Author Topic: Wandering Off Topic  (Read 1465028 times)

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Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #255 on: April 06, 2016, 06:54:46 PM »
What an awfully sad case that was in Paisley Brietta I had not seen it before.
The discovery was made by grandparents who then called police.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2016, 06:59:23 PM by pegasus »

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #256 on: April 06, 2016, 06:56:21 PM »
It has happened in many other cases Brietta..
Where on earth do you think she was in the apartment then, when it was searched by the McCanns, their friends and police officers?  And is she there still in your view??

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #257 on: April 06, 2016, 07:13:40 PM »
Where on earth do you think she was in the apartment then, when it was searched by the McCanns, their friends and police officers?  And is she there still in your view??
The 10.00pm onwards inside search by a few people was incomplete and assumed an awake child.
The 11.15pm inside search by one GNR officer was incomplete and assumed an awake child.

There are many known cases where an indoors search by relatives and by police assumed an awake child and therefore failed to find an asleep child. The child can be asleep almost anywhere - in a wardrobe, in a kitchen cupboard, under a bed, under a bean bag, in a suitcase, under a pile of clothes, in a chest of drawers, and the relatives and police fail to find them. Those are all real cases. Answer to your last question Alf = no.

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #258 on: April 06, 2016, 10:30:59 PM »
The 10.00pm onwards inside search by a few people was incomplete and assumed an awake child.
The 11.15pm inside search by one GNR officer was incomplete and assumed an awake child.

There are many known cases where an indoors search by relatives and by police assumed an awake child and therefore failed to find an asleep child. The child can be asleep almost anywhere - in a wardrobe, in a kitchen cupboard, under a bed, under a bean bag, in a suitcase, under a pile of clothes, in a chest of drawers, and the relatives and police fail to find them. Those are all real cases. Answer to your last question Alf = no.
So you think she was asleep in the apartment when everyone was looking for her? What happened when she woke up then?

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #259 on: April 07, 2016, 12:39:34 AM »
So you think she was asleep in the apartment when everyone was looking for her? What happened when she woke up then?
IMO the search inside after 10pm by a very small number of tourists and employees, and the search inside at about 11.15pm by just one policeman, were only for an awake child. You can see this in phrases like "just in case she is cowering in a cupboard" (KM book) which makes the assumption of looking only for an awake child.  Some other people wanted to search inside but didn't because they were told things like "yeah she's not here" (FP rog) and "'no, no, she's not here, she's not here" (CP interview). 

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #260 on: April 07, 2016, 12:54:22 PM »
The sofa was pushed up against the wall and the curtain was now trapped. Evidence from dog alerts was found under the tile where the sofa was now covering!  It couldn't be up against the wall with a child lying behind it.
What if the sofa was at 11.15pm was still a few inches away from the wall?
What if the GNR officer did not pull it out further to look behind it?
« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 12:57:24 PM by pegasus »

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #261 on: April 07, 2016, 02:04:43 PM »
IMO the search inside after 10pm by a very small number of tourists and employees, and the search inside at about 11.15pm by just one policeman, were only for an awake child. You can see this in phrases like "just in case she is cowering in a cupboard" (KM book) which makes the assumption of looking only for an awake child.  Some other people wanted to search inside but didn't because they were told things like "yeah she's not here" (FP rog) and "'no, no, she's not here, she's not here" (CP interview).
You didn't answer my question.  What happened when she woke up then?

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #262 on: April 07, 2016, 02:10:27 PM »
"Eddie alerted in the small garden in front of the apartment."  Did he?

Or is there confusion between what is front and what is back?
The apartment has only one garden.
Eddie in the garden alerted slightly to a flowerbed under a climbing plant.
Also alerted slightly at the same climbing plant while sniffing through the railings from the balcony .

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #263 on: April 07, 2016, 02:21:27 PM »
You didn't answer my question.  What happened when she woke up then?
I don't have an answer to that Alf. There have been many real cases where a non-awake child in the residence is missed by civilians and even by police searchers.

Alfred R Jones

  • Guest
Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #264 on: April 07, 2016, 06:21:55 PM »
I don't have an answer to that Alf. There have been many real cases where a non-awake child in the residence is missed by civilians and even by police searchers.
Is "non-awake" a euphemism for "dead" in this case?  I'm trying to figure out your theory but it remains as oblique as ever!

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #265 on: April 08, 2016, 01:59:47 PM »
Is "non-awake" a euphemism for "dead" in this case?  I'm trying to figure out your theory but it remains as oblique as ever!
In all but one of the cases I mentioned of indoor search missing a child, luckily the child eventually was found asleep (alive) in the residence that had supposedly been "completely" searched earlier, and the exception is a case where the child was sadly not alive when found about 12 hours later under a very large pile of clothes in the "completely" searched residence. It's oblique because I haven't worked out what happened yet Alf.

Offline Brietta

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #266 on: April 08, 2016, 03:55:11 PM »
In all but one of the cases I mentioned of indoor search missing a child, luckily the child eventually was found asleep (alive) in the residence that had supposedly been "completely" searched earlier, and the exception is a case where the child was sadly not alive when found about 12 hours later under a very large pile of clothes in the "completely" searched residence. It's oblique because I haven't worked out what happened yet Alf.

There is no doubt that there have been occasions when premises have been searched and a missing person's body has been overlooked.
I don't think that is the case in the McCann apartment.  My reasoning for that is it was a sparsely furnished holiday apartment with few opportunities for a body to lie unobserved or where a body could be hidden from view.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #267 on: April 08, 2016, 04:39:47 PM »
There is no doubt that there have been occasions when premises have been searched and a missing person's body has been overlooked.
I don't think that is the case in the McCann apartment.  My reasoning for that is it was a sparsely furnished holiday apartment with few opportunities for a body to lie unobserved or where a body could be hidden from view.
Sparsely furnished with 4 beds 2 cots 2 chests of drawers 3 coffee tables 1 telly 1 fully fitted kitchen 1 complete set of patio furniture 1 sideboard 1 dining table 6 dining chairs 1 complete bathroom suite 1 cane chair 2 sofas and 4 built in wardrobes?

Offline jassi

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #268 on: April 08, 2016, 04:44:25 PM »
No doubt it was done, but is there any mention of beds being moved and lifted  to ensure that she was not concealed under or inside of them?
« Last Edit: April 08, 2016, 04:55:48 PM by jassi »
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline pegasus

Re: Wandering Off Topic
« Reply #269 on: April 08, 2016, 04:51:47 PM »
No doubt it was done, but is there any mention of beds being moved and lifted  to ensure that she was concealed under or inside of them?
Yes there is mention in the statements of looking under beds.