Wandering Off Topic

[Brietta]

I was suggesting that the Met SIO whoever it is now should travel back in time to when they were an almost 4 yr old boy or girl and ask themselves which direction they would run if a stranger outside opened their bedroom shutter and window. Thinking like a child is a positive and, to solve this case, essential skill.

Four year olds are not a homogeneous bunch, Pegasus.  They would not all act in the same or even in a predictable pattern.

[pegasus]

A four year old cannot conceal her own cadaver from all available resources for 9 years.

If a group of detectives makes a hypothesis that perhaps the shutter and window were opened from outside by someone intending to burgle a property where apparently everyone is out (clearly one of SY's hypotheses IMO), but then the detectives don't put themselves in the position of the child when that happens and work out exactly what the child would do, it would prove that millions of pounds can't buy common sense. More advanced and complex considerations like you mention Misty are important but should IMO not even be considered until long after the likely results of the noisy shutter opening are predicted.

[misty]

If a group of detectives makes a hypothesis that perhaps the shutter and window were opened from outside by someone intending to burgle a property where apparently everyone is out (clearly one of SY's hypotheses IMO), but then the detectives don't put themselves in the position of the child when that happens and work out exactly what the child would do, it would prove that millions of pounds can't buy common sense. More advanced and complex considerations like you mention Misty are important but should IMO not even be considered until long after the likely results of the noisy shutter opening are predicted.

OK. Let's assume that the child progressed to beyond the side gate, without leaving any apparent evidence in doing so.
What was the child seeking? ...... Help.
Who was she seeking it from?.......Mum/Dad/friends/sone other grown-up.
Where would she go to find that help and how far would she have had to venture before she found someone?

[pegasus]

OK. Let's assume that the child progressed to beyond the side gate, without leaving any apparent evidence in doing so.
What was the child seeking? ...... Help.
Who was she seeking it from?.......Mum/Dad/friends/sone other grown-up.
Where would she go to find that help and how far would she have had to venture before she found someone?

To work that out we would need to know
1. Did the parents tell the child they would be going out about an hour and threequarters after bedtime?
2. If so, did they tell her which restuarant?

[misty]

To work that out we would need to know
1. Did the parents tell the child they would be going out about an hour and threequarters after bedtime?
2. If so, did they tell her which restuarant?

I'll have to answer that with another question. Did the child really cry for 75 mins without getting out of bed to see where her parents were or was the question "Mummy, why didn't you come...." asked out of unawareness?

[pegasus]

I'll have to answer that with another question. Did the child really cry for 75 mins without getting out of bed to see where her parents were or was the question "Mummy, why didn't you come...." asked out of unawareness?

Good question, IMO the child would certainly have got out of bed and looked in the lounge and in the parent bedroom.

Returning to the evening of the 3rd, do I recall that GM states that on seeing the door angle his first thought was maybe she had gone to look for them in parent bedroom? Also that KM at 10 also thinks at first maybe she has gone to look for them in the parent bedroom?  That means probably the child at bedtime was not told that they would be going out an hour and three quarters after she went to slleep? 

[pegasus]

(snip) Mr Armstrong sued the Sunday Times successfully in the UK (snip)

His 2003 book "Every Second Counts" was in the villa in Aug 2007.
It describes his remarkable recovery from serious illness to win races and start a foundation.

[pegasus]

What do people think about the "secret cardinal"?
Was he, as stated in a film, a person being watched by the private investigators?
Or was he a private investigator in cunning disguise?
Did someone take the old saying "You can't get the staff these days" a bit too literally?

[pathfinder73]

Good question, IMO the child would certainly have got out of bed and looked in the lounge and in the parent bedroom.

Returning to the evening of the 3rd, do I recall that GM states that on seeing the door angle his first thought was maybe she had gone to look for them in parent bedroom? Also that KM at 10 also thinks at first maybe she has gone to look for them in the parent bedroom?  That means probably the child at bedtime was not told that they would be going out an hour and three quarters after she went to slleep?

Why not go outside on Tue if crying for 75 minutes and any tom, dick and harry could get in. Maybe she couldn't get out. Yes that sounds right. A door that keeps moving only in fantasy luzland.

[mercury]

Good question, IMO the child would certainly have got out of bed and looked in the lounge and in the parent bedroom.

Returning to the evening of the 3rd, do I recall that GM states that on seeing the door angle his first thought was maybe she had gone to look for them in parent bedroom? Also that KM at 10 also thinks at first maybe she has gone to look for them in the parent bedroom?  That means probably the child at bedtime was not told that they would be going out an hour and three quarters after she went to slleep?

It was KM

15 40

[pathfinder73]

It was KM

15 40

That bloody magic door (Gerry yes keep on nodding). Obsession!

[mercury]

That bloody magic door. Obsession!

I know, a moved door can have move 8(*(d by the air from the irresponsibly left open patio door or MM gettng up for the loo, or naybe it wasnt moved at all, not an abductor definitely

Oh well, time will tell

[pegasus]

It was KM

15 40 (snip)

Thanks. And doesn't GM say that on his check he thought maybe she had gone to look for them in the parent bedroom?

[pathfinder73]

Thanks. And doesn't GM say that on his check he thought maybe she had gone to look for them in the parent bedroom?

Not really. 8:30 left in same sleeping position. According to Gerry she was in the same position i.e. never awoke and didn't move any magic door.

"Around 8:30-8:35 they left for the Tapas restaurant. Before leaving they checked on the children, she doesn't know who; however Gerry says it was him."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/KATE-MCCANN_ARGUIDO.htm

[pegasus]

Not really. 8:30 left in same sleeping position. According to Gerry she was in the same position i.e. never awoke and didn't move any magic door.

"Around 8:30-8:35 they left for the Tapas restaurant. Before leaving they checked on the children, she doesn't know who; however Gerry says it was him."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/KATE-MCCANN_ARGUIDO.htm

Pathfinder the 8.30pm check was not visual.
" 20H35 ... listening from the outside and, as there was complete silence, he did not even enter" GM 10May