Former Portuguese detective Gonçalo Amaral wins appeal in damages trial.

[stephen25000]

I have no issue with people querying the judgment.

Amaral's ability to publish, taking into account his prior position as head of the investigation, seems very odd to me.  But if he has broken any laws or regulations, I would expect to see someone other than the McCanns bringing him to task on this.

Have you read the following ?

http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2010/10/lisbon-appeals-court-ruling.html

[Mr Gray]

I think the whole judgement is odd. This case is not closed yet. What the court has done is given carte blanche to a police officer to make public statements abut an unsolved case. If the McCanns were ever arrested and tried in portugal how would this affect their chance of a  fair trial...tin pot justice...imo...but that is what we have come to expect from portugal...again imo

[jassi]

I think the whole judgement is odd. This case is not closed yet. What the court has done is given carte blanche to a police officer to make public statements abut an unsolved case. If the McCanns were ever arrested and tried in portugal how would this affect their chance of a  fair trial...tin pot justice...imo...but that is what we have come to expect from portugal...again imo

If this were to happen, it would be a criminal case, possibly without a jury, so any civil action and findings should have little influence on the decisions made by the judges involved.

[Benice]

they never did take personal responsibility for  whatever did happen   on that holiday did they  ie they never  told parents dont leave children alone etc

Are you being serious?   What would you have said if they had said to the public  'don't leave your children alone'.  Would you and all other sceptics be praising them for doing that -  or pointing out that you didn't need that advice in the first place and what a damn cheek they had for suggesting that you did?   Do tell.

After knowing what happened to Madeleine, any parent with reasonable intelligence could work it out for themselves that leaving children alone on holiday posed dangers which they may not have previously considered.   

 Prior to Madeleine's case  -the last child to be abducted abroad was Ben Needham 16 years before.   I doubt if that was uppermost in the McCanns or any other  holidaymakers minds when they were deciding what childcare arrangements they were going to make whilst they went for their evening meal. 

Those parents who ignored what happened to Madeleine and continued to sign on to listening services and use baby alarms whilst on holiday are far more deserving of criticism that the McCanns ever were IMO.

[Brietta]

Do you think a policeman isn't going to reconstruct Jane Tanner's statement of the route the man took?

You need a lot more than what one journalist thinks to make somebody a formal suspect.

I totally agree ... but that was not the context of the discussion regarding whose nose first started twitching in Robert Murat's direction and how awful Kate McCann was reported to have been about him in a confidential document the PJ were barred from reading ~ let alone leak to the press.

As you posted earlier ...

...
I am about to make enquiries of the police officer on duty when the individual comes back from his walk and greets him as he passes.

- You know that man?

- Yes, he presented himself to the GNR on Friday morning and offered his services as an interpreter. He is of English origin but speaks good Portuguese. He's called Robert Murat.

As the law demands, all foreign people interviewed by the police must have the benefit of an interpreter. In this investigation, the considerable number of interviews we had to conduct in record time forced us to call on the services of volunteers.

- And this guy, you checked him out? No criminal record or trouble with the law?

- No, no, it's all OK, but I didn't know he lived here. It's true that his house is on the route taken by the abductor.

...

I immediately telephone the team to alert them. The Director of the Department of Criminal Investigation in Faro has to be involved in a meeting the same morning, where we will discuss the case of Robert Murat.

...

His behaviour starts to seriously intrigue us. He often makes reference to similar cases that happened in the United Kingdom and which he seems to know in detail. He displays suspicious curiosity and seeks to know more. He offers to help us identify possible suspects. He knows the workings of the Ocean Club and the habits of the holiday-makers very well. He even, allegedly, tried secretly to access the investigation files. ...

...

If it's him that's holding Madeleine, we must monitor all his contacts and places he has access to.


I've absolutely no problem whatsoever with a police officer doing his job.  My problem is if he's not very good at it and once something checks out move on to the next logical step, and stop clutching at straws.

My other problem is that in Portugal he is free to use his freedom of expression to organise a kangaroo court with innocent people as his target.

If he had only labelled his book as the work of fiction it obviously is everyone could have been saved a great deal of trouble. 

One person's freedom of expression supersedes another's right to a good name (I think that appears in the Portuguese constitution ~ the good name bit) and not to be traduced and libelled.
I can't quite make sense of that ... have the appeal judges just rewritten the constitution?

{Brietta - I have shortened the extract of TOTL, but I think the meaning of your post has been preserved.  SIL}

[Brietta]

I have no expertise in the relevant parts of Portuguese law.  I have no expertise in Article 6 (2) of the ECHR. And I have not seen the full judgement.

So I am not in a position to state whether the relevant sections are in accordance with Art 6 (2) or not.

If the McCanns' lawyer thinks Art 6 (2) has been breached, she does not appear to be saying so in public.

Personally, I will simply wait to see what develops.

I don't think there is anything else to do but await developments.

I do not have the exact wording of the original damages award ... however it was found that Goncalo Amaral had denied the McCanns the presumption of innocence ... the appeal court judges did not uphold that.

I await with interest more learned opinions than mine on that ruling.  As a layman ... that is mine.

[ShiningInLuz]

MOD NOTE  After an improvement, things seem to have gotten worse.

1.  Please do not post large slabs of TOTL.  The chapters in that book are short, and long excerpts could lead to copyright issues, and possibly other issues if the latest decision were to be challenged and overturned.

2.  People in real life, on here as members, and elsewhere as it so happens, have the right to be treated with respect, whether they hold the same view as you or not.

I have just deleted a whole swathe of posts that constitute personal attacks on the McCanns, Mr Amaral, Clarence Mitchell, and quite a number of posters on this forum.

You can express your opinion freely without resorting to such attacks.  In the event that you consider a post to break the rules, please flag it but do not otherwise respond to it.  Or please just leave it and give me some time to catch up on the backlog of posts, and I will delete or modify as necessary.

Kindly settle down a bit.  I'm getting to the stage where it might be easier to find out how to award naughty points.

If you stick within the forum rules, your post stays as you posted it.  If you breach the rules, it doesn't.

Thanks.

[pegasus]

(snip) This case is not closed yet (snip)

if Duarte does not file a supreme court appeal within 30 days, this particular private legal case will be closed.

[Mr Gray]

if Duarte does not file a supreme court appeal within 30 days, this particular private legal case will be closed.

I was referring to the investigation into maddie's disappearance. If amaral really thinks the parents are involved what has his book done to the  chances of them getting a fair trial.

[Brietta]

MOD NOTE  After an improvement, things seem to have gotten worse.

1.  Please do not post large slabs of TOTL.  The chapters in that book are short, and long excerpts could lead to copyright issues, and possibly other issues if the latest decision were to be challenged and overturned.

2.  People in real life, on here as members, and elsewhere as it so happens, have the right to be treated with respect, whether they hold the same view as you or not.

I have just deleted a whole swathe of posts that constitute personal attacks on the McCanns, Mr Amaral, Clarence Mitchell, and quite a number of posters on this forum.

You can express your opinion freely without resorting to such attacks.  In the event that you consider a post to break the rules, please flag it but do not otherwise respond to it.  Or please just leave it and give me some time to catch up on the backlog of posts, and I will delete or modify as necessary.

Kindly settle down a bit.  I'm getting to the stage where it might be easier to find out how to award naughty points.

If you stick within the forum rules, your post stays as you posted it.  If you breach the rules, it doesn't.

Thanks.

  A timely warning indeed, Shining  ... Mr Amaral will be anxious to exploit his opportunity and won't take kindly to anything which might affect that ... which includes free distribution his instrument of freedom of expression.

McCanns threaten “anyone selling Amaral’s book in UK” with legal action

Negotiating with his publishers today, the former detective confirmed to the Resident that “what the McCanns are doing is illegal. I am in talks with my publishers for a book in the English language, as there is as yet no publisher in the UK, the USA, Australia, New Zealand - not even Amazon - that is selling it.

"The McCanns will learn to respect the right to opinion and freedom of expression”, he added - stressing that “any version” of Truth of the Lie in English that can be found on the Internet is also illegal, as neither he nor Guerra e Paz publishers have given their authorisation to translations.

http://portugalresident.com/mccanns-threaten-%E2%80%9Canyone-selling-amaral%E2%80%99s-book-in-uk%E2%80%9D-with-legal-action#sthash.VtGeRWhF.SSnyhqxi.dpuf

[jassi]

I should think that publishing is easy in this digital age, it's getting the book distributed and sold that is the problem.

I suppose on-line purchase from outside of UK, followed by download in one of a number of formats would be legal, as would placing adverts for the book in UK papers.

[Alice Purjorick]

I was referring to the investigation into maddie's disappearance. If amaral really thinks the parents are involved what has his book done to the  chances of them getting a fair trial.

That could in part be ameliorated by Portugal allowing any case to be tried in England and Wales, which would be permissible.

[Eleanor]

That could in part be ameliorated by Portugal allowing any case to be tried in England and Wales, which would be permissible.

But it won't be.

[Benice]

  A timely warning indeed, Shining  ... Mr Amaral will be anxious to exploit his opportunity and won't take kindly to anything which might affect that ... which includes free distribution his instrument of freedom of expression.

McCanns threaten “anyone selling Amaral’s book in UK” with legal action

Negotiating with his publishers today, the former detective confirmed to the Resident that “what the McCanns are doing is illegal. I am in talks with my publishers for a book in the English language, as there is as yet no publisher in the UK, the USA, Australia, New Zealand - not even Amazon - that is selling it.

"The McCanns will learn to respect the right to opinion and freedom of expression”, he added - stressing that “any version” of Truth of the Lie in English that can be found on the Internet is also illegal, as neither he nor Guerra e Paz publishers have given their authorisation to translations.

http://portugalresident.com/mccanns-threaten-%E2%80%9Canyone-selling-amaral%E2%80%99s-book-in-uk%E2%80%9D-with-legal-action#sthash.VtGeRWhF.SSnyhqxi.dpuf

So where does that leave his supporters who have spent years giving out the link to his 'illegally'  translated book  - encouraging and enabling potentially millions of people on the internet to 'illegally' read it for free and so depriving him of  income from it?

He's obviously not at all happy with those actions by his own supporters.

[Alice Purjorick]

So where does that leave his supporters who have spent years giving out the link to his 'illegally'  translated book  - encouraging and enabling potentially millions of people on the internet to 'illegally' read it for free and so depriving him of  income from it?

He's obviously not at all happy with those actions by his own supporters.

Needs must when the devil drives (what ever that means).
Now he can enforce his intellectual property rights he would be daft not to. He could of course do it as a polite request to his supporters and then go horse foot and guns for the others. I know what I would do. Best if some "supporters" catch the last train to the coast I would think.......................