Author Topic: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...  (Read 324240 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline APRIL

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #375 on: March 27, 2016, 08:31:44 PM »
Off topic, but does anyone know what these black-painted objects are at the beginning of Head Street? Those on the left look like a pump winding wheel and a water outlet pipe, but are the two on the right side of the road related to them... such as air vents for some underground well to which the pump is connected.


The last time I went to the Chequers, I recall that my cousin was fascinated by the wheel -I think it was probably the first time he'd been that close to it -which I seem to think he decided it was something to do with water. I know nothing about the other two but the charming cottage they stand beside is now a tea room.................not that it's much help!!!

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #376 on: March 27, 2016, 08:47:43 PM »

The last time I went to the Chequers, I recall that my cousin was fascinated by the wheel -I think it was probably the first time he'd been that close to it -which I seem to think he decided it was something to do with water. I know nothing about the other two but the charming cottage they stand beside is now a tea room.................not that it's much help!!!

Thanks, April. I wonder if either of you tried turning it to see if any water came out of the outlet?  I think the other two objects could be vents to a well or aquifer deep underground to stop a vacuum developing which would hinder pumping. Only a guess though, they could be something completely different. That central location might have been where everyone in the village came for their water supply at one time before having their own on tap. Not knowing irritated me when I did a Streetview walkthrough from the Sea Wall through Fish Street to the JB's cottage!
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline APRIL

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #377 on: March 27, 2016, 09:03:34 PM »
Thanks, April. I wonder if either of you tried turning it to see if any water came out of the outlet?  I think the other two objects could be vents to a well or aquifer deep underground to stop a vacuum developing which would hinder pumping. Only a guess though, they could be something completely different. That central location might have been where everyone in the village came for their water supply at one time before having their own on tap. Not knowing irritated me when I did a Streetview walkthrough from the Sea Wall through Fish Street to the JB's cottage!


Cuz tried. It was very stiff. I'd go along with the village pump. Should be seeing him and his wife shortly. Will enquire about it and the other "things" on your behalf.

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #378 on: March 27, 2016, 10:42:11 PM »

Cuz tried. It was very stiff. I'd go along with the village pump. Should be seeing him and his wife shortly. Will enquire about it and the other "things" on your behalf.

Wow!... we were right. Can't find anything about those two bottle-shaped objects on the opposite side of the road, but they're probably something connected with the restored village pump and artesian well...

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Goldhanger-past/Pump.htm

http://i0.wp.com/www.goldhanger.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/village-pump-goldhanger.jpg
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #379 on: March 28, 2016, 08:13:29 AM »
More photos of Goldhanger Square and the water pump(s)...

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Goldhanger-past/Church%20St%20Postcards_files/image033.jpg

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Goldhanger-past/Church%20St%20Postcards_files/image037.jpg

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/86665447

http://www.essexchronicle.co.uk/Village-water-pump-restored/story-16042388-detail/story.html

The two other black objects on the opposite side of the road are ancient manually-operated petrol pumps. Scroll down to near the end of the page...

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Police

I can't help it, April... but it's through reading that new book, "Pointless List-making For DUMMIES" by Hugo N.Tufar.  8(0(*
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline APRIL

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #380 on: March 28, 2016, 09:09:58 AM »
More photos of Goldhanger Square and the water pump(s)...

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Goldhanger-past/Church%20St%20Postcards_files/image033.jpg

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Goldhanger-past/Church%20St%20Postcards_files/image037.jpg

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/86665447

http://www.essexchronicle.co.uk/Village-water-pump-restored/story-16042388-detail/story.html

The two other black objects on the opposite side of the road are ancient manually-operated petrol pumps. Scroll down to near the end of the page...

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Police

I can't help it, April... but it's through reading that new book, "Pointless List-making For DUMMIES" by Hugo N.Tufar.  8(0(*


Well -pardon the pun!!!- if cuz and I had bothered to go round to the other side of the pump wheel and seen the legend there, you wouldn't have had the joy of carrying out some nifty detective work. It would have been mean to spoil your fun AND deprive myself of the pleasure of seeing all those pics of old Goldhanger.

Myster, I think Adam is making better use, than you, of the new book!!!!!

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #381 on: March 28, 2016, 10:35:56 AM »

Well -pardon the pun!!!- if cuz and I had bothered to go round to the other side of the pump wheel and seen the legend there, you wouldn't have had the joy of carrying out some nifty detective work. It would have been mean to spoil your fun AND deprive myself of the pleasure of seeing all those pics of old Goldhanger.

Myster, I think Adam is making better use, than you, of the new book!!!!!

Yup, Google is my friend!

Just noticed that no.10 Head Street, the pink-painted manor house directly opposite Bourtree Cottage, used to be the village police station.  If it was still functioning in '85, Jem wouldn't have needed to faff about for 20 minutes with a phone book... he could have nipped across the road in the buff and pulled their dingaling.

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Police

Strange too how things come back to haunt you!  The predecessor to Letraset, a dry-transfer lettering system, was patented by someone who lived in Goldhanger . I used to buy expensive pages of it in different fonts to smarten up design projects at the drawing board in college years ago, before the advent of personal computers made lettering cheap and a cinch.

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Letraset

Cue for Miss Holly Whiplash... "Back on topic, if you don't mind!!!"
 
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline APRIL

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #382 on: March 28, 2016, 10:55:06 AM »
Yup, Google is my friend!

Just noticed that no.10 Head Street, the pink-painted manor house directly opposite Bourtree Cottage, used to be the village police station.  If it was still functioning in '85, Jem wouldn't have needed to faff about for 20 minutes with a phone book... he could have nipped across the road in the buff and pulled their dingaling.

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Police

Strange too how things come back to haunt you!  The predecessor to Letraset, a dry-transfer lettering system, was patented by someone who lived in Goldhanger . I used to buy expensive pages of it in different fonts to smarten up design projects at the drawing board in college years ago, before the advent of personal computers made lettering cheap and a cinch.

http://www.churchside1.plus.com/Museum/Museum.htm#Letraset

Cue for Miss Holly Whiplash... "Back on topic, if you don't mind!!!"


But Myster, isn't this thread entitled "Much Ado About Nothing..............(In Particular)?

Might it be possible to find out when the village police station ceased functioning? He couldn't have been stupid enough to have overlooked a cop shop directly opposite him.............................COULD he???

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #383 on: March 28, 2016, 11:05:38 AM »

But Myster, isn't this thread entitled "Much Ado About Nothing..............(In Particular)?

Might it be possible to find out when the village police station ceased functioning? He couldn't have been stupid enough to have overlooked a cop shop directly opposite him.............................COULD he???

... or even "Much Ado About Goldhanger Water Pump".

Easiest to phone up the EP Museum to find out, but I doubt that 10 Head Street was used by the police after JB was born.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #384 on: March 28, 2016, 04:51:53 PM »
Did you walk the Sea Wall route, Holly?  Which one do you think Jeremy Bamber used... green, red or blue?

We walked up to that concrete structure you see Troods stop at. If I remember rightly we arrived in GH about 12.30pm.  We planned to have lunch in the Chequers which we did and after that the weather had changed and was drizzling and looked like heavy rain so we didn't explore the routes. 

I don't believe JB took any of the routes to covertly travel to and from WHF to murder his family. 

The whole idea of the bike is ludicrous imo.  There's simply no way to exit Bourtree Cottage/GH without passing a number of properties and whilst I accept most people are sleeping during the early hours not all are.  It was the height of the holiday season.  Teenage children off school and uni students home both tend to keep strange hours in the absence of any responsibilities.  People leaving for and returning in the early hours from airports.  Only one person would need to observe an individual on a sit up and beg bike in such a small community at an odd hour and it would pretty much be game over.  It's easy for a person to disguise him/herself in the dark of night not so easy to do with a bike.  I can't see any advantages to the bike.  It wasn't an off road bike but a ladies sit up and beg type.  Easier and faster to run across the fields.  The longest route is only some 4 miles. 

The bike was forensically analysed for blood and soil and nothing incriminating was found.  Just because RWB had a theory about it doesn't make it so.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline scipio_usmc

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #385 on: March 28, 2016, 05:15:01 PM »
We walked up to that concrete structure you see Troods stop at. If I remember rightly we arrived in GH about 12.30pm.  We planned to have lunch in the Chequers which we did and after that the weather had changed and was drizzling and looked like heavy rain so we didn't explore the routes. 

I don't believe JB took any of the routes to covertly travel to and from WHF to murder his family. 

The whole idea of the bike is ludicrous imo.  There's simply no way to exit Bourtree Cottage/GH without passing a number of properties and whilst I accept most people are sleeping during the early hours not all are.  It was the height of the holiday season.  Teenage children off school and uni students home both tend to keep strange hours in the absence of any responsibilities.  People leaving for and returning in the early hours from airports.  Only one person would need to observe an individual on a sit up and beg bike in such a small community at an odd hour and it would pretty much be game over.  It's easy for a person to disguise him/herself in the dark of night not so easy to do with a bike.  I can't see any advantages to the bike.  It wasn't an off road bike but a ladies sit up and beg type.  Easier and faster to run across the fields.  The longest route is only some 4 miles. 

The bike was forensically analysed for blood and soil and nothing incriminating was found.  Just because RWB had a theory about it doesn't make it so.

Out of the few people awake who are watching TV, reading etc. how many are looking out their windows?  Unless there is some loud noise even if awake who goes to look out the window?

People will not be bothered by the sound of a bike to go look.  Nor would they recognize who is riding a bike in the dark.  People will not even go investigate hearing a car pass by.  A car honking it's horn or with a strobe light or people talking loudly and other things of that sort will get someone to look out a window.

In the dark even if someone saw a bike all they would know is they saw a bike not be able to give a good description of the rider.  The same is true for the driver of a car you can't tell who is inside a vehicle in the dark. Even in the day it can be difficult unless a vehicle is going slowly. You moreso recognize the vehicle than the driver though at night it is hard to do either.

The reality is that Jeremy had little to fear in using his car even let alone a bike.  But what Jeremy would choose depends not on reality but Jeremy's perception.  His perception before the murders was that someone might hear or see his car so he planned to use a bike which he felt was silent and afforded the best mix of speed and stealth. Whether anything altered that perception by the time he actually followed through no one knows except Jeremy
“...there are three classes of intellects: one which comprehends by itself; another which appreciates what others comprehend; and a third which neither comprehends by itself nor by the showing of others; the first is the most excellent, the second is good, the third is useless.”  Niccolò Machiavelli

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #386 on: March 28, 2016, 06:37:50 PM »
Out of the few people awake who are watching TV, reading etc. how many are looking out their windows?  Unless there is some loud noise even if awake who goes to look out the window?

People will not be bothered by the sound of a bike to go look.  Nor would they recognize who is riding a bike in the dark.  People will not even go investigate hearing a car pass by.  A car honking it's horn or with a strobe light or people talking loudly and other things of that sort will get someone to look out a window.

In the dark even if someone saw a bike all they would know is they saw a bike not be able to give a good description of the rider.  The same is true for the driver of a car you can't tell who is inside a vehicle in the dark. Even in the day it can be difficult unless a vehicle is going slowly. You moreso recognize the vehicle than the driver though at night it is hard to do either.

The reality is that Jeremy had little to fear in using his car even let alone a bike.  But what Jeremy would choose depends not on reality but Jeremy's perception.  His perception before the murders was that someone might hear or see his car so he planned to use a bike which he felt was silent and afforded the best mix of speed and stealth. Whether anything altered that perception by the time he actually followed through no one knows except Jeremy

Have you visited GH?  If not I can assure you it's the polar opposite of NJ. 

Yes statistically most people are fast asleep during the early hours of the morning but some aren't.  People do actually depart and arrive home during the early hours for a whole variety of reasons.  People also wake for a variety of reasons eg mothers feeding babies, couples having sex and then going to the loo, elderly men going to the loo with prostate problems. The list is infinite.  The night sky is often a source of wonderment and people have a tendency to gaze at it by looking out of windows. 

As for using the car your views are at odds with DI Miller:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-OlvzCVrmc&feature=youtu.be&t=25m30s

I'm not wasting time going round in circles discussing the bike.  It doesn't prove anything.  Yes JB could have cycled to and from WHF by bike but there's no evidence he did by way of cycle tracks and/or forensic evidence on the bike.  For me personally I would find it easier to run 4 miles across fields than cycle on a sit and beg type bike.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #387 on: March 28, 2016, 06:45:24 PM »
We walked up to that concrete structure you see Troods stop at. If I remember rightly we arrived in GH about 12.30pm.  We planned to have lunch in the Chequers which we did and after that the weather had changed and was drizzling and looked like heavy rain so we didn't explore the routes. 

I don't believe JB took any of the routes to covertly travel to and from WHF to murder his family. 

The whole idea of the bike is ludicrous imo.  There's simply no way to exit Bourtree Cottage/GH without passing a number of properties and whilst I accept most people are sleeping during the early hours not all are.  It was the height of the holiday season.  Teenage children off school and uni students home both tend to keep strange hours in the absence of any responsibilities.  People leaving for and returning in the early hours from airports.  Only one person would need to observe an individual on a sit up and beg bike in such a small community at an odd hour and it would pretty much be game over.  It's easy for a person to disguise him/herself in the dark of night not so easy to do with a bike.  I can't see any advantages to the bike.  It wasn't an off road bike but a ladies sit up and beg type.  Easier and faster to run across the fields.  The longest route is only some 4 miles. 

The bike was forensically analysed for blood and soil and nothing incriminating was found.  Just because RWB had a theory about it doesn't make it so.

It wasn't just RWB's theory, but JB told JM that he'd use a bike, unless you believe there were clandestine phone calls/meetings between RWB and JM.

If JB used the BLUE Sea Wall route there was nothing to stop him leaving unseen by the long garden at the back of his cottage, across the field down to Thistley Close (if it existed in '85), then finding a way through to the start of the Sea Wall and a long, unlit journey to WHF.  Followed by a return trip along the same route.

If he used a car, as scipio thinks, then the only option was the the second-longest GREEN route, but this would also be the quickest knowing his alleged boy-racer tendencies. As he approached the cottage he could have turned the engine off and freewheeled to a halt directly under his front window, to avoid awakening people in 7, 11, and 10 across the road. But would any of those three neighbours have been alerted by an engine starting up when he left earlier on?

I think though that he plumped for the shortest RED route of less than 3 miles, sneaking past Hyde Farm well-hidden to avoid any barking guard dogs. Having grown up a farmer's son, he'd know the pathways to and from neighbouring farms. In my experience they're noted for borrowing tools/machinery, and subcontracting work from each other.

We're talking about a sleepy, sparsely-populated hamlet in 1985 between say midnight and 3am. Next time you visit Goldhanger in early August, have a walk, run or bike ride along the RED route during the night and see if you're spotted. If a car comes by, you can always nip behind a hedge and pretend you're having a p...
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline APRIL

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #388 on: March 28, 2016, 07:25:45 PM »
It wasn't just RWB's theory, but JB told JM that he'd use a bike, unless you believe there were clandestine phone calls/meetings between RWB and JM.

If JB used the BLUE Sea Wall route there was nothing to stop him leaving unseen by the long garden at the back of his cottage, across the field down to Thistley Close (if it existed in '85), then finding a way through to the start of the Sea Wall and a long, unlit journey to WHF.  Followed by a return trip along the same route.

If he used a car, as scipio thinks, then the only option was the the second-longest GREEN route, but this would also be the quickest knowing his alleged boy-racer tendencies. As he approached the cottage he could have turned the engine off and freewheeled to a halt directly under his front window, to avoid awakening people in 7, 11, and 10 across the road. But would any of those three neighbours have been alerted by an engine starting up when he left earlier on?

I think though that he plumped for the shortest RED route of less than 3 miles, sneaking past Hyde Farm well-hidden to avoid any barking guard dogs. Having grown up a farmer's son, he'd know the pathways to and from neighbouring farms. In my experience they're noted for borrowing tools/machinery, and subcontracting work from each other.

We're talking about a sleepy, sparsely-populated hamlet in 1985 between say midnight and 3am. Next time you visit Goldhanger in early August, have a walk, run or bike ride along the RED route during the night and see if you're spotted. If a car comes by, you can always nip behind a hedge and pretend you're having a p...

There's actually another possible route -by road- from Bourtree Cottage. If he'd turned left into Church Road at the Chequers, it would have cut 1-2 miles off the journey by going round the back of Goldhanger.. I imagine that more than half the houses in Head Street probably weren't there in the 1980's and those with long drives, protected by electronic gates wouldn't have heard him anyway. This also applies to Church Road, bearing out what you said about it being a sleepy, sparsely-populated hamlet. Back then, it wasn't as desirable an address as it now is.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...
« Reply #389 on: March 28, 2016, 07:50:21 PM »
It wasn't just RWB's theory, but JB told JM that he'd use a bike, unless you believe there were clandestine phone calls/meetings between RWB and JM.

If JB used the BLUE Sea Wall route there was nothing to stop him leaving unseen by the long garden at the back of his cottage, across the field down to Thistley Close (if it existed in '85), then finding a way through to the start of the Sea Wall and a long, unlit journey to WHF.  Followed by a return trip along the same route.

If he used a car, as scipio thinks, then the only option was the the second-longest GREEN route, but this would also be the quickest knowing his alleged boy-racer tendencies. As he approached the cottage he could have turned the engine off and freewheeled to a halt directly under his front window, to avoid awakening people in 7, 11, and 10 across the road. But would any of those three neighbours have been alerted by an engine starting up when he left earlier on?

I think though that he plumped for the shortest RED route of less than 3 miles, sneaking past Hyde Farm well-hidden to avoid any barking guard dogs. Having grown up a farmer's son, he'd know the pathways to and from neighbouring farms. In my experience they're noted for borrowing tools/machinery, and subcontracting work from each other.

We're talking about a sleepy, sparsely-populated hamlet in 1985 between say midnight and 3am. Next time you visit Goldhanger in early August, have a walk, run or bike ride along the RED route during the night and see if you're spotted. If a car comes by, you can always nip behind a hedge and pretend you're having a p...

No I believe EP acted as the hub for communications  8(0(*

I simply can't see a way in or out of Bourtree Cottage/GH without passing properties.  Yes it might be possible to reduce the number of properties by using the rear garden but then the stakes were high if seen.  How many people would you expect to see in that location at that time of night riding a sit up and beg bike?  Why over complicate things?  Surely just as easy to sneak out wearing dark clothing and some sort of dark headwear and leg it over the fields?  Why people want to insist the bike was used is just beyond me.  I can't see what possible advanatge the bike offers just potential problems.   
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?