How could Jez and Gerry not see Jane?

[mercury]

2115: JT leaves table, and sees GM talking with fellow resident ("Jez" Wilkins) outside the patio gate of 5A. The two were standing just up the hill from the gate towards Rua A. da Silva Road. She did not speak to GM as she passed.


-_______


Gerry maccann was part of the group who signed a group statement delivered to the PJ on 10 May, ergo he WAS on the west side of the road NOT the oppositite side as he said later.

[faithlilly]

2115: JT leaves table, and sees GM talking with fellow resident ("Jez" Wilkins) outside the patio gate of 5A. The two were standing just up the hill from the gate towards Rua A. da Silva Road. She did not speak to GM as she passed.


-_______


Gerry maccann was part of the group who signed a group statement delivered to the PJ on 10 May, ergo he WAS on the west side of the road NOT the oppositite side as he said later.

Apparently Gerry didn't notice that bit which was, conveniently you may think, added by Tanner.

[Alfie]

Apparently Gerry didn't notice that bit which was, conveniently you may think, added by Tanner.

Who is your source for this piece of information?

[faithlilly]

Who is your source for this piece of information?

Isn't that what you think? Well it's either that or Gerry changed his mind.......again.

[Alfie]

Isn't that what you think? Well it's either that or Gerry changed his mind.......again.

So your quoting my speculation on ths forum (which you earlier solicited) as the source of this information are you?  Pathetic.

[Alfie]

Faithlilly, how about you put your mind to answering this conundrum?

Quote from: Faithlilly on Today at 09:45:15 AM
Gerry undermines Tanner's claim of being on the street as her recollections don't match with his. The police don't take Tanner's sighting seriously for that reason and don't pursue it with any vigour. Tannerman really is the abductor. You can see how it would happen.

And all because Gerry's ego wouldn't admit his recollection was wrong

My reply:

And how do you square this with your belief that Gerry and JT concocted the sighting, or your belief that the McCanns were only interested in promoting Tannerman as the abductor?

[faithlilly]

So your quoting my speculation on ths forum (which you earlier solicited) as the source of this information are you?  Pathetic.

I'm not quoting it Alfie, I'm making fun of it.

[Alfie]

I'm not quoting it Alfie, I'm making fun of it.

Goading in other words.  You may find my explanation hysterically funny but it's a whole lot more plausible than your version of events.

[sadie]

According to Jeremy Wilkins he was woken up at around 1am on 4th May by John Hill and Matthew Oldfield. Matthew told him that Gerry McCann's daughter had been abducted and Gerry wanted to know if he had seen anything when they met earlier. This happened just before the PJ arrived.

I assume that John Hill was involved because he was in a position to know or to find out which apartment Jeremy was in. So was he in 5A when the subject was raised and then he went to find out the information or was he elsewhere and Matthew went to find him? As neither of the men mention this visit we don't know.

What we do know is that Gerry McCann knew early on that Jeremy Wilkins had seen nothing. He also knew that Jane Tanner had seen something because he told PJ Inspector Vitor Martins, although the story wasn't quite the same as Jane told it the following day;

At about 21.20, their friend Jane passed by the apartment (along the corridor of the main entrance) she saw an individual carrying a child who passed descending the road
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/VITOR_MARTINS.htm#p15p3862

This is similar to the story Jane gave to the GNR, according to Silvia;

the lady said she saw the man in the street in front of the Madeleine's bedroom window, walking in the direction of the street that then leads to the Baptista supermarket.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SILVIA_BATISTA.htm

Silvia Batista got that wrong, didn't she?

Where Jane saw Tannerman was NOT in front of Madeleines bedroom window.
She saw him crossing Rua Dr. Francisco Gentil Martin

This is the problem with third party statements, they get things wrong.  Verbatim statements are frequently the only ones that are truly accurate.

[faithlilly]

Faithlilly, how about you put your brilliant mind to answering this conundrum?

Quote from: Faithlilly on Today at 09:45:15 AM
Gerry undermines Tanner's claim of being on the street as her recollections don't match with his. The police don't take Tanner's sighting seriously for that reason and don't pursue it with any vigour. Tannerman really is the abductor. You can see how it would happen.

And all because Gerry's ego wouldn't admit his recollection was wrong

My reply:

And how do you square this with your belief that Gerry and JT concocted the sighting, or your belief that the McCanns were only interested in promoting Tannerman as the abductor?

Easily and I'm sure no one was more surprised than Tanner when Gerry suddenly changed what had been agreed on the timeline collaboration and took himself to the other side of the road in his 10th May interview. If Gerry was on the other side of the road Tannerman could still be promoted as the abductor. All it meant that if it all went pear shaped and Tanner was proven not to be on the street then he wouldn't be covered in the resulting detritus. Of course the PJ saw through the ruse but you can't blame a guy for trying, can you?

[sadie]

Sorry this is a bit late, but I think it needs saying


Rubber beach flip flops can make one hell of a noise.    However some flip flops that would be no more noisy than regular sandals

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/New-Women-Flat-Sandals-Ladies-Summer-Bohemia-Boho-Beach-Flip-Flops-Shoes-Size-/302109938131?var=&hash=item465727d1d3:m:mr7Ir0sPVFBoyPNuduU2-qA


https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007FA8OLA/ref=asc_df_B007FA8OLA37999134/?tag=shopzil_ret85-21&ascsubtag=14818391306530075691812011000008005&creative=22118&creativeASIN=B007FA8OLA&linkCode=df0


https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B007FAEBWG/ref=asc_df_B007FAEBWG38508017/?tag=shopzil_ret85-21&ascsubtag=14818391652700074449812041000008005&creative=22118&creativeASIN=B007FAEBWG&linkCode=df0

Wearing such structured flip flops as these it is feasible that the noise from someone walking by at normal speed would not attract any attention. 

When absorbed and chatting, Gerry and Jez would have been unlikely to have heard Jane walking past in such flip flops ... cos being structured and some with heel straps, these do not slap on the ground as rubber beach ones would

[faithlilly]

Goading in other words.  You may find my explanation hysterically funny but it's a whole lot more plausible than your version of events.

Do you really believe that Gerry put his name to the group timeline without checking every last syllable first? Really?

[Alfie]

Do you really believe that Gerry put his name to the group timeline without checking every last syllable first? Really?

Yes, it's perfectly possible.  I'm not even sure how or when that three page typed document was written and typed out - by whom?  I think it's perfectly possible that as the most important element of JT's contribution was to do with the sighting itself and Gerrys's position on the road of far less significance that such a detail may have been either overlooked or not considered worth the bother of correcting.  Please remember: this is me speculating and may not actually represent what actually happened.  I am not Gerry McCann.

[sadie]

I thought about this argument and I think they would have used Gerry both ways.  If he turned around and agreed with Jane they could have accused him of collusion and if he disagrees they discounted her version.  Was there a solution to this?  If Jane changed her tune and agreed with Gerry they would have added that to her inconsistency.
In the article I posted the problem lies with Jez as the PJ accepted his version as gospel.  From their point of view there was no Jane passing Jez and hence there was  no Tannerman.  For the given reason Jez hadn't seen either of them.

You might have something there Rob.   That the PJ disbelieved both Jane and Gerry because Jez hadn't seen either Jane nor Tannerman

They couldn't have thought it thru though.  Not easy admittedly but we are getting there hopefully.

As for Jane and Gerry, they both told the truth as they remembered it.   
And i think it quite likely that Gerry and Jez did start their chat in the eastern middle of the road but when a vehicle appeared they moved to the west side.  The move to the west side was easier for Jez with his pushchair.  This was already pointing in that directions if he had part crossed the road to meet Gerry.

[Alfie]

Easily and I'm sure no one was more surprised than Tanner when Gerry suddenly changed what had been agreed on the timeline collaboration and took himself to the other side of the road in his 10th May interview. If Gerry was on the other side of the road Tannerman could still be promoted as the abductor. All it meant that if it all went pear shaped and Tanner was proven not to be on the street then he wouldn't be covered in the resulting detritus. Of course the PJ saw through the ruse but you can't blame a guy for trying, can you?

Firstly - can we have a cite for "the PJ saw through the ruse"?  Secondly, you've earlier claimed that Gerry completely destroys JT's credibility thus leading to doubts about the existence of the alleged abductor, an abductor that you also claim he himself has fabricated and really wants everyone to believe in, and he's done this because he thinks he may have been seen, but the reality is he already KNOWS he was seen by Jes Wilkins, so in essence your theory is complete NONSENSE!