Author Topic: Amaral and the dogs  (Read 835641 times)

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ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #705 on: July 06, 2015, 05:54:55 PM »
Not necessarily.

Why could Eddie`s alert not be to cadaver contaminant, with Keela`s to blood at the same spot?

How have you ruled that out and concluded that both dogs alerted only to blood?

Because both dogs are trained to react to the scent of blood.

So yes.

Necessarily!

Offline Carew

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #706 on: July 06, 2015, 05:56:38 PM »
Keela alerted to human blood which corroborated Eddie's alert.

You don't seem to have learnt anything, do you?

Keela alerted only to human blood.

Eddie alerted to human blood and cadaver scent.

So where both dogs alert in the same spot, the provenance of the alert has to be blood.

Or Keela has alerted falsely.

Or both dogs have alerted falsely.

An alert from Keela (assuming an alert within trained parameters!) is blood!


Which does not rule out a cadaver contaminant alert by Eddie at the same spot.

Offline Carew

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #707 on: July 06, 2015, 05:59:44 PM »
Because both dogs are trained to react to the scent of blood.

So yes.

Necessarily!

No.........You are mistaken.

If a cadaver has been removed from a site with only traces of blood left behind; how do you know that the VRD has not alerted to cadaver contaminant?


Offline pathfinder73

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #708 on: July 06, 2015, 06:01:37 PM »
Eddie couldn't make up his mind whether there was, or whether there wasn't, a scent on cuddle-cat.

And despite not being able to find a trace of any scent on clothing in the villa, he (apparently) could find a scent (on exactly the same clothing!) in the gym.

Most bizarre ...

What is more suspicious is the washing and getting rid of her missing daughter's scent on CC.

We all hope for a miracle for Maddy Telegraph
By Liz Hunt
Last Updated: 12:01am BST 10/05/2007
 
It is grubby now, a little battered and undoubtedly tear-stained. But the pink soft toy that Kate McCann has hugged close to her over this interminable week, the only remaining physical link with her daughter, is becoming the focus for the thoughts, fears, prayers and dwindling hopes of all of us.

'Gerry paused over Madeleine, who – a typical doctor’s observation, this – was lying almost in "the recovery position" with Cuddle Cat, the toy her godfather, John Corner, had bought her, and her comfort blanket up near her head, and Gerry thought how gorgeous, how lovely-looking she was and how lucky he was.'
 
David James Smith Timesonline 16 December 2007

Instead, look for a midsize dog that never tires of playing with a tennis ball or pull toy. Eventually, you will teach the dog to associate the smell of death with its toy by making the toy smell like death. Your dog should be exposed to, and trained to find, all sorts of dead bodies — on varied terrain, day or night, rain or shine.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/21/magazine/how-to-train-a-cadaver-dog.html?_r=0

Talking about the night she went missing, she said: "I can't remember when I picked Cuddle Cat up. I don't think I did touch Cuddle Cat. I knew straight away a crime had been committed, we had no doubt about that. "I can't actually remember when I collected Cuddle Cat."  &%+((£
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Brietta

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #709 on: July 06, 2015, 06:02:23 PM »
Mr Amaral linked him to the McCanns?
Wasn`t it the McCanns and/or friends who felt that Murat was involved in some way?
Is that the link to Murat, along with the suspicions of a journalist?

No ... if you read the files you will see that the PJ themselves were very suspicious of Robert Murat's behaviour and noted instances of it which caused concern.

Three of the McCann party identified him as taking part in the search for Madeleine on the 3rd.  They were not alone in doing so.  If memory serves ~ Sylvia Baptista did in one of her statements, as did the sisters Annie Wiltshire and Jayne Jensen and I believe a barrister.
I think it is obvious that a person resembling Robert Murat must have been mistaken for him.  I believe he did translate for one of the McCann friends.

If Mr Amaral made a connection between the McCanns and Murat, as in so many other instances he was entirely wrong. IMO.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #710 on: July 06, 2015, 06:05:37 PM »

Which does not rule out a cadaver contaminant alert by Eddie at the same spot.

Yes, it does.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #711 on: July 06, 2015, 06:07:14 PM »
What is more suspicious is the washing and getting rid of her missing daughter's scent on CC.

We all hope for a miracle for Maddy Telegraph
By Liz Hunt
Last Updated: 12:01am BST 10/05/2007
 
It is grubby now, a little battered and undoubtedly tear-stained. But the pink soft toy that Kate McCann has hugged close to her over this interminable week, the only remaining physical link with her daughter, is becoming the focus for the thoughts, fears, prayers and dwindling hopes of all of us.

'Gerry paused over Madeleine, who – a typical doctor’s observation, this – was lying almost in "the recovery position" with Cuddle Cat, the toy her godfather, John Corner, had bought her, and her comfort blanket up near her head, and Gerry thought how gorgeous, how lovely-looking she was and how lucky he was.'
 
David James Smith Timesonline 16 December 2007

Instead, look for a midsize dog that never tires of playing with a tennis ball or pull toy. Eventually, you will teach the dog to associate the smell of death with its toy by making the toy smell like death. Your dog should be exposed to, and trained to find, all sorts of dead bodies — on varied terrain, day or night, rain or shine.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/21/magazine/how-to-train-a-cadaver-dog.html?_r=0

Talking about the night she went missing, she said: "I can't remember when I picked Cuddle Cat up. I don't think I did touch Cuddle Cat. I knew straight away a crime had been committed, we had no doubt about that. "I can't actually remember when I collected Cuddle Cat."  &%+((£

Why do you suppose Portuguese police, way back in May 2007, never took the toy for forensic analysis?

Offline Brietta

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #712 on: July 06, 2015, 06:10:52 PM »
What is more suspicious is the washing and getting rid of her missing daughter's scent on CC.

We all hope for a miracle for Maddy Telegraph
By Liz Hunt
Last Updated: 12:01am BST 10/05/2007
 
It is grubby now, a little battered and undoubtedly tear-stained. But the pink soft toy that Kate McCann has hugged close to her over this interminable week, the only remaining physical link with her daughter, is becoming the focus for the thoughts, fears, prayers and dwindling hopes of all of us.

'Gerry paused over Madeleine, who – a typical doctor’s observation, this – was lying almost in "the recovery position" with Cuddle Cat, the toy her godfather, John Corner, had bought her, and her comfort blanket up near her head, and Gerry thought how gorgeous, how lovely-looking she was and how lucky he was.'
 
David James Smith Timesonline 16 December 2007

Instead, look for a midsize dog that never tires of playing with a tennis ball or pull toy. Eventually, you will teach the dog to associate the smell of death with its toy by making the toy smell like death. Your dog should be exposed to, and trained to find, all sorts of dead bodies — on varied terrain, day or night, rain or shine.

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/21/magazine/how-to-train-a-cadaver-dog.html?_r=0

Talking about the night she went missing, she said: "I can't remember when I picked Cuddle Cat up. I don't think I did touch Cuddle Cat. I knew straight away a crime had been committed, we had no doubt about that. "I can't actually remember when I collected Cuddle Cat."  &%+((£

Actually what should be causing comment is that Cuddle Cat along with Madeleine's pink blanket were not bagged as evidence immediately the police arrived on the scene on the 3rd May.

Both items had been in immediate contact with her and could even have had a foreign trace on them.  Forensic examination of CC at the time would almost certainly have had more value than Eddie tossing him around for a plaything.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Carew

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #713 on: July 06, 2015, 06:11:59 PM »
Yes, it does.

No.........You are mistaken.

If a cadaver has been removed from a site with only traces of blood left behind; how do you know that the VRD has not alerted to cadaver contaminant?

Offline Brietta

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #714 on: July 06, 2015, 06:12:20 PM »
Why do you suppose Portuguese police, way back in May 2007, never took the toy for forensic analysis?

Great minds etc ... LOL
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #715 on: July 06, 2015, 06:14:04 PM »
No.........You are mistaken.

If a cadaver has been removed from a site with only traces of blood left behind; how do you know that the VRD has not alerted to cadaver contaminant?

Because the dog is trained to react to blood.  The reaction of the blood dog confirms blood which a cadaver dog will inevitably also react to if deployed in the same area.

Offline Carew

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #716 on: July 06, 2015, 06:19:47 PM »
Because the dog is trained to react to blood.  The reaction of the blood dog confirms blood which a cadaver dog will inevitably also react to if deployed in the same area.

You cannot disregard or negate the point that a cadaver contaminant alert can occur at the site from which a cadaver has been removed leaving blood traces behind.

Such illogicality implies that each time blood is present a cadaver alert cannot occur at the same site!

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #717 on: July 06, 2015, 06:26:26 PM »
You cannot disregard or negate the point that a cadaver contaminant alert can occur at the site from which a cadaver has been removed leaving blood traces behind.

Such illogicality implies that each time blood is present a cadaver alert cannot occur at the same site!

Police do not base their suspicions on guess-work.

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #718 on: July 06, 2015, 06:35:15 PM »
Yes, it does.

Afraid not.

Why do you suppose Portuguese police, way back in May 2007, never took the toy for forensic analysis?

The family wasn't the focus in May 2007 . The twins weren't even tested. Too much interference and a media circus.

Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #719 on: July 06, 2015, 06:35:49 PM »
You cannot disregard or negate the point that a cadaver contaminant alert can occur at the site from which a cadaver has been removed leaving blood traces behind.

Such illogicality implies that each time blood is present a cadaver alert cannot occur at the same site!

Uncorroborated cadaver dog alerts are not accepted as evidence precisely because cadaver dogs alert to blood.