Sadie's theory, the watcher and a getaway car.

[Alice Purjorick]

Without being bothered to check it out, Robitty, how many of the statements of the people who volunteered the information that they were driving that night was corroborated by others?
I can't think of any.  Which suggests to me that persons interviewed weren't asked about traffic movement or parked vehicles.  I think it is unrealistic to assume that there was no vehicular movement in Luz within the timescale of, for the sake of argument 2100 to 2230.
I think only two witnesses mentioned parked vehicles.  There is no CCTV of vehicle movement either within the environs of Luz or further afield apart from service stations.

In my opinion the investigation neglected to tie in Madeleine's disappearance with the possibility she had been transferred to a vehicle and driven as far away and as quickly as possible from Luz.

In my opinion Sadie's theory rectifies that omission by including the possibility, perhaps even the probability that there was a waiting vehicle nearby in which it was intended to move Madeleine.

On what basis do you form that opinion ?

[pathfinder73]

Without being bothered to check it out, Robitty, how many of the statements of the people who volunteered the information that they were driving that night was corroborated by others?
I can't think of any.  Which suggests to me that persons interviewed weren't asked about traffic movement or parked vehicles.  I think it is unrealistic to assume that there was no vehicular movement in Luz within the timescale of, for the sake of argument 2100 to 2230.
I think only two witnesses mentioned parked vehicles.  There is no CCTV of vehicle movement either within the environs of Luz or further afield apart from service stations.

In my opinion the investigation neglected to tie in Madeleine's disappearance with the possibility she had been transferred to a vehicle and driven as far away and as quickly as possible from Luz.

In my opinion Sadie's theory rectifies that omission by including the possibility, perhaps even the probability that there was a waiting vehicle nearby in which it was intended to move Madeleine.

Nonsense. Of course the PJ investigated for a getaway vehicle in a possible kidnapping! They found no evidence. Smithman used his feet.

"In the same way he relates never to have perceived suspicious movements undertaken by any motor vehicles in the vicinity of the resort where they were lodged.

by the way, he relates never to have perceived the presence of a blue light motor vehicle in the vicinity of the Ocean Club Garden." http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MATTHEW-OLDFIELD-10MAY.htm

While he maintained the conversation with JEZ he saw no-one from the group, nor detected any suspicious individual or vehicle. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-10MAY.htm

[G-Unit]

What happens if you put their driving times in too?
Jenny Murat. - too early
Hayley May Crawford  - 21H00 a bit early
Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja - Suspicious
Maria Manuela Martins da Silva - too late

I'm saying there would be others.

[G-Unit]

Without being bothered to check it out, Robitty, how many of the statements of the people who volunteered the information that they were driving that night was corroborated by others?
I can't think of any.  Which suggests to me that persons interviewed weren't asked about traffic movement or parked vehicles.  I think it is unrealistic to assume that there was no vehicular movement in Luz within the timescale of, for the sake of argument 2100 to 2230.
I think only two witnesses mentioned parked vehicles.  There is no CCTV of vehicle movement either within the environs of Luz or further afield apart from service stations.

In my opinion the investigation neglected to tie in Madeleine's disappearance with the possibility she had been transferred to a vehicle and driven as far away and as quickly as possible from Luz.

In my opinion Sadie's theory rectifies that omission by including the possibility, perhaps even the probability that there was a waiting vehicle nearby in which it was intended to move Madeleine.

Without evidence that Sadie's vehicle existed it rectifies nothing. It's an imaginary vehicle.

[John]

If there was an abduction, and lets be honest, there is no evidence whatsoever to support one, a getaway car would be essential.  That would of course degrade the Smith sighting to nothing more than an innocent local going about his business.

[barrier]

If there was an abduction, and lets be honest, there is no evidence whatsoever to support one, a getaway car would be essential.  That would of course degrade the Smith sighting to nothing more than an innocent local going about his business.

We've had no revelation moment to eliminate him,still to be found imo.

[Eleanor]

Without evidence that Sadie's vehicle existed it rectifies nothing. It's an imaginary vehicle.

In Your Opinion.  Let's be clear about that.

I am getting very tired of your pronouncements.

[faithlilly]

In Your Opinion.  Let's be clear about that.

I am getting very tired of your pronouncements.

That's not an opinion, that's what those of us intelligent enough to recognise it call a fact.

[G-Unit]

In Your Opinion.  Let's be clear about that.

I am getting very tired of your pronouncements.

Please feel free to point me to the evidence that there was a getaway vehicle in the car park south of block 5 and I will retract my pronouncement and apologise.

[Brietta]

Nonsense. Of course the PJ investigated for a getaway vehicle in a possible kidnapping! They found no evidence. Smithman used his feet.

"In the same way he relates never to have perceived suspicious movements undertaken by any motor vehicles in the vicinity of the resort where they were lodged.

by the way, he relates never to have perceived the presence of a blue light motor vehicle in the vicinity of the Ocean Club Garden." http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MATTHEW-OLDFIELD-10MAY.htm

While he maintained the conversation with JEZ he saw no-one from the group, nor detected any suspicious individual or vehicle. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/GERRY-MCCANN-10MAY.htm

A flaw I have noticed in your argument is that the Policia Judiciaria did not know that 'Smithman' existed, for the simple reason the Smiths hadn't linked Madeleine's disappearance with the man they saw on the third and didn't report it to the police until a fortnight later.

Excellent research though which highlights that neither Matt or Gerry noticed any vehicles in the vicinity which raised any worries as far as they were concerned ... but with respect, they were not the only individuals abroad who might have noticed something amiss.

[Alice Purjorick]

If there was an abduction, and lets be honest, there is no evidence whatsoever to support one, a getaway car would be essential.  That would of course degrade the Smith sighting to nothing more than an innocent local going about his business.

Yup! and parking it, metaphorically, a tuppenny bus ride away from the scene of the event makes really good sense dunnit? Leave the most vulnerable operative exposed more than necessary? Did someone have it in for him I wonder ?.

[Brietta]

. After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment;

She declares further that she mentioned this fact to her boyfriend and that it wasn't yet summer given the movement on the roads, and at that hour movement was nill;

. States that she looked at the exit of the apartment and that from the flat above the McCanns, she saw light, and also in from of the apartment, but she could not define, concretely, where she saw the light when she passed the McCann apartment;

. Next to the tree, she did not detect any movement of people or vehicles, and nothing struck her as abnormal in that zone that would have raised her suspicions;
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm


At least one vehicle left the Block six parking area before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing from her bed.  No-one noticed either its departure or the route it took.

If one vehicle moved without comment from the area designated in Sadie's theory, in my opinion it is not outwith the bounds of possibility there could well have been others.

I think Sadie's theory is workable and so far I've seen no valid argument which debunks that.

[misty]

. After leaving Block 6, they turned right and after left, passing in front of the block occupied by the McCanns. She states that she saw no movement of people, and that in the immediate areas of the blocks she saw no vehicle with the exception of a small car, that appeared to her grey in colour, parked close to the window of the McCann apartment;

She declares further that she mentioned this fact to her boyfriend and that it wasn't yet summer given the movement on the roads, and at that hour movement was nill;

. States that she looked at the exit of the apartment and that from the flat above the McCanns, she saw light, and also in from of the apartment, but she could not define, concretely, where she saw the light when she passed the McCann apartment;

. Next to the tree, she did not detect any movement of people or vehicles, and nothing struck her as abnormal in that zone that would have raised her suspicions;
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm


At least one vehicle left the Block six parking area before the alarm was raised that Madeleine was missing from her bed.  No-one noticed either its departure or the route it took.

If one vehicle moved without comment from the area designated in Sadie's theory, in my opinion it is not outwith the bounds of possibility there could well have been others.

I think Sadie's theory is workable and so far I've seen no valid argument which debunks that.

In Sadie's theory, at least 3 people would have been required - a watcher, an abductor & a getaway driver. A watcher would have had no quick route from the upper north balcony in Block 6 to the south car park. IMO.

[pathfinder73]

A flaw I have noticed in your argument is that the Policia Judiciaria did not know that 'Smithman' existed, for the simple reason the Smiths hadn't linked Madeleine's disappearance with the man they saw on the third and didn't report it to the police until a fortnight later.

Excellent research though which highlights that neither Matt or Gerry noticed any vehicles in the vicinity which raised any worries as far as they were concerned ... but with respect, they were not the only individuals abroad who might have noticed something amiss.

You can add Jane, Russell and Jez to that list. No getaway car. No sounds. Mrs Fenn heard nothing from below. Nothing unusual for Matt on two checks within 30 minutes. Moyes on the balcony heard nothing. Maybe there was nothing to hear ? Yes the simple explanation leads you to the truth! They know all about Smithman now.

[Brietta]

In Sadie's theory, at least 3 people would have been required - a watcher, an abductor & a getaway driver. A watcher would have had no quick route from the upper north balcony in Block 6 to the south car park. IMO.

Agreed.  Once his/her function was complete I don't think there would be any necessity to liaise in the car park.  I think the person would just fade into the darkness either to take up his/her daily routine without interruption or if leaving town, to meet at a nearby prearranged location on the chosen escape route.