Author Topic: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?  (Read 269891 times)

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Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #120 on: April 15, 2018, 12:20:36 PM »
https://youtu.be/wdfmKI2IjEo

This Youtube video from O'Brien is on the OS.

He said there is 'new evidence' he can't disclose which wasn't brought up at trial. I assume it wasn't available in 2012 either. Not sure how this evidence has been obtained in the last 6 years if the police are withholding evidence.

He confirms the real killers of his own crime have not been caught but forensic tests showed him & his two collegues were victims of a MOJ.

Court frees three over killing of newsagent
By Andrew Buncombe Saturday 18 December 1999 00:00 GMT

"Michael O'Brien has had plenty of time to choose his words carefully. Jailed 11 years ago for a murder he always insisted he did not commit, he and two others yesterday had their convictions quashed by the Court of Appeal.

Michael O'Brien has had plenty of time to choose his words carefully. Jailed 11 years ago for a murder he always insisted he did not commit, he and two others yesterday had their convictions quashed by the Court of Appeal.

Standing outside the court yesterday, Mr O'Brien, said: "I have got mixed feelings. I am pleased that my name has been cleared but I also feel for the victim's family. We know who the real killer is - his name has been mentioned in court. It is up to the police to arrest him."

He called for a public inquiry into a series of investigations by South Wales Police, the force that arrested him and charged him with murder. His demands were supported by his barrister, Michael Mansfield QC.

"This is not the only case like this - there are more than 10," said Mr O'Brien, who, with his co-appellants, had been on bail. Mr O'Brien, 32, along with Darren Hall and Ellis Sherwood - known as the Cardiff Newsagent Three - were convicted in 1988 of the 1987 murder of newsagent Philip Saunders. Mr Saunders died in hospital five days after being attacked in his back yard in the Welsh capital by someone wielding a shovel. He was never able to identify his killer to the police.

Central to the prosecution's case at the 1988 trial was a confession made to police by Mr Hall that he had acted as a lookout for the others during a "robbery that went wrong".

During the appeal, which was ordered by the Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC), the court was told the confessions could not be relied on because Mr Hall, who was 18 at the time and has since retracted his confession, was suffering from an "anti-social personality disorder". He was prone to exaggeration - once he confessed to a robbery which took place while he was on remand for another offence
.

The prosecution's own psychiatric expert conceded that Mr Hall's admissions were "at risk of being unreliable". The hearing also raised questions about the conduct of South Wales Police, who were said by the CCRC to have shown a "systematic disregard" of interrogation rules under the Police and Criminal Evidence Act.

The court was told that Mr Hall was denied access to a solicitor during crucial parts of his interrogation, which included the period when he made his admissions, and was at times handcuffed to a radiator.

Yesterday, after hearing nine days of evidence, Lord Justice Roch said he and fellow judges Mr Justice Keene and Mr Justice Astill, would give a full judgement in the New Year.

After the ruling, Mr O'Brien and Mr Hall said they would be taking civil action against the South Wales Police. Citing a series of convictions involving the same force which had been overturned on appeal in recent years, Mr O'Brien claimed that there was evidence of "institutionalised corruption".

"The only way this is going to come out is to have a full, open public inquiry. If it takes me another 10 years I am going to do it. I am going to become South Wales Police's worst nightmare," Mr O'Brien said.
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #121 on: April 15, 2018, 12:22:13 PM »
https://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.essexlive.news/news/essex-news/ex-prisoner-who-time-jeremy-544177.amp&ved=2ahUKEwiyn-Oq-rvaAhXjLsAKHb2EAOUQFjAEegQIARAB&usg=AOvVaw3gDiBfKcxtr5YkE8WHleS0&ampcf=1

Michael O'Brien says Bamber is innocent. But does not mention one piece of evidence -


'He said it was "a gut feeling" he had about him and that Bamber was "different to the other prisoners"

"I met Jeremy in Long Lartin prison between 1989 -1996 and it was so obvious that he did not fit in to prison life."

"They say you can spot an innocent man a mile off and they stick out like a sore thumb—Jeremy was certainly in that category."

Would you agree that this suggests Mike O'Brien is also "prone to exaggeration?"

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9166.msg447213#msg447213

"Early in the year, Michael O'Brien, a campaigner for Jeremy Bamber and against miscarriages of justice in general, gave an interview to alternative radio presenter/interviewer, Richie Allen.

Richie Allen is a good interviewer, but for anybody with some knowledge of the case, the content of the interview is not very illuminating as O'Brien goes over the usual pro-Bamber 'talking points'; meanwhile, for the ordinary public, what O'Brien has to say is deeply misleading.  I won't go into the relevant points exhaustively, as it's not my intention to nitpick.  Instead, I'd like to focus on a fundamental issue raised in the interview, which is O'Brien's contention that the crux of the case is an alleged criminal conspiracy against Bamber involving the police and members of the extended family. http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,9356.msg436837.html#msg436837
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 12:38:37 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #122 on: April 15, 2018, 12:42:30 PM »
https://youtu.be/wdfmKI2IjEo

This Youtube video from O'Brien is on the OS.

He said there is 'new evidence' he can't disclose which wasn't brought up at trial. I assume it wasn't available in 2012 either. Not sure how this evidence has been obtained in the last 6 years if the police are withholding evidence.

He confirms the real killers of his own crime have not been caught but forensic tests showed him & his two collegues were victims of a MOJ.

Btw Adam, LM clearly singled you out on blue and his abuse of you did not go unoticed by the mods in the end. LM's post are extremely telling IMO and should remain. Why would this poster request my posts stay here (even though I'd never requested there removal?) but there's be removed over there? 
No reply req; you clearly have a good fundamental grasp and understanding of all the factors in cases like this and knowledge of how and why the guilty attempt to con their way out of their despicable crimes and attempt to beat the CJS at their own game. Technicalities in law do not maketh an innocent man nor a miscarriage of justice. In fact the term "miscarriage of justice" is outdated, over used and is extremely misleading IMO.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 12:49:57 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline adam

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #123 on: April 15, 2018, 01:10:00 PM »
Btw Adam, LM clearly singled you out on blue and his abuse of you did not go unoticed by the mods in the end. LM's post are extremely telling IMO and should remain. Why would this poster request my posts stay here (even though I'd never requested there removal?) but there's be removed over there? 
No reply req; you clearly have a good fundamental grasp and understanding of all the factors in cases like this and knowledge of how and why the guilty attempt to con their way out of their despicable crimes and attempt to beat the CJS at their own game. Technicalities in law do not maketh an innocent man nor a miscarriage of justice. In fact the term "miscarriage of justice" is outdated, over used and is extremely misleading IMO.

LuminousWanderer was just frustrated that I had ripped apart his 'Sheila scenario' & then provided a source regarding Nevill being shot 4 times upstairs,  which destroyed his scenario further.

So focused on me, even creating a very abusive thread which was deleted. He will be banned if he behaves like that again, on either forum. However I rarely post on his threads.

To be fair other supporters focus on the poster if frustrated. David using his abusive images or 'gish gash' posts & Roch calling posters a 'tw..' as he did twice on Friday, or telling them to 'f--- off'.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 02:46:21 PM by adam »

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #124 on: April 15, 2018, 01:13:10 PM »
LuminousWanderer was just frustrated that I had ripped apart his 'Sheila scenario' & then provided a source regarding Nevill being shot 4 times upstairs.

So focused on me, even creating a very abusive thread which was deleted. He will be banned if he behaves like that again, on either forum. However I rarely post on his threads.

To be fair other supporters focus on the poster if frustrated. David using his images & Roch calling posters a 'tw..' or telling them to 'f--- off'.

Gave their game away really didn't they. If one is neutral and not emotionally involved why then get bent out of shape over posts on an Internet forum?

I didn't see a thread aimed at you? Nasty piece of work IMO Adam.
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline adam

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #125 on: April 15, 2018, 01:19:52 PM »
Gave their game away really didn't they. If one is neutral and not emotionally involved why then get bent out of shape over posts on an Internet forum?

I didn't see a thread aimed at you? Nasty piece of work IMO Adam.

It was called 'Adam is a liar and a troll'.

The thread was quickly taken down, as was Nigel's abusive thread towards me a SteveUK a week earlier. Unlike Nigel, LuminousWanderer was not banned.

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #126 on: April 15, 2018, 01:31:58 PM »
It was called 'Adam is a liar and a troll'.

The thread was quickly taken down, as was Nigel's abusive thread towards me a SteveUK a week earlier. Unlike Nigel, LuminousWanderer was not banned.

People like Nigel think they are above the law IMO. I'm sure several posters have screen shots of his "threats to kill" and I'm sure the police, if required in the future, will be able to detect where they came from; who sent the messages etc.

You'll most probably end up with a permanent ban like many of the rest of us at some point Adam. The mods there appear to be on power trips.
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #127 on: April 15, 2018, 01:55:14 PM »
It was called 'Adam is a liar and a troll'.

The thread was quickly taken down, as was Nigel's abusive thread towards me a SteveUK a week earlier. Unlike Nigel, LuminousWanderer was not banned.

I see Maggie has posted in reply to Steve_uk

Posts: 13393
Re: Do Anti-Bamber Posters Have Secret Motives?
« Reply #16 on: Today at 01:38 PM »
Quote from: Steve_uk on Yesterday at 11:18 PM
Well we all agree on something.


"Of course we do. Colin was a victim  as much as anyone. He showed tremendous courage and fortitude. One reason why I am so shocked that JM stayed a weekend in his flat with JB supposedly supporting him when she later claimed she  had known Jenemy was the killer.
http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,9373.msg437322.html#msg437322

Probably for the same reason why I organised Hall's funeral. Maggie again shows her complete and utter lack of comprehension or understanding with regards what men like this do to their victims and the cognitive dissonance sufferered following such an experience. 
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ce7TO3aMgNs

Maggie suffers from a selective memory imo

http://jeremybamberforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,7980.msg379294.html#msg379294
"Hi Adam,
I do believe a cold blooded murderer has to have some kind of personality disorder, many have been abused as children themselves.  It's often a 'chicken and egg' situation i.e.. nature or nurture and very difficult to sit in judgement imo. 
To me the main action is to keep the rest of society safe from such damaged and dangerous individuals so I am up to a point in agreement with Steve's suggestion of a safe island for such people
.


The question here is why is Maggie focusing on JM's supposed wrong doings? The term "flying monkies" springs to mind.


7. Cognitive Dissonance
This one involves look within. When a psychopath enters your life, you’ll notice an intense and ever-increasing sense of dread and self-doubt. Your brain will struggle to reconcile the “perfect” person from the beginning, with the inappropriate behavior you’re starting to see more regularly. That’s because that perfect person never actually existed. It was a persona, created just for you. This is the hardest thing for our minds and hearts to understand.
With a psychopath, you’re always the bad one. Even though they lie, cheat, manipulate, steal, and con—you’re the one with the problem. Psychopaths have this innate ability to make you feel like there’s something wrong with you for recognizing that there’s something off about them.https://www.psychopathfree.com/articles/top-7-ways-to-spot-a-sociopath-psychopath-or-narcissist.342/

5. Covert Backstabbing and Betrayal
Psychopaths devalue and replace others at the drop of a hat. Although you probably experienced an instant connection of trust and excitement with them, you’ll come to realize they can forge that bond with anyone. After once declaring you better than all the “crazy” people in their life, they’ll go running back to those very same people and declare you crazy. Psychopaths have no loyalty, no attachment, and no love. They leave behind a trail of destruction, and they blame their victims for it every time.

6. Turning People Against Each Other
When a psychopath enters the picture, you’ll find yourself disliking people you’ve never even met. Psychopaths are constantly whispering poison and gossip into everyone’s ears, making each person feel jealous and suspicious of the others. But they do so under a guise of innocence, using pity stories and pseudo-concern to warp your perception. Psychopaths want people distracted and in constant competition for their attention, so they seem in high-demand at all times.


Julie Mugford was GROOMED by Jeremy Bamber http://outofthefog.website/top-100-trait-blog/2015/11/4/grooming Grooming is the predatory act of maneuvering another individual into a position that makes them more isolated, dependent, likely to trust, and more vulnerable to abusive behavior

And Maggie yet again displays her hypocrisy. "It's often a 'chicken and egg' situation i.e.. nature or nurture and very difficult to sit in judgement imo. 

She now chooses to not sit in judgement of Bamber but has no problem whatsoever judging JM! Yet again, pathetic and indeed shameful and clearly lacking insight.
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 02:39:15 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #128 on: April 15, 2018, 02:46:33 PM »
On 14th August 2011 Trudi Benjamin referred to Julie Mugford as "Fugly Muggly"


"I'm sorry but I can't help myself but I always refer to her as "Fugly Muggly
"

Trudi Benjamin will in time come to realise she too has been groomed.

"Grooming is a insidious predatory tactic, utilized by abusers. Grooming is practiced by Narcissists, [ censored word]ocial predators, con-artists and sexual aggressors, who target and manipulate vulnerable people for exploitation
http://outofthefog.website/top-100-trait-blog/2015/11/4/grooming
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 03:01:46 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #129 on: April 15, 2018, 04:28:23 PM »
Interesting to note a member of Jeremy Bamber's Campaign Team has today come out and stated:

"I have no idea whether he is innocent or guilty. But it is only right that every bit of evidence is released"



Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #130 on: April 15, 2018, 04:43:09 PM »
Court frees three over killing of newsagent
By Andrew Buncombe Saturday 18 December 1999 00:00 GMT

"Michael O'Brien has had plenty of time to choose his words carefully. Jailed 11 years ago for a murder he always insisted he did not commit, he and two others yesterday had their convictions quashed by the Court of Appeal.

Michael O'Brien has had plenty of time to choose his words carefully. Jailed 11 years ago for a murder he always insisted he did not commit, he and two others yesterday had their convictions quashed by the Court of Appeal.

Standing outside the court yesterday, Mr O'Brien, said: "I have got mixed feelings. I am pleased that my name has been cleared but I also feel for the victim's family. We know who the real killer is - his name has been mentioned in court. It is up to the police to arrest him."

He called for a public inquiry into a series of investigations by South Wales Police, the force that arrested him and charged him with murder. His demands were supported by his barrister, Michael Mansfield QC.

"This is not the only case like this - there are more than 10," said Mr O'Brien, who, with his co-appellants, had been on bail. Mr O'Brien, 32, along with Darren Hall and Ellis Sherwood - known as the Cardiff Newsagent Three - were convicted in 1988 of the 1987 murder of newsagent Philip Saunders. Mr Saunders died in hospital five days after being attacked in his back yard in the Welsh capital by someone wielding a shovel. He was never able to identify his killer to the police.

Central to the prosecution's case at the 1988 trial was a confession made to police by Mr Hall that he had acted as a lookout for the others during a "robbery that went wrong".

During the appeal, which was ordered by the Criminal Cases Review Commission (CCRC), the court was told the confessions could not be relied on because Mr Hall, who was 18 at the time and has since retracted his confession, was suffering from an "anti-social personality disorder". He was prone to exaggeration - once he confessed to a robbery which took place while he was on remand for another offence
.

The prosecution's own psychiatric expert conceded that Mr Hall's admissions were "at risk of being unreliable". The hearing also raised questions about the conduct of South Wales Police, who were said by the CCRC to have shown a "systematic disregard" of interrogation rules under the Police and Criminal Evidence Act.

The court was told that Mr Hall was denied access to a solicitor during crucial parts of his interrogation, which included the period when he made his admissions, and was at times handcuffed to a radiator.

Yesterday, after hearing nine days of evidence, Lord Justice Roch said he and fellow judges Mr Justice Keene and Mr Justice Astill, would give a full judgement in the New Year.

After the ruling, Mr O'Brien and Mr Hall said they would be taking civil action against the South Wales Police. Citing a series of convictions involving the same force which had been overturned on appeal in recent years, Mr O'Brien claimed that there was evidence of "institutionalised corruption".

"The only way this is going to come out is to have a full, open public inquiry. If it takes me another 10 years I am going to do it. I am going to become South Wales Police's worst nightmare," Mr O'Brien said.

Michael O'Brien and Ian Simms took their cases to the law lords in 1999

"Lord Steyn said that freedom of speech was "the lifeblood of democracy" acting "as a brake on the abuse of power by public officials".

But Mrs McCourt, whose daughter's body has not been found, said: "Prisoners should not have the privilege of contact with journalists [to] publicise either their cases, for monetary gain or to boost their egos and self esteem."
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/jul/09/claredyer

Mrs McCourt continues to fight for justice for her daughter whose body has sadly never been recovered
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-35092780

"Bob Woffinden's report on Ian Simms, the landlord of a Lancashire pub who was jailed for the murder of Helen McCourt ("Burden of proof", 28 January), contains certain inaccuracies and omissions which must be challenged
But the most glaring omission in Mr Woffinden's article is his failure to mention that Mr Simms's own defence counsel, Mr David Turner, had stated in October 1990 when applying for leave to appeal, that Simms was "physically strong and an expert in Thai boxing, and it could be that he never intended Miss McCourt really serious harm".

Tragically, by supporting Simms and giving him false hope, Mr Woffinden is delaying the moment when Simms finally comes to terms with what he has done. Without Woffinden's intervention, Marie McCourt could now be at peace. Simms could well have told her where Helen's remains have lain since 1988, and Marie could have been able to give her daughter the decent Christian burial which is her right.
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/a-matter-of-facts-1609886.html
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 05:14:52 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #131 on: April 15, 2018, 05:43:31 PM »
Michael O'Brien and Ian Simms took their cases to the law lords in 1999

"Lord Steyn said that freedom of speech was "the lifeblood of democracy" acting "as a brake on the abuse of power by public officials".

But Mrs McCourt, whose daughter's body has not been found, said: "Prisoners should not have the privilege of contact with journalists [to] publicise either their cases, for monetary gain or to boost their egos and self esteem."
https://www.theguardian.com/uk/1999/jul/09/claredyer

Mrs McCourt continues to fight for justice for her daughter whose body has sadly never been recovered
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-merseyside-35092780

"Bob Woffinden's report on Ian Simms, the landlord of a Lancashire pub who was jailed for the murder of Helen McCourt ("Burden of proof", 28 January), contains certain inaccuracies and omissions which must be challenged
But the most glaring omission in Mr Woffinden's article is his failure to mention that Mr Simms's own defence counsel, Mr David Turner, had stated in October 1990 when applying for leave to appeal, that Simms was "physically strong and an expert in Thai boxing, and it could be that he never intended Miss McCourt really serious harm".

Tragically, by supporting Simms and giving him false hope, Mr Woffinden is delaying the moment when Simms finally comes to terms with what he has done. Without Woffinden's intervention, Marie McCourt could now be at peace. Simms could well have told her where Helen's remains have lain since 1988, and Marie could have been able to give her daughter the decent Christian burial which is her right.
https://www.independent.co.uk/arts-entertainment/a-matter-of-facts-1609886.html

Michael O'Brien has yet to prove he is factually innocent. His support therefore of any case can only cause harm imo.
http://swplive.blob.core.windows.net/wordpress-uploads/S731-Report-Operations-Fortitude-and-Resolute-finalised.pdf
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 06:27:18 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline adam

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #132 on: April 15, 2018, 06:09:11 PM »
It is a surprise that none of the 3 convicted people had alibi's. One of the witnesses was apparently unreliable.

Offline Nicholas

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #133 on: April 15, 2018, 06:29:06 PM »
It is a surprise that none of the 3 convicted people had alibi's. One of the witnesses was apparently unreliable.

Anti social personality disorder allegedly - also known as psychopathy

Crime does indeed seem to pay for some Adam  *&^^&

I found him abusive, narcissistic and full of self pity. Again that's my opinion of him and others may not agree. When I spoke to him, more often than not, he was stoned and all he ever spoke about was Michael O'Brien.


"A key complaint by Mr O'Brien was that Det Insp Lewis fabricated evidence - a written note of a cell conversation between him and Mr Sherwood implicating them both in the killing.
But the report said the investigation found no evidence of wrongdoing.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-35050762

I err on the side of caution these days. Michael O'Brien may well have got away with murder.

Here's an earlier news article http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/466372.stm
 
"Darren Hall at the time admitted being the lookout and implicated others but has since retracted that statement, blaming police pressure as one of the reasons for his confession.
He said: "The amount of pressure that was put on me by detectives, they would take me upstairs, take me downstairs, they wouldn't let me rest, they wouldn't let me have my solicitor, and it got to the point where I was at breaking point."

Individuals with anti social behaviour are renowned for blaming everyone else but themselves. Unable to take responsibility for their actions. Reminds me of when Simon Hall redacted his confession and all the excuses he made. Heard it all before.

In this news article it states O'Brien said it was "important for me" and he used the word "relative" as opposed to Mr Saunders or Philip Saunders. It's impersonal.
And it's seem the victims family weren't given much choice in the matter https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/cardiff-newsagent-threes-michael-obrien-5872484
« Last Edit: April 15, 2018, 07:37:50 PM by Stephanie »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline adam

Re: The Jeremy Supporters : Help, Hindrance or Harmful?
« Reply #134 on: April 15, 2018, 10:23:20 PM »
Anti social personality disorder allegedly - also known as psychopathy

Crime does indeed seem to pay for some Adam  *&^^&

I found him abusive, narcissistic and full of self pity. Again that's my opinion of him and others may not agree. When I spoke to him, more often than not, he was stoned and all he ever spoke about was Michael O'Brien.


"A key complaint by Mr O'Brien was that Det Insp Lewis fabricated evidence - a written note of a cell conversation between him and Mr Sherwood implicating them both in the killing.
But the report said the investigation found no evidence of wrongdoing.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales-35050762

I err on the side of caution these days. Michael O'Brien may well have got away with murder.

Here's an earlier news article http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/wales/466372.stm
 
"Darren Hall at the time admitted being the lookout and implicated others but has since retracted that statement, blaming police pressure as one of the reasons for his confession.
He said: "The amount of pressure that was put on me by detectives, they would take me upstairs, take me downstairs, they wouldn't let me rest, they wouldn't let me have my solicitor, and it got to the point where I was at breaking point."

Individuals with anti social behaviour are renowned for blaming everyone else but themselves. Unable to take responsibility for their actions. Reminds me of when Simon Hall redacted his confession and all the excuses he made. Heard it all before.

In this news article it states O'Brien said it was "important for me" and he used the word "relative" as opposed to Mr Saunders or Philip Saunders. It's impersonal.
And it's seem the victims family weren't given much choice in the matter https://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/cardiff-newsagent-threes-michael-obrien-5872484

You met Michael O'Brien ?

Doesn't a relation of Barry George also support Bamber ?  Another released criminal where no alternative suspect has been charged. These people can relate to Bamber, after having long fights for freedom themselves. Perhaps they have other reasons for supporting Bamber.

All Bamber needs now is Sion Jenkins on his side.