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Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: Robittybob1 on March 21, 2017, 06:16:34 AM
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Definitive study of the timeline and the relationship between the various things that have happened to the McCanns.
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You may like to read this thread;
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7137.0
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You may like to read this thread;
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7137.0
Just had a quick look at it and it seems more on focusing at what happened that day. I was looking for the times we discussed the other day
Date of the archiving
Date of Goncalo's book and things like that (major events over the next ten years).
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Just had a quick look at it and it seems more on focusing at what happened that day. I was looking for the times we discussed the other day
Date of the archiving
Date of Goncalo's book and things like that (major events over the next ten years).
Oh, sorry. I see 'timeline' and go for the obvious one.
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Found this while browsing.
http://newsoutlines.blogspot.co.uk/2010/11/timeline-maddie-truth-of-lie.html
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Amaral retires 30th June 2008
Archiving 21st July 2008
Book published 24th July 2008.
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Amaral retires 30th June 2008
Archiving 21st July 2008
Book published 24th July 2008.
"Amaral sold the copyright of the book to the publishers in March 2008, at which time he was still a serving officer. I do not understand how the SC court could keep referencing the final report which had not even been written at that time." http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8030.msg391932#msg391932
So if the copyright is sold one would imagine the text of the book has already been written and shared, therefore the defamation and damages start from then rather than the date the book gets published.
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"Amaral sold the copyright of the book to the publishers in March 2008, at which time he was still a serving officer. I do not understand how the SC court could keep referencing the final report which had not even been written at that time." http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8030.msg391932#msg391932
So if the copyright is sold one would imagine the text of the book has already been written and shared, therefore the defamation and damages start from then rather than the date the book gets published.
Which is more or less why the first instance judge found in the McCanns' favour. The Appeal judges rejected her argument, however;
In effect, and independently of the reasons invoked by the appellant for the publication, it is hardly understandable that an employee, even more a retired one, would have to keep said duties of secrecy and reserve, thus being limited in the exercise of his right to an opinion, concerning the interpretation of facts that were already made public by the judiciary authority, and widely debated (in fact, largely by initiative of the intervenients themselves) in the national and international media.
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7153.0
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"Amaral sold the copyright of the book to the publishers in March 2008, at which time he was still a serving officer. I do not understand how the SC court could keep referencing the final report which had not even been written at that time." http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8030.msg391932#msg391932
So if the copyright is sold one would imagine the text of the book has already been written and shared, therefore the defamation and damages start from then rather than the date the book gets published.
1 So?
2 The significant date will be when the book entered the public domain ie the publishing date.
The two relevant dates are:
The date when PJ case documents entered the publice domain.
The date when Sr Amaral's book entered the public domain.
Public domain = the state of belonging or being available to the public as a whole, especially through not being subject to copyright or other legal restrictions. ie if you ask for it you may have it subject to any rules surrounding that such as you may have pay for it or wait until someone has copied it.
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Which is more or less why the first instance judge found in the McCanns' favour. The Appeal judges rejected her argument, however;
In effect, and independently of the reasons invoked by the appellant for the publication, it is hardly understandable that an employee, even more a retired one, would have to keep said duties of secrecy and reserve, thus being limited in the exercise of his right to an opinion, concerning the interpretation of facts that were already made public by the judiciary authority, and widely debated (in fact, largely by initiative of the intervenients themselves) in the national and international media.
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7153.0
Well that just goes to show you how wrong the SC judges were doesn't it. When Amaral wrote his book he was not retired, and hence he was under the rule "Duty of Reserve". The fact were not made public at the time he wrote his book. The statements about " concerning the interpretation of facts that were already made public by the judiciary authority, and widely debated (in fact, largely by initiative of the intervenients themselves) in the national and international media" were not evidenced in any way.
1 So?
2 The significant date will be when the book entered the public domain ie the publishing date.
The two relevant dates are:
The date when PJ case documents entered the publice domain.
The date when Sr Amaral's book entered the public domain.
Public domain = the state of belonging or being available to the public as a whole, especially through not being subject to copyright or other legal restrictions. ie if you ask for it you may have it subject to any rules surrounding that such as you may have pay for it or wait until someone has copied it.
You can say "public domain" but it doesn't have to be in public for defamation to occur.
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Well that just goes to show you how wrong the SC judges were doesn't it. When Amaral wrote his book he was not retired, and hence he was under the rule "Duty of Reserve". The fact were not made public at the time he wrote his book. The statements about " concerning the interpretation of facts that were already made public by the judiciary authority, and widely debated (in fact, largely by initiative of the intervenients themselves) in the national and international media" were not evidenced in any way.
You can say "public domain" but it doesn't have to be in public for defamation to occur.
You seem to be confusing "write" with "publish".
Anyway the case is now done , dusted and filed.
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You seem to be confusing "write" with "publish".
Anyway the case is now done , dusted and filed.
I really meant read what he wrote. Probably no issue writing the book but a problem occurs when another reads it.
The case is not over yet.
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I really meant read what he wrote. Probably no issue writing the book but a problem occurs when another reads it.
The case is not over yet.
I rather think you will discover the McCann v Amaral "libel case" to be over.
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I rather think you will discover the McCann v Amaral "libel case" to be over.
Are you predicting the McCanns wont go to the ECHR?
If the McCanns can get some victory there and some compensation from Portugal that might make them feel it is over.
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I really meant read what he wrote. Probably no issue writing the book but a problem occurs when another reads it.
The case is not over yet.
When did the first person read the manuscript of the book Amaral wrote? That is a date I want in my timeline.
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Are you predicting the McCanns wont go to the ECHR?
If the McCanns can get some victory there and some compensation from Portugal that might make them feel it is over.
They have no guarantee of victory and even if it were to come about it could almost a decade in the future.
In the meantime the McCann v Amaral case is over.
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It would be useful Rob if you introduced an index within your opening post and update it as events are noted.
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Are you predicting the McCanns wont go to the ECHR?
If the McCanns can get some victory there and some compensation from Portugal that might make them feel it is over.
I am not predicting anything. Whatever happens in the ECHR, should matters proceed that far, is irrelevant to the outcome of teh case just tried. That case is over and closed.
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When did the first person read the manuscript of the book Amaral wrote? That is a date I want in my timeline.
How do you propose to find that date?
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I am not predicting anything. Whatever happens in the ECHR, should matters proceed that far, is irrelevant to the outcome of teh case just tried. That case is over and closed.
It sure is a struggle to get this message across. Almost as if people have their fingers in their ears.
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It sure is a struggle to get this message across. Almost as if people have their fingers in their ears.
The McCann's supporters have invested much time and effort attacking Amaral and his thesis, accusing others of 'being fooled' by 'Amaral's lies' and predicting his downfall in the libel trial. I expect it will take time to sink in that;
Amaral's thesis is as valid as the McCann's thesis.
People didn't question the McCann's thesis because of what Amaral wrote in his book.
It was the downfall of the McCanns which occurred, not that of Amaral.
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Publish from Old French puplier, from Latin pūblicāre to make public.
Libel is a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation.
So it didn't matter until it was published.
Before the usual suspects start, Amaral's book was about what the Investigation thought not the guilt or innocence of anyone. Hence they were not false statements.
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The McCann's supporters have invested much time and effort attacking Amaral and his thesis, accusing others of 'being fooled' by 'Amaral's lies' and predicting his downfall in the libel trial. I expect it will take time to sink in that;
Amaral's thesis is as valid as the McCann's thesis.
People didn't question the McCann's thesis because of what Amaral wrote in his book.
It was the downfall of the McCanns which occurred, not that of Amaral.
Indeed, and to no avail. All that time and effort completely wasted.
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It would be useful Rob if you introduced an index within your opening post and update it as events are noted.
I was wondering how to handle this aspect. Thanks John.
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Publish from Old French puplier, from Latin pūblicāre to make public.
Libel is a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation.
So it didn't matter until it was published.
Before the usual suspects start, Amaral's book was about what the Investigation thought not the guilt or innocence of anyone. Hence they were not false statements.
Has he found a publisher willing to publish and distribute his theory in the UK?
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Indeed, and to no avail. All that time and effort completely wasted.
Not when Madeleine is finally found it won't be.
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Publish from Old French puplier, from Latin pūblicāre to make public.
Libel is a published false statement that is damaging to a person's reputation.
So it didn't matter until it was published.
Before the usual suspects start, Amaral's book was about what the Investigation thought not the guilt or innocence of anyone. Hence they were not false statements.
"Libel is a written or published defamatory statement, ...." written or published. To me that means as soon as it is written it is a problem, and really it is only known to have been written if someone has read it.
So as soon as the first person reads Amaral's book we know it is definitely written, the publishing of it occurs later and intensifies the libel.
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Has he found a publisher willing to publish and distribute his theory in the UK?
Absolutely no chance. And no British publisher would take it on anyway when it would only be bought by a hard core pocket of really nasty people. There is no profit in this.
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Not when Madeleine is finally found it won't be.
What happens if she is never found Rob ?
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What happens if she is never found Rob ?
It will all be much more interesting if she is.
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Please note the thread title is
Re: The timeline and events following Madeleine McCann's disappearance.
Any post which doesn't bear a passing resemblance to that is going to be deleted. Thank you.
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From G-unit http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=5764.msg398838#msg398838
"Around 27th August the McCanns decided they would be leaving Portugal on September 10th. The PJ were still waiting for the FSS final report. On 3rd September Paiva informed them when they would be questioned. On 4th September the FSS sent an e-mail to Stuart Prior with inconclusive results. The PJ now had 5 days before the McCanns left and not enough evidence. They went for it because it was their only chance. The result was that the McCanns fled Portugal on 9th September with the permission of Encarnacao and Neves; the men in charge.
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From http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/madeleine-mccann-case-missing-abduction-australian-documentary-tv-team-uncovered-sensational-new-a7694921.html:
"Mr Amaral was removed from the investigation after criticising British detectives, but in July 2008 he published a book, The Truth of the Lie, in which he claimed the McCanns faked the abduction of their daughter after she died in the family’s holiday apartment.
Three days after the book came out, Kate and Gerry McCann were officially told they were no longer regarded as formal suspects in the case.
Seeking to have the book banned, the McCanns won an initial libel case against Mr Amaral in 2015, but his was overturned on appeal in a judgement that reportedly left Madeleine’s parents “seething”.
Their lawyer described the appeal decision as “an appreciation of the law and not the facts”, but in January of this year Portugal’s supreme court ruled again in the ex-detective’s favour."
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A very extensive timeline has been created
"Thursday, 25 August 2016
JULY/AUGUST/SEPTEMBER 2007
This may all seem a bit boring, but there is an underlying pattern...
Thursday July 12th: Gerry flies to London to meet with the British police. At night he attends the National Police Federation Annual Bravery awards and receives a standing ovation.
(for what exactly isn't clear - the event was organized by The Sun newspaper.)
Friday 13th July: Gerry spends a large part of the day at the Child Exploitation and Online Protection (CEOP) to learn more about their role. (Possibly this was the occasion when he obtained the books and manuals intended exclusively for police services and government agencies.) see 1)
Saturday 14th July: Gerry, Kate and the twins as well as assorted family attend a baptism (see The third trip home post).
Monday 16th July: J.K. Rowling follows up her offer of a large reward by asking all retailers of her new book to display a new poster of Madeleine. (However: the Daily Telegraph on the 4th June reported: 'JK Rowling is considering putting bookmarks bearing the face of Madeleine McCann in copies of her final installment [..] Rowling has already publicly supported the campaign by contributing to a multi-million pound reward [..] Mr. McCann said: 'There has been some indirect contact with her. We are thinking about getting bookmarks with Madeleine's photographs and getting the author's agreement.' (It's clear from the article that there was no direct contact between the writer and the McCanns and that it is possible that J.K. Rowling - six weeks later - asked for posters to be exhibited by the outlets - a step or two down from the millions of bookmarks envisaged and indeed promoted without apparently having consulted the author - a recurring theme in the tactics of Team McCann, but it is interesting that most celebrities only performed once. J.K. Rowling publicly denied her involvement in the writing of Kate's book. )
22nd to the 26th July: Gerry is in the USA, Kate does/doesn't have her dream and Gerry gets lost on the way home. (see: The Triangle and Kate's dream post)
Monday 30th July: Kate and Gerry have a 'routine meeting' with Portugese police.
Tuesday 31st July: The dogs arrive: http://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DOGS INSPECTION.HTM
Wednesday 1st August: Gerry makes a trip to the airport to pick up their Campaign Manager. (The rarely mentioned Justine McGuinness) Family friend and film producer, Jon Corner arrives to film promotional material for the official website.
Thursday 2nd August: Gerry is laid low with a viral illness forcing them to cancel a planned trip to Huelva in Spain. 2) (After a swift recovery, they make an early start on the 3rd of August - see link).
Tuesday 7th August: Samples of trace evidence are sent to Forensic Science Service laboratory in Birmingham for analysis.
Thursday 16th August: Timesonline reports : Traces of blood discovered in the bedroom [..] do not come from the missing girl, the Times has learnt. The conclusion that the blood came from a man follows two weeks of reports that the traces proved that Madeleine had been killed [..] Mr. Sousa confirmed that one of the dogs had found a scent indicating that a corpse had been in the apartment. '
(it's clear that there must have been leaks from various sources and - always bearing in mind the relationship between the press and the McCanns (see other posts here) - not exactly correct in their assumptions.)
Monday 27th August: Kate and Gerry manage an early evening run before spending some 10 minutes in the church to pray for Madeleine.
Tuesday 28th August: Kate and Gerry await the results of the forensics from the recent searches. (As there clearly were leaks previous to this date, it is likely that they already had some idea of what was found.)
Friday 31st August: The McCanns launch a libel action against Porguguese newspaper Tal & Qual which claimed that the police believe they killed their daughter. Gerry states in his blog that the legal expenses for the proceedings will not be paid for from the Madeleine Fund.
Saturday 1st September: Portuguese police receive 'significant'results from forensic tests carried out in Britain. Sources say a key piece of DNA was found in 'an area where it should not have been'.
Monday 3rd September: Gerry is contacted by Portuguese police and told that both he and Kate will be required for further questioning.
Wednesday 5th September: Gerry writes in his blog that he is 'surprised to find increased media presence in Praia da Luz again today..' At lunchtime Kate and Gerry go for a run along the coast.
Thursday 6th September:Sunday Mirror - Madeleine: DNA is found .........
(More to follow after September 6th 2016 - and many thanks to mccannfiles.com for all the information so easily available there. ) Saved at http://fytton.blogspot.co.nz/2016_08_01_archive.html?m=0
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Have a great bank holiday weekend! 8((()*/