Author Topic: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.  (Read 52181 times)

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Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #270 on: August 17, 2017, 06:29:28 PM »
No idea at all.  Maybe it falls under the Portuguese judicial secrecy laws which are so important there that no-one appears to have noticed they were being infringed on a daily basis.

In my opinion, the leak about Madeleine's remark on the third illustrates at least two things ...
  • contrary to popular belief Madeleine McCanns parents co-operated fully with the Policia Judiciaria ... otherwise we would never have heard about Madeleine's question to them ... they simply would not have passed it on
  • it should have been possible to control the leaks from within the investigation ... Rebelo seems to have managed it, I don't know of another like this on his watch ... and whoever did it waited until he was out of the country before practising his or her Spanish

That is a rash statement which cannot be substantiated. Try as I may I cannot find an IMO as a caveat to that assertion.
Unless you know the conditions imposed by the investigative judge wrt to secrecy you have nothing. If you have them perhaps you will be good enough to post them for the benefit of other posters.
Then of course during the case the law wrt secrecy was changed [29th Aug 2007]with no one on here apparently able to put a handle on whether or not that change was retrospective.
Which all leads to many much noise and heat but little light.
"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline G-Unit

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #271 on: August 17, 2017, 06:56:08 PM »
Portuguese police leaks are 'shameless smears' to discredit us, say McCanns
By VANESSA ALLEN
Last updated at 12:00 12 April 2008

Kate and Gerry McCann yesterday accused Portuguese police of using 'shameless smears' against them.

They demanded a judicial inquiry and called on Portugal's justice minister to hunt down the source who leaked their official police statements to the media.

They want the country's police to investigate how the statements - given in the immediate aftermath of their daughter Madeleine's disappearance on May 3 last year - came to be leaked to a Spanish television channel.

Police in the couple's home county of Leicestershire have been informed and MP Stephen Dorrell called on the Foreign Office to raise the matter with the Portuguese authorities.
Police in Portugal supposedly operate in total secrecy and officers, suspects and even witnesses face jail if they speak out about ongoing investigations.

But behind the scenes, officers have briefed selected journalists with a series of sensationalised claims about the 11-month hunt for Madeleine.

The McCanns have endured wild allegations that they could have drugged their children or even dumped Madeleine's body during a publicity visit to Spain.

But they are especially furious about the timing of the latest leak, which derailed a planned trip to the European Parliament to call for an improved alert system for missing children.

The couple met advisers last night to discuss their response to the leak of the statements - in which it was revealed that Madeleine, then three, and her brother Sean, then two, were left crying in their holiday apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared.
A friend of the family said they would not lash out against the police in public.

'They are furious,' he added. 'They are resigned to the fact that they cannot stop this from happening, but their anger hasn't gone away. It's just that revenge is a dish best served cold.'

Mr McCann's sister Philomena said: 'The person responsible must be tracked down and disciplined for this latest leak.
'Gerry and Kate are yet again being victimised by the Portuguese police in the hope that the information will undermine and discredit them in the public's opinion.
'Publicising information about them is obviously aimed at deflecting attention from the fact that the police have not made any breakthroughs in their investigation.'

The couple's spokesman Clarence Mitchell called for an end to the Portuguese police's series of 'smears' against the McCanns, who remain official suspects.

They have categorically denied any involvement in their daughter's disappearance.

Mr Mitchell said: 'It is brazen, it is shameless, it is cack-handed and it has got to stop.

'The Portuguese government must now get a grip on whatever element it is within the Portuguese police who has been responsible for these leaks, who is apparently doing it with impunity.

'Someone in the police doesn't want Kate and Gerry to widen the agenda for whatever reason.

'We know what they're up to - it's ridiculous and it must stop.'

He said the McCanns accepted they had made a huge mistake when they decided to leave their children alone in their Algarve holiday apartment while they ate dinner nearby with friends.
He said: 'They know that they got it wrong, they made a mistake and, boy, are they paying the price for that - in heartbreak and agony.'

The journalist who broke the story, Spanish crime reporter Nacho Abad, refused to reveal his sources or if the documents had come from a police officer.
But supporters of the McCanns said there were few other people who had access to the statements.

Mr Abad, of broadcaster Telecinco, said the timing of the leak was 'sheer coincidence' and not a deliberate attempt to cloud the McCanns' visit to Brussels.

He said it would be 'appalling' if police resources were wasted hunting for his source when they should be investigating Madeleine's disappearance.

'The McCanns can't be upset,' he added.
'So much speculation and so many lies have surrounded the Madeleine McCann case and we have told the truth.'

The row broke out as chief investigator Paulo Rebelo returned to Portugal for a crunch meeting with the public prosecutor who will decide if the McCanns will remain suspects.
Mr Rebelo had monitored British police interviews of the friends who were with the couple on the night Madeleine vanished - the so-called Tapas Seven.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559151/Portuguese-police-leaks-shameless-smears-discredit-say-McCanns.html

Mrs McCann’s statement said: "While we were having breakfast, Madeleine said: 'Mummy, why didn’t you come when we were crying last night?’.
"Gerry and I spoke for a couple of minutes and agreed to keep a closer watch over the children."
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/madeleinemccann/1584584/Madeleine-McCann-complained-to-mother-Kate-about-being-left-crying-alone.html

Kate's statement actually said the twins cried, not Madeleine. She makes no mention at all of discussing it with her husband. If the journalist had her statement why are the details wrong?

In this instance the PJ actually responded;

“At the end of last week, the Spanish television station Telecinco broadcast a news piece that reported that they had enjoyed exclusive access to alleged statements from the McCann couple to the "investigators" into the disappearance of the underage child, Madeleine.

Based on this news piece, the spokesman of this couple, Clarence Mitchell, expressed publicly, to several media, the certainty that the Polícia Judiciária had been responsible for its publication.

The Polícia Judiciária clarifies that it is entirely false that the contents of the news piece reproduces matter that is part of the inquiry, which is under judicial secrecy.

On the other hand, the Polícia Judiciária cannot fail to lament the baseless intervention of the spokesman, especially at a moment when significant diligences to the investigation were being carried out.”
Polícia Judiciária’s website, 14.04.2008
https://joana-morais.blogspot.co.uk/2009/08/crying-incident.html

Was an official complaint made to the PJ by the McCanns? Not that I can find.



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Offline Brietta

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #272 on: August 17, 2017, 07:34:58 PM »
That is a rash statement which cannot be substantiated. Try as I may I cannot find an IMO as a caveat to that assertion.
Unless you know the conditions imposed by the investigative judge wrt to secrecy you have nothing. If you have them perhaps you will be good enough to post them for the benefit of other posters.
Then of course during the case the law wrt secrecy was changed [29th Aug 2007]with no one on here apparently able to put a handle on whether or not that change was retrospective.
Which all leads to many much noise and heat but little light.

You really haven't thought that one through, have you?  Unless your suggestion is that an investigative judge absolved everyone from the secrecy law ... with the exception of Madeleine's parents and their friends?
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #273 on: August 17, 2017, 08:49:27 PM »
You really haven't thought that one through, have you?  Unless your suggestion is that an investigative judge absolved everyone from the secrecy law ... with the exception of Madeleine's parents and their friends?

Haven't I ?. Unless you have the full SP on what was decreed with regard secrecy then you are guessing. So as you know [you assert by implication] post the details for our benefit.
There is an erroneous assumption in your post btw. Your get out of jail free card.
"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline misty

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #274 on: August 17, 2017, 08:53:05 PM »
Haven't I ?. Unless you have the full SP on what was decreed with regard secrecy then you are guessing. So as you know [you assert by implication] post the details for our benefit.
There is an erroneous assumption in your post btw. Your get out of jail free card.

Surely if the new law was intended to be retrospective there would have to be a(n) historical limitation set?

Offline John

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #275 on: August 17, 2017, 09:29:25 PM »
Off topic posts to which I too have added have been removed.

Topic is "Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case".
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #276 on: August 17, 2017, 09:41:51 PM »
Surely if the new law was intended to be retrospective there would have to be a(n) historical limitation set?

I would have thought so.
The fact no one seems to know much about the actual nuts and bolts of the particular law would indicate to me their knowledge of the entire process is a touch flaky and not to be relied upon when push comes to shove. Leading to Humpty Dumptysville "It means whatever I want it to mean to suit whatever theory I am propounding".
"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline G-Unit

Re: Portuguese judicial secrecy law and its impact on the Madeleine case.
« Reply #277 on: August 17, 2017, 09:43:38 PM »
There have been numerous allegations of leaks by the PJ, but as yet no-one has been able to demonstrate beyond doubt that it happened.

The impact of the judicial secrecy law was that lots of speculation took place in the media of Portugal and the UK. That speculation wasn't caused by the judicial secrecy laws, it was caused by irresponsible journalists and editors who decided to print or broadcast stories for which they had no reliable sources.




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