What do you think happened to Madeleine?

[icabodcrane]

I believe she was abducted as Heri does but I do not go with the opportunistic approach as there is evidence that the apartment was being carefully watched.  The question as to whether one abductor or more was involved is a difficult one to solve because of a lack of evidence in Praia da Luz but we know that there were gangs operating in Portugal who were snatching children.  I also don't go with the abductor carrying a child across town for nearly an hour scenario.

I wasn't aware that there were gangs snatching children in Portugal when Madeleine went missing

What do you know about them  ?   

[John]

The ones which didn't get away...




27 February 2011

MADELEINE McCann’s parents hope a major police breakthrough against human trafficking in Portugal’s Algarve might lead them to their missing daughter.   We can reveal how, in a huge bust earlier this month, 12 men were arrested on suspicion of trafficking women and children and forcing them into the sex trade.  And it is hoped they could have vital information on Madeleine’s case and may even know who took her from the resort of Praia da Luz in May 2007.

Last night Madeleine’s parents, doctors Kate and Gerry McCann, both 42, were anxiously waiting to hear of any new lines of inquiry.

The raid, codenamed Operation Roadbook, saw immigration officials from Portugal’s SEF border security agency and police join forces to smash the network.  According to detectives, 30 young women, including several under-age girls, were rescued as eight properties and 11 cars were raided across the Algarve and Aveiro, in the north of Portugal.  The SEF said they believe the ring to be responsible for the sexual exploitation of “many” young women in the Algarve.  In a statement they said: “The network used very violent physical and psychological coercion to force dozens of young women into prostitution. “Some of the women were found to be under-age while others had been the victims of the forced administration of narcotics.”  According to the SEF, the gang constantly moved the girls to different locations, both in Portugal and outside the country, where they would be sold and traded.  “The movement of the prostitutes between different networks hindered the police and judicial authorities in being able to conduct a criminal investigation.  “But authorities in Spain, Italy, the UK and Germany co-operated with us with the assistance of Europol in this case.”


A police source said missing persons cases in the Algarve were being looked at as a result of the sting.  Madeleine, from Rothley, Leics, was just three when she vanished from the holiday resort of Praia da Luz in the Algarve nearly four years ago.  Investigators trying to track down the missing girl have long suspected her to be the victim of a professional human trafficking network.  A source said: “Even if these men were not involved they may have information about who was and the channels used.”  The 12 men, who are all EU citizens, are being held in custody with court hearings taking place in the main Algarve tourist city of Albufeira.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/178759NEW-MADDIE-HOPENEW-MADDIE-HOPE

[icabodcrane]

The ones which didn't get away...

MADELEINE McCann’s parents hope a major police breakthrough against human trafficking in Portugal’s Algarve might lead them to their missing daughter.   We can reveal how, in a huge bust earlier this month, 12 men were arrested on suspicion of trafficking women and children and forcing them into the sex trade.  And it is hoped they could have vital information on Madeleine’s case and may even know who took her from the resort of Praia da Luz in May 2007.

Last night Madeleine’s parents, doctors Kate and Gerry McCann, both 42, were anxiously waiting to hear of any new lines of inquiry.

The raid, codenamed Operation Roadbook, saw immigration officials from Portugal’s SEF border security agency and police join forces to smash the network.  According to detectives, 30 young women, including several under-age girls, were rescued as eight properties and 11 cars were raided across the Algarve and Aveiro, in the north of Portugal.  The SEF said they believe the ring to be responsible for the sexual exploitation of “many” young women in the Algarve.  In a statement they said: “The network used very violent physical and psychological coercion to force dozens of young women into prostitution. “Some of the women were found to be under-age while others had been the victims of the forced administration of narcotics.”  According to the SEF, the gang constantly moved the girls to different locations, both in Portugal and outside the country, where they would be sold and traded.  “The movement of the prostitutes between different networks hindered the police and judicial authorities in being able to conduct a criminal investigation.  “But authorities in Spain, Italy, the UK and Germany co-operated with us with the assistance of Europol in this case.”


A police source said missing persons cases in the Algarve were being looked at as a result of the sting.  Madeleine, from Rothley, Leics, was just three when she vanished from the holiday resort of Praia da Luz in the Algarve nearly four years ago.  Investigators trying to track down the missing girl have long suspected her to be the victim of a professional human trafficking network.  A source said: “Even if these men were not involved they may have information about who was and the channels used.”  The 12 men, who are all EU citizens, are being held in custody with court hearings taking place in the main Algarve tourist city of Albufeira.

http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/178759NEW-MADDIE-HOPENEW-MADDIE-HOPE

Thanks John  ...  that's quite scarey !

Do we know what happened following the arrests  ? 

[John]

And here is another one...


The man who appeared at the frontier control desk at Faro airport looked suspiciously familiar to the Portuguese official checking passports and travel documents as passengers waited to board a British Airways flight to London.

Dressed in the latest, most expensive, branded sports clothes, fit-looking, with a shaven head, cropped beard and accompanied by three children, the official recognised him as a passenger who had caught the same flight a week earlier.

In fact, the official realised, this was Pedro Miguel da Costa Damba, the very same Portuguese-Angolan man who had sparked a series of urgent phone calls to Gatwick airport the previous Saturday.

On that occasion, with the flight already in the air, the official had decided to double-check the documents being carried by two children travelling with Damba. A phone call to the home of one of them revealed that 12-year-old Ana Catarina Caetano Costa, who was supposedly on the plane with Damba, was actually sitting at home with her mother. The girl's ID card had gone missing two years earlier, the mother, Ana Cristina, explained over the phone. And no, her mother said, she had not signed a letter giving someone with Ana Catarina's names permission to travel to Britain.

Despite a frantic round of phone calls and faxes sent to Gatwick the previous week, Damba and his smuggler's hoard of small children managed to slip past British immigration authorities, never to be seen or heard of again.

This time, however, things would not work so well for Damba. Inspector Isabel Salgado, of the frontiers and foreigners service, arrested him after checking the papers and deciding that three Angolan children and two grown-up women with Damba all had false documents. Checking through airport records, she soon discovered he had bought 88 Faro-to-Gatwick tickets over the eight previous months.

Lucrative

He had travelled several times a month, smuggling small groups of children into the UK, pretending they were his own or were going to a British soccer training camp. With that arrest on December 16 2000, the lucrative career of a man who Portuguese authorities now suspect started sneaking children through the "EU citizens only" channels of UK airports in 1998, came to a sudden end.

"He must have made 20 to 30 trips just in those [eight] months but we managed to get information that he started doing journeys in 1998 and kept going in 1999," Inspector Salgado told the Guardian.

14 December 2002

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2002/dec/14/childrensservices.childprotection

[AnneGuedes]

Do we know what happened following the arrests  ?

30 Romanian women, some young butnot little girls, forced into prostitution.
http://www.algarveresident.com/0-40336/algarve/human-trafficking-network-brought-down

[John]

Do we know what happened following the arrests  ?

30 Romanian women, some young butnot little girls, forced into prostitution.
http://www.algarveresident.com/0-40336/algarve/human-trafficking-network-brought-down

Is there a difference between under-age and little girls to your way of thinking Anne?   >@@(*&)

It wasn't too long ago you were telling me that there are no children missing in Portugal?

[AnneGuedes]

Do we know what happened following the arrests  ?

30 Romanian women, some young butnot little girls, forced into prostitution.
http://www.algarveresident.com/0-40336/algarve/human-trafficking-network-brought-down

Is there a difference between under-age and little girls to your way of thinking Anne?   >@@(*&)

It wasn't too long ago you were telling me that there are no children missing in Portugal?

Yes, John. These "under-age" were no children nor were abducted from bed. Many young girls from the East countries of Europe are still attracted with false promises to become models or movie stars, then drugged and sent to prostitution in rich cities of West Europe.

[AnneGuedes]

It wasn't too long ago you were telling me that there are no children missing in Portugal?

Yes, Johh, I was not telling, I sent the original article which was misinterpreted by some UK tabloid.

[Heriberto Janosch]

I believe she was abducted as Heri does but I do not go with the opportunistic approach as there is evidence that the apartment was being carefully watched.  The question as to whether one abductor or more was involved is a difficult one to solve because of a lack of evidence in Praia da Luz but we know that there were gangs operating in Portugal who were snatching children.  I also don't go with the abductor carrying a child across town for nearly an hour scenario.

Interesting points, John

1. "Apartment was being carefully watched"

I think Carole Tranmer's suspect and TS's suspect behaviours were too dangerous for a person who would commit a crime hours later, exposing themselves or himself, by entering the Oldfields back gate and stairs, and the another (or the same?) man touching the 5A patio wall and looking inside, the two in daylight. Very near.

Lizelle Marais suspect and Purser suspect (the same?) were far enough 5A. But they (he?) were very near forthcoming Smiths sighting place (in special Lizelle suspect) ... Also Lizelle said he seems to be the same person that the one in Flack's identikit.

Flack's suspect is more important, but he could be a man waiting for someone in the car park. Who knows?

Also (not in the PJ files) is the JW suspect (Kate's book). He was in the same place that Flack suspect. And he was in Rua do Ramalhete also, looking at ...

(1) a possible escape?
(2) the kindergarten at Ramalhete and Primeiro de Maio streets intersection some 150 meters from there?
(3) other?

Most important: the man had also to know that the children were alone after 21:00 to 23:30 approximately... How could he known this?

2. "I also don't go with the abductor carrying a child across town for nearly an hour scenario"

It is very strange to me an abductor would be 35 minutes later at a 5-7 minutes walk with the child in arms, just walking ... And given that the Smiths had a good approximation of the time (22:00-22:05), I thought Tanner saw the abductor at 21:45- 21:50, and then found that it was possible ...

Heri.

[Angelo222]

What do you think happened to Madeleine?

I didn't start this thread.
I posted this comment on a different thread.
I don't understand why my name is here as starting this.
Can someone explain this please? (mods) ?

It's called a spin off Neeley when someone poses a question taking an existing topic off track.  You asked the question and now you have answers.

[registrar]

Today I believe that Madeleine was abducted by a versatile offender (having more than a type of crime in his repertory). He acted alone, on the opportunity, without a car or similar. The crime was unplanned (you saw my hypothesis in my blog).

Today I am sure she was abducted by a stranger to the McCanns and their vacation group.

She may be killed, or she may be living with a monster, but as Milly said "maybe she is also part of a loving family hidden well away from prying eyes in most rural Portugal or even Spain", or the same outside Spain and Portugal ... It is no scientific to assign "probabilities" to any of these scenarios => she may be alive and well.

Heri.

good points

I still believe that woke and wandered and met with a tragic accident - followed by her being spirited away - is the most likely scenario

But the abduction theory has validity too - but to my mind NOT abduction by a stranger to the family:

These are the words of Justice Hogg - they made me shiver when I first read them 5 years ago and still do so today, the judge 'appears' to address a 'known' person directly, unusual for a judge in the rather stiff upper lip realms of the British judiciary - such a passionate plead.

She said: "There is, of course, one person who knows what has happened to Madeleine and where she may be found.

"I ponder about that person – whether that person has a heart and might understand what it must be like for Madeleine to have been taken and secreted from her parents and siblings and those she loved and felt secure with.

"I ponder whether that person has a conscience or any feeling of guilt or remorse or even cares about the hurt that has been caused to an innocent little girl, and whether that person has a faith or belief and what explanation or justification they might give to God.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/madeleinemccann/2262153/Madeleine-McCann-parents-to-access-police-files.html

[debunker]

Today I believe that Madeleine was abducted by a versatile offender (having more than a type of crime in his repertory). He acted alone, on the opportunity, without a car or similar. The crime was unplanned (you saw my hypothesis in my blog).

Today I am sure she was abducted by a stranger to the McCanns and their vacation group.

She may be killed, or she may be living with a monster, but as Milly said "maybe she is also part of a loving family hidden well away from prying eyes in most rural Portugal or even Spain", or the same outside Spain and Portugal ... It is no scientific to assign "probabilities" to any of these scenarios => she may be alive and well.

Heri.

good points

I still believe that woke and wandered and met with a tragic accident - followed by her being spirited away - is the most likely scenario

But the abduction theory has validity too - but to my mind NOT abduction by a stranger to the family:

These are the words of Justice Hogg - they made me shiver when I first read them 5 years ago and still do so today, the judge 'appears' to address a 'known' person directly, unusual for a judge in the rather stiff upper lip realms of the British judiciary - such a passionate plead.

She said: "There is, of course, one person who knows what has happened to Madeleine and where she may be found.

"I ponder about that person – whether that person has a heart and might understand what it must be like for Madeleine to have been taken and secreted from her parents and siblings and those she loved and felt secure with.

"I ponder whether that person has a conscience or any feeling of guilt or remorse or even cares about the hurt that has been caused to an innocent little girl, and whether that person has a faith or belief and what explanation or justification they might give to God.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/madeleinemccann/2262153/Madeleine-McCann-parents-to-access-police-files.html

That is clearly addressing any indefinite person who knows what happened. I do not believe that she knew anything special about the case.

It is undeniable that there must be at least one person who knows the real story.

[Redblossom]

Something not good.

[icabodcrane]

Today I believe that Madeleine was abducted by a versatile offender (having more than a type of crime in his repertory). He acted alone, on the opportunity, without a car or similar. The crime was unplanned (you saw my hypothesis in my blog).

Today I am sure she was abducted by a stranger to the McCanns and their vacation group.

She may be killed, or she may be living with a monster, but as Milly said "maybe she is also part of a loving family hidden well away from prying eyes in most rural Portugal or even Spain", or the same outside Spain and Portugal ... It is no scientific to assign "probabilities" to any of these scenarios => she may be alive and well.

Heri.

good points

I still believe that woke and wandered and met with a tragic accident - followed by her being spirited away - is the most likely scenario

I always leaned towards the woke and wandered possibility too

The open window and shutters element is a real sticking point in that theory though

[AnneGuedes]

I always leaned towards the woke and wandered possibility too

The open window and shutters element is a real sticking point in that theory though

Yes, Icabodcrane, but there's some explanation for this. The worst element is Eddie, imo.