J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...

[Myster]

Their stretch target is now £10,000 

They're on a roll, begging yet more from the gullible... and it'll all end in tears.

[John]

They're on a roll, begging yet more from the gullible... and it'll all end in tears.

I can't see anything the CT have come up making diddly-squat difference to the current situation.  The evidence that we already know of against Bamber is overwhelming and I'm quite sure Julie knows a lot more too if push ever came to shove.  That's the problem about being guilty, none of it adds up to much in the end.

[John]

Interestingly, I note that Michelle Diskin-Bates, sister of Barry George, has aligned herself with the Bamber campaign and has become one of its patrons.  Not a shrewd move for someone who has successfully campaigned on behalf of her brother for many years but then she isn't the first person to be taken in by Bamber and most certainly wont be the last.

[adam]

Their stretch target is now £10,000   I can't see Peter and Ann allowing access to the farmhouse in order to play guessing games with the kitchen and bathroom windows though, always assuming they haven't had Everest in in the meantime.

The £4,000.00p was for tests on the notes found in Sheila's bedroom and the kitchen window. What is the next £6,000.00p for ?

[Myster]

The £4,000.00p was for tests on the notes found in Sheila's bedroom and the kitchen window. What is the next £6,000.00p for ?

To pay a resurrected Ted Moult for his expertise at banging on windows... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs5sL-e45eQ

[Mendoza]

To pay a resurrected Ted Moult for his expertise at banging on windows... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qs5sL-e45eQ

Ha ha! Well researched Myster! 

[puglove]

Their stretch target is now £10,000   I can't see Peter and Ann allowing access to the farmhouse in order to play guessing games with the kitchen and bathroom windows though, always assuming they haven't had Everest in in the meantime.

Ho ho ho!! WHAT a surprise that they're scrounging for more!!

Come on, all you deluded dingbats, dig a bit deeper.  Jam tomorrow!     

[Holly Goodhead]

Yes, I would go along with all of that and can't see anything you've missed. Except I think there is a lot that Julie didn't or couldn't say. Also, I certainly think Sheila would have been capable of using the rifle but not without being first shown how and certainly not in the throws of a psychotic episode.

I believe SC was responsible but how would I know, or anyone else for that matter, whether or not she was suffering from paranoid schizophrenia at the time of the murders?  Maybe she was in some rage state or some other altered state of mind not necessarily associated with Dr Ferguson's diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia? 

Here's a case where a man murdered his wife over arguments about money.  He then killed the pet dogs and later his two children.  He was not psychotic:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1327536/Life-for-father-who-killed-wife-and-children.html

Tracie Andrews and Jane Andrews both murdered their boyfriends but afaik neither of them have ever been diagnosed with any mental illness or personality disorder?   

People murder for all sorts of reasons.  Can we be sure that if someone is diagnosed with a mental illness such as paranoid schizophrenia and they go on to murder that the illness was the cause? 

[John]

I believe SC was responsible but how would I know, or anyone else for that matter, whether or not she was suffering from paranoid schizophrenia at the time of the murders?  Maybe she was in some rage state or some other altered state of mind not necessarily associated with Dr Ferguson's diagnosis of paranoid schizophrenia? 

Here's a case where a man murdered his wife over arguments about money.  He then killed the pet dogs and later his two children.  He was not psychotic:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1327536/Life-for-father-who-killed-wife-and-children.html

Tracie Andrews and Jane Andrews both murdered their boyfriends but afaik neither of them have ever been diagnosed with any mental illness or personality disorder?   

People murder for all sorts of reasons.  Can we be sure that if someone is diagnosed with a mental illness such as paranoid schizophrenia and they go on to murder that the illness was the cause?

Holly, with respect, can you not see that Sheila was in no fit state to carry out such cold calculated murders all at the same time with all but one bullet finding their target?

To summarize:

* Sheila was not familiar with the rifle at all, its operation and loading etc...
* Sheila was under medication and subdued when last spoken with.
* Sheila was small in stature and of light build, she was not fit to overpower Nevill in a struggle.
* Sheila was forensically clean when found indicating she had not handled the rifle.
* Sheila had no cuts or bruises on her body aside from the two bullet holes.
* Hardly a hair out of place I believe the term used by David Boutflour.
* And all this was supposed to have taken place after 3pm and before police arrived on site?

Don't you think these facts are just a little odd for someone who was supposed to have carried out such a terrible crime?

[Holly Goodhead]

The crucial points are you disbelieve Julie despite her evidence being corroborated for the most part and think Sheila capable of loading and firing 25 shots without missing once even though she was on medication and incapable of holding anything steady.

Do you really think Julie would have come back from Canada and was quite prepared to give evidence at Bamber's last appeal had she made up porkies?

Afaik there's nothing in JM's testimony that wasn't known to others eg local community, relatives, media, police etc.  And what wasn't known to others eg "hitman" (MM) couldn't be corroborated.

Major Freddie Mead:

 “The actual facts of the shooting make accuracy an irrelevancy… The distances were so close as to make the question of hitting academic.”

http://jimshelley.com/crime/jeremy-bamber/

If SC was incapable of holding anything steady how come her fingernails and toenails were well manicured and polished and her eyebrows shaped?

I think the police brainwashed JM into believing JB was guilty.  I can see from JB's interviews DS Jones asks JB questions about his handling the rifle and a lack of his fingerprints from JB and SC.  This is obviously a poorly trained officer who doesn't realise that firearms simply don't yield a lot of fingerprints due to the coating known as "bluing".  He also tells JB they [EP] know SC was murdered as she could not have shot herself twice.  This is not what the pathologist said.

31 years ago people in general were far more deferential towards authority than they are today.  A just 21 yoa JM may well have thought to herself, the police tell me SC's fingerprints were not on the rifle and she could not have shot herself twice therefore I guess they're right JB must have done it!  By this stage she had no particular loyalty to JB as the relationship was over.  Plus she could save herself from a lot of hassle by way of OCP, cheque fraud and drug dealing. 

[Caroline]

Afaik there's nothing in JM's testimony that wasn't known to others eg local community, relatives, media, police etc.  And what wasn't known to others eg "hitman" (MM) couldn't be corroborated.

Major Freddie Mead:

 “The actual facts of the shooting make accuracy an irrelevancy… The distances were so close as to make the question of hitting academic.”

http://jimshelley.com/crime/jeremy-bamber/

If SC was incapable of holding anything steady how come her fingernails and toenails were well manicured and polished and her eyebrows shaped?

I think the police brainwashed JM into believing JB was guilty.  I can see from JB's interviews DS Jones asks JB questions about his handling the rifle and a lack of his fingerprints from JB and SC.  This is obviously a poorly trained officer who doesn't realise that firearms simply don't yield a lot of fingerprints due to the coating known as "bluing".  He also tells JB they [EP] know SC was murdered as she could not have shot herself twice.  This is not what the pathologist said.

31 years ago people in general were far more deferential towards authority than they are today.  A just 21 yoa JM may well have thought to herself, the police tell me SC's fingerprints were not on the rifle and she could not have shot herself twice therefore I guess they're right JB must have done it!  By this stage she had no particular loyalty to JB as the relationship was over.  Plus she could save herself from a lot of hassle by way of OCP, cheque fraud and drug dealing.

Who said she painted her own nails and did her own eyebrows?

Julie wasn't an idiot, she was an intelligent woman, but this scenario doesn't work because Liz Rimmington, Susan Battersby and Charles Marsden were all told the same story by Julie 'before' it was reported to the police. Were people more respectful of the police in the 80's? Wasn't that a time of high rioting?

[Holly Goodhead]

Who said she painted her own nails and did her own eyebrows?

Well if SC didn't manicure and polish her own nails and shape her own eyebrows who did?   

Julie wasn't an idiot, she was an intelligent woman, but this scenario doesn't work because Liz Rimmington, Susan Battersby and Charles Marsden were all told the same story by Julie 'before' it was reported to the police. Were people more respectful of the police in the 80's? Wasn't that a time of high rioting?

The police told JB only two fingerprints were found on the rifle one from SC and one from JB.  They obviously think this is suspicious.  It isn't, it's entirely normal.  They also told JB that SC didn't kill herself, that two shots were fired into her and either or both would be fatal.  This is simply a lie.  The only opinion that counts here is that of the pathologist and he has always maintained he is unable to confirm murder or suicide.  Moreover the first shot was not instantly fatal.  JB stood up to this style of interview as he knows he is innocent.  JM does not know for sure JB is innocent. 

Why were JM and LR holed up in a self-contained flat?  Why were they supervised at all times?  Why was JM "encouraged" not to talk to anyone while she was there including her mum?

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1328

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1304

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=289.0;attach=1168

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=289.0;attach=1170 

How do you know that JM told prosecution witnesses anything, let alone when?

- 27th Aug : JM's WS states she told SB about JB's involvement.
- 29th Aug : Party held at JM's house to celebrate her 21st.  SB, LR and JB in attendance.  SB's WS states she messed about with JB spraying him with dairy cream.
- 1st Sep : CAL's book quotes LR's WS that this was the day she was told by JM about JB's involvement.
- 6th Sep : JM's WS claims she had a phone conversation with JB and asked if she could have the bike.  JB arrived later that day with BC but without the bike.  JB and BC give JM and LR a lift from Lewisham to Piccadily Circus for a night out clubbing.  JB and BC go on elsewhere. 

These were three young intelligent women from 'normal' middle classish backgrounds.  Why would they continue to socialise with JB if they thought he was capable of mass murder? 

If you and others believe they are reliable prosecution witnesses then that's up to you but I certainly don't.  I suspect at some stage, if it hasn't already happened, one or more will reveal all and the whole thing will collapse like a pack of cards. 

[APRIL]

Well if SC didn't manicure and polish her own nails and shape her own eyebrows who did?   

The police told JB only two fingerprints were found on the rifle one from SC and one from JB.  They obviously think this is suspicious.  It isn't, it's entirely normal.  They also told JB that SC didn't kill herself, that two shots were fired into her and either or both would be fatal.  This is simply a lie.  The only opinion that counts here is that of the pathologist and he has always maintained he is unable to confirm murder or suicide.  Moreover the first shot was not instantly fatal.  JB stood up to this style of interview as he knows he is innocent.  JM does not know for sure JB is innocent. 

Why were JM and LR holed up in a self-contained flat?  Why were they supervised at all times?  Why was JM "encouraged" not to talk to anyone while she was there including her mum?

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1328

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1304

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=289.0;attach=1168

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=289.0;attach=1170 

How do you know that JM told prosecution witnesses anything, let alone when?

- 27th Aug : JM's WS states she told SB about JB's involvement.
- 29th Aug : Party held at JM's house to celebrate her 21st.  SB, LR and JB in attendance.  SB's WS states she messed about with JB spraying him with dairy cream.
- 1st Sep : CAL's book quotes LR's WS that this was the day she was told by JM about JB's involvement.
- 6th Sep : JM's WS claims she had a phone conversation with JB and asked if she could have the bike.  JB arrived later that day with BC but without the bike.  JB and BC give JM and LR a lift from Lewisham to Piccadily Circus for a night out clubbing.  JB and BC go on elsewhere. 

These were three young intelligent women from 'normal' middle classish backgrounds.  Why would they continue to socialise with JB if they thought he was capable of mass murder? 

If you and others believe they are reliable prosecution witnesses then that's up to you but I certainly don't.  I suspect at some stage, if it hasn't already happened, one or more will reveal all and the whole thing will collapse like a pack of cards.

It wouldn't be too difficult to imagine that panic/fear might have taken hold of them. After all, if he'd already killed 5 people, another 3 might not bother him unduly. They may have gone out of their way to 'act normal' to prevent him from thinking they knew/suspected. I'm not suggesting such thoughts/actions were logical or reasonable but fear eradicates logic and reason.

[John]

You never answered my earlier questions Holly but here are some more.  Do you really think Julie made up the story about the tranquilisers that Jeremy asked her to get so that he could test them out on himself?  What about the 'I could have been an actor' comment made after the funeral, do you think she invented that too?

Maybe she invented Jeremy's involvement in the  robbery at Osea Caravan Park too?

And as for the hitman, did Jeremy Bamber not fill her head with this story in order to take the pressure of himself?

Lets be honest Holly, nobody in their right senses would invent such preposterous stories because they would be found out.

[Holly Goodhead]

You never answered my earlier questions Holly but are some more.  Do you really think Julie made up the story about the tranquilisers that Jeremy asked her to get so that he could test them out on himself?  What about the 'I could have been an actor' comment made after the funeral, do you think she invented that too?

Maybe she invented Jeremy's involvement in the  robbery at Osea Caravan Park too?

And as for the hitman, did Jeremy Bamber not fill her head with this story in order to take the pressure of himself?

Lets be honest Holly, nobody in their right senses would invent such preposterous stories because they would be found out.

I did read your earlier post but I just didn't have time to respond then and there.  I'll go an respond now and if I have time I'll come back to the above.  If not I'll respond later.