding her proposed candidacy for the vacant Falkirk seat.  She resigned the candidacy in disgrace and was suspended from the party.  She also failed to be selected as PPC for Halifax in 2015, ending her Parliamentary aspirations for good.

Subsequent evidence emerged (in 2019) suggesting that she had personally forged 39 membership applications in the Falkirk scandal.  (Times report, 3 November 2019).

Corbyn's personal wish to ensure she has a job (which none of his successor candidates will give her) is understandable.  His hypocrisy in using a system of establishment patronage he pretends to despise is sickening.

If Karie Murphy were an honourable person - which she is not - she would not accept a peerage anyway.  Instead she will join Two Jags Prescott on the leather upholstery bemoaning the privilege of the toffs and aristocrats”.

As I said I don’t agree with the HoL but why does Corbyn’s ‘hypocrisy’ or a less pejorative assessment simply using the system that’s in place rankle less than Johnson giving peerages to Goldsmith ( kicked out of his constituency) and Morgan ( resigned) so they can stay in the cabinet or Duncan-Smith who’s disastrous UC has contributed to the deaths of over 100,000 of the UKs most vulnerable citizens ? Why have elections when the ousted can simply be brought back via the back door ? Karrie Murphy is small fry compared to that.

[faithlilly]

Ah yes, I remember.

I wrote re: Corbyn’s performance on dealing with [ censored word]emitism “

“Yes, turned a blind eye, didn’t act fast enough or firmly enough.  Dilly-dallied.  Weak, ineffectual leadership but, hey, this thread is about Boris isn’t it?  I don’t have to deal with anything, Labour do.  Sort it out!!”

you wrote

“Mmmmmm....not according to many Jewish members of the U.K.”

and then presented a list of 200 British Jews who supported Corbyn back in 2018 I believe.

So do those 200 Jews constitute the many, or even the majority of British Jews, or does the information I provided tend to suggest the opposite?

Mmmmm....

As I said the names I posted were members and supporters of the Labour Party, with personal  knowledge of the truthfulness of the claims of [ censored word]emitism within the party. Your polls represent the general Jewish population of the U.K. who have no direct knowledge of the above.

Now whose opinion do you think would be more reliable?

[Venturi Swirl]

As I said the names I posted were members and supporters of the Labour Party, with personal  knowledge of the truthfulness of the claims of [ censored word]emitism within the party. Your polls represent the general Jewish population of the U.K. who have no direct knowledge of the above.

Now whose opinion do you think would be more reliable?

It’s not a simply aquestion of reliability, it’s a also a question of perception.  In any case there were many members and supporters of the Labour Party that left the party or did not vote for it this time because of [ censored word]emitism.  I can’t rustle up 200+ names because as far as I know they didn’t conveniently  all sign one letter, but does that mean that their views and experiences don’t count? 

[Venturi Swirl]

As I said I don’t agree with the HoL but why does Corbyn’s ‘hypocrisy’ or a less pejorative assessment simply using the system that’s in place rankle less than Johnson giving peerages to Goldsmith ( kicked out of his constituency) and Morgan ( resigned) so they can stay in the cabinet or Duncan-Smith who’s disastrous UC has contributed to the deaths of over 100,000 of the UKs most vulnerable citizens ? Why have elections when the ousted can simply be brought back via the back door ? Karrie Murphy is small fry compared to that.

Because we were all lead to believe that St Jeremy, a principled man and one who despises the present politcal system, was above such cronyism and shenanigans.  We expect it of tarts like Boris of course!

[Venturi Swirl]

Is it worth pointing out that capitalism doesn’t work for those children living in poverty or indeed the working poor whose wages are so low that they have to be subsided by the taxpayer....a socialist solution....or foodbanks...another socialist solution.

It’s interesting that when capitalism doesn’t work and doesn’t meet the basic needs of its citizens it always looks to socialism for a solution.

There’s nothing wrong with that.  Caring capitalism is probably the best compromise there is.

[Venturi Swirl]

As I said the names I posted were members and supporters of the Labour Party, with personal  knowledge of the truthfulness of the claims of [ censored word]emitism within the party. Your polls represent the general Jewish population of the U.K. who have no direct knowledge of the above.

Now whose opinion do you think would be more reliable?

Incidentally even John Healey Shadow Housing Secretary agreed with my assesment

Challenged on whether every case of anti-Semitism in Labour was being dealt with, he told the Today programme: "Having been too slow and too weak at the start, the action being taken now has been toughened up

Which is precisely what I said (“turned a blind eye, didn’t act fast enough or firmly enough.  Dilly-dallied.  Weak, ineffectual leadership“), and which you seem unwilling to accept.

[faithlilly]

It’s not a simply aquestion of reliability, it’s a also a question of perception.  In any case there were many members and supporters of the Labour Party that left the party or did not vote for it this time because of [ censored word]emitism.  I can’t rustle up 200+ names because as far as I know they didn’t conveniently  all sign one letter, but does that mean that their views and experiences don’t count?

In what way perception ? There is either a claim, supported by evidence or there is a claim where no evidence has been presented....perception has nothing to do with it.

And no, if you can’t provide empirical evidence of something as serious as [ censored word]emitism, then those you ‘assume’ suffered is not enough.

[Venturi Swirl]

In what way perception ? There is either a claim, supported by evidence or there is a claim where no evidence has been presented....perception has nothing to do with it.

And no, if you can’t provide empirical evidence of something as serious as [ censored word]emitism, then those you ‘assume’ suffered is not enough.

Oh well you win then.  Because I can’t provide 201 names, then [ censored word]emitism does not exist within the Labour Party and was simply invented by Corbyn’s enemies.  Nice one, enjoy your victory.   

[faithlilly]

Because we were all lead to believe that St Jeremy, a principled man and one who despises the present politcal system, was above such cronyism and shenanigans.  We expect it of tarts like Boris of course!

Were we all lead to believe that ? By whom ?

[faithlilly]

There’s nothing wrong with that.  Caring capitalism is probably the best compromise there is.

So ‘caring capitalism ‘ is one in five children living in poverty, is it ? Or your nan lying in her own urine for hours due to the cuts in social care ? Or nurses being taught ‘ corridor medicine’ because so many patients are treated there ? That kind of ‘ caring capitalism ‘ ?

[Venturi Swirl]

Were we all lead to believe that ? By whom ?

By him and his supporters of course!  You’re always telling us about what a principled man he is aren’t you?

[Venturi Swirl]

So ‘caring capitalism ‘ is one in five children living in poverty, is it ? Or your nan lying in her own urine for hours due to the cuts in social care ? Or nurses being taught ‘ corridor medicine’ because so many patients are treated there ? That kind of ‘ caring capitalism ‘ ?

Oh please Faithlilly, spare me the sanctimonious, emotive claptrap. 

[faithlilly]

Incidentally even John Healey Shadow Housing Secretary agreed with my assesment

Challenged on whether every case of anti-Semitism in Labour was being dealt with, he told the Today programme: "Having been too slow and too weak at the start, the action being taken now has been toughened up

Which is precisely what I said (“turned a blind eye, didn’t act fast enough or firmly enough.  Dilly-dallied.  Weak, ineffectual leadership“), and which you seem unwilling to accept.

Which begs the question...when was the start ? After this ?

“‘Actress Maureen Lipman meanwhile reiterated her opposition to Mr Miliband, accusing him of “pandering to [ censored word]emitism masking as anti-Zionism”.