The Lisbon Libel Trial

[Wonderfulspam]

Why is it the wrong question?  I thought you were convinced the McCanns MURDERED their daughter.

No one was alleging what he asked, so why did he ask that?

And yes, they probably did.

Wolters agrees with my methodology, you don't need to show any evidence, you just say that someone did it & that's good enough.

[G-Unit]

Something that bothers me about the Paxman interview of Gerry McCann that's relevant to this point.

He asked Gerry, 'did you kill your daughter?'

But that wasn't what was being alleged by the PJ or Amaral.

Paxman should have asked,  'Did Maddie die & you cover up her death?'

Gerry obviously answered no, that he he didn't kill his daughter.

But notably, Paxman never asked if Kate killed her, so we never got an answer on that either.

When they arrived back from Portugal there was a denial;

"Despite there being so much we wish to say we are unable to do so, except to say this: we played no part in the disappearance of our lovely daughter, Madeleine."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-480801/Madeleines-parents-fly-home-say-We-played-disappearance.html

[Venturi Swirl]

No one was alleging what he asked, so why did he ask that?

And yes, they probably did.

Wolters agrees with my methodology, you don't need to show any evidence, you just say that someone did it & that's good enough.

What are you on about?  They were regularly being accused of killing their daughter, not least by Amaral who intimated that they over-sedated her.

[Wonderfulspam]

What are you on about?  They were regularly being accused of killing their daughter, not least by Amaral who intimated that they over-sedated her.

He claimed she fell off the sofa.

How did she manage that if they killed her?

[Venturi Swirl]

When they arrived back from Portugal there was a denial;

"Despite there being so much we wish to say we are unable to do so, except to say this: we played no part in the disappearance of our lovely daughter, Madeleine."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-480801/Madeleines-parents-fly-home-say-We-played-disappearance.html

From that article and a reminder of what was being reported in all the papers here and in Portugal at the time:

The main plank of the police case so far is that they believe Mrs McCann, 39, accidentally gave Madeleine a fatal overdose of sedative and then conspired with her husband in an incredible cover-up.

There are growing fears, however, that they are pursuing a cynical strategy of using the forensic evidence, scant as it may be, to force - or possibly even trick - the couple into confessing.

They are said to be steadily increasing the pressure on the McCanns, including making leaks to the Portuguese media.

It was reported yesterday in one Portuguese newspaper that detectives are working on the theory that Mrs McCann may have been taking a sedative herself because she is "mentally unbalanced" - and somehow gave a dose to her three-year-old daughter by mistake.

Another said Mr McCann admitted during his interview that he, not his wife, administered the lethal dose.

[Venturi Swirl]

He claimed she fell off the sofa.

How did she manage that if they killed her?

You obviously don't understand that if you over- sedate a child and it dies (either through the effects of the drug or because of an accident caused by the drug) then you are responsible for causing its death.

[G-Unit]

Please remember that this thread is about the libel trial, and the evidence the judge was asked to consider were the contents of the book, the DVD, one article in Correio da Manhã and the witnesses called by the parties. The judge was not asked to take into account all the stories appearing in the UK and Portuguese press, so they are irrelevant.

[Venturi Swirl]

Please remember that this thread is about the libel trial, and the evidence the judge was asked to consider were the contents of the book, the DVD, one article in Correio da Manhã and the witnesses called by the parties. The judge was not asked to take into account all the stories appearing in the UK and Portuguese press, so they are irrelevant.

Why then did you reference one in your opening post?  What point were you trying to make?

“So press headlines such as this were misleading and untrue;

Who is Goncalo Amaral? Ex-Madeleine McCann detective who claims Kate and Gerry killed their daughter
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2751442/goncalo-amaral-madeleine-mccann-kate-gerry/ “

[G-Unit]

Why then did you reference one in your opening post?  What point were you trying to make?

“So press headlines such as this were misleading and untrue;

Who is Goncalo Amaral? Ex-Madeleine McCann detective who claims Kate and Gerry killed their daughter
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/2751442/goncalo-amaral-madeleine-mccann-kate-gerry/ “

That headline was untrue but it was headlines such as that which imo shaped some of the erroneous opinions in the UK.

[Venturi Swirl]

That headline was untrue but it was headlines such as that which imo shaped some of the erroneous opinions in the UK.

The headline wasn’t untrue and it had no bearing on the libel trial anyway as you have conceded above.

[Brietta]

If it wasn't mentioned in the trial, which is the subject of this thread, then it's irrelevant.

Having read the opening post I consider your thread is merely a disingenuous opportunity to revisit the libels which caused the libel trial in the first instance.

I find revisiting such an obsession vaguely disturbing when repercussions from the libel trial will be finalised in the near future by the ECHR.

[Brietta]

When they arrived back from Portugal there was a denial;

"Despite there being so much we wish to say we are unable to do so, except to say this: we played no part in the disappearance of our lovely daughter, Madeleine."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-480801/Madeleines-parents-fly-home-say-We-played-disappearance.html

Don't you recall that they were arguidos and bound by secrecy?  Course you do ~ but no fun in that is there 😁

[Brietta]

Please remember that this thread is about the libel trial, and the evidence the judge was asked to consider were the contents of the book, the DVD, one article in Correio da Manhã and the witnesses called by the parties. The judge was not asked to take into account all the stories appearing in the UK and Portuguese press, so they are irrelevant.

Why is the libel trial so important to you when you can veer at will into "code of silence territory" which is a huge plank of sceptic lies and a further opportunity to repeat libels made by Amaral.

Who by the way in case you hadn't noticed was still lying through his teeth about the German investigation and the McCanns.

Like yours I really think his cover has been well and truly blown 😁

[Brietta]

That headline was untrue but it was headlines such as that which imo shaped some of the erroneous opinions in the UK.

Of course the headline was a lie - but it didn't stop you repeating the lie at this remove just as you have chosen to perpetuate other "mysteries" of scepticland such as the mysterious silence they are apparently still revelling in 😁  What a farce!

[Brietta]

When they arrived back from Portugal there was a denial;

"Despite there being so much we wish to say we are unable to do so, except to say this: we played no part in the disappearance of our lovely daughter, Madeleine."
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-480801/Madeleines-parents-fly-home-say-We-played-disappearance.html

Just to keep the record straight regarding why the McCanns and their friends maintained silence, please note -

Snip
A friend of Madeleine McCann's parents has publicly criticised the Portuguese police for leaking information about the inquiry into the missing child.

Rachael Oldfield, who was with Kate and Gerry McCann, of Rothley, Leics, when their daughter disappeared last May, said there had been "double standards".

Witnesses had to remain silent, while Portuguese newspapers carried stories sourced to police, she told the BBC.

The McCanns remain arguidos - suspects - but deny any wrongdoing.
Mrs Oldfield is a member of the so-called "Tapas Seven" - friends of the McCanns who dined with them in a tapas restaurant on the night their three-year-old daughter disappeared during a family holiday on the Algarve.

In her first interview since Madeleine went missing, she said: "We were made to understand we could face two years in prison for speaking out, so as a group we've not said anything from day one.

"And there have been all these rumours flying around and leaks from sources close to the PJ [the Policia Judiciaria - Portuguese police]."

Asked to characterise police actions, she replied: "Well, double standards. They leaked information and these rumours which have flown around for the past year...
"We would have loved to have put the record straight."

'No communication'

Mrs Oldfield said it had been "agonising" to watch the McCanns' reaction when Madeleine went missing from a ground floor apartment in Praia da Luz on 3 May 2007.

"Anyone with an ounce of common sense would be able to see they couldn't have done it," she said.

She added that lifting the arguido status on Mr and Mrs McCann would "enable the investigation to move forward and certainly it would enable [them] to work more closely with the PJ".
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/7364181.stm