Who, when were Police called to OC? When did they arrive? incl GNR PJ & Interpol

[Robittybob1]

My post was in response to Brietta, Rob but clearly the dogs didn't know which way the person walked but neither do their handlers, you, Brietta,  nor me.  The obvious place to start a search with sniffer dogs is the last known location of the missing person not some shop/house yard away though.

I agree with you.

[Robittybob1]

Now this sounds a bit suspicious:  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOSE_PIMENTAL.htm

"At about 04.00 AM they searched the streets, gardens, caravans, lorries, etc. As well as questioning lorry drivers in the parking area next to the "Luz Tur" building, they stopped a caravan with two English individuals, who said they lived in the Espiche area. The caravan was duly searched.

When carrying out the search of the resort area they also saw several local people helping to search. He remembers a woman named Silvia who worked at the resort.

He left for home at about 04.20."

Silvia Isabel Cunha Azevedo Cravinho does not get involved in the search.

Silvia Batista doesn't describe searching

Since he mentions something at 4:00 AM and going home at 4:20 AM  did the sighting of Silvia happen in between?
He seems to know Silvia Batista but didn't Silvia say she was at home in Lagos at 4:00 AM?

No it was her husband Joao "That he immediately left for the OC where he arrived at about 23.00 and immediately began to search the resort and the beach area, searching in all the places where the child might be. The searches were carried out by employees from the Tapas and the restaurant who had just finished their shifts and by some local people. He continued searching until about 04.00 when he returned home with his wife." http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JOAO_BATISTA.htm

So it is possible Silvia joined in searching before she went home.

[Angelo222]

Robittybob1.  You started this thread enquiring as to when the GNR arrived on site and twice you have taken posts off topic. I have a mind to request this thread be deleted as it is below par and utterly confusing.

PS.  The GNR arrived on site at 2300 hrs.

[Brietta]

You have me confused. Are you saying the dogs tracked Madeleine back to 5a?

With apologies for turning this into another dog thread and very much off topic ... that is not what I am saying.  I am suggesting that it is possible that the dogs were not following Madeleine' scent.

We have no idea who was last to touch the blanket the dogs were given to sniff.

[Sunny]

With apologies for turning this into another dog thread and very much off topic ... that is not what I am saying.  I am suggesting that it is possible that the dogs were not following Madeleine' scent.

We have no idea who was last to touch the blanket the dogs were given to sniff.

Didn't the McCanns give the GNR dog handlers the blanket. I would imagine they would give the police something that would be covered in Madeleine's scent IMO.

[Robittybob1]

Robittybob1.  You started this thread enquiring as to when the GNR arrived on site and twice you have taken posts off topic. I have a mind to request this thread be deleted as it is below par and utterly confusing.

PS.  The GNR arrived on site at 2300 hrs.

The last few posts were attempts to answer Miss Taken Identity's question about what the GNR knew of their reason for being there. 
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10184.msg490480#msg490480   and a subsequent post.

She puts up very challenging posts that are not the easiest to reply to.

I'm looking at all aspects of the GNR and PJ arrival, who when why etc.  What they did, what they report, could all be included in the thread really.

 

[Robittybob1]

Robittybob1.  You started this thread enquiring as to when the GNR arrived on site and twice you have taken posts off topic. I have a mind to request this thread be deleted as it is below par and utterly confusing.

PS.  The GNR arrived on site at 2300 hrs.

Two of the GNR arrive at that time, but none of the Ocean club management confirm that time.  I was trying to work out why. 
Silvia even travels back in the car along with Gerry, Gerry's friend, and the two GNR officers.  A total of 5 in the car.
"After she arrived she went immediately to the apartment A5 where she found several people inside the apartment and outside of it. She entered in the flat but soon left without having spoken with anyone, because she was informed that elements of the GNR were in the principal reception. She went there to meet them."

Someone informed Silvia that the GNR had arrived.

[Robittybob1]

With apologies for turning this into another dog thread and very much off topic ... that is not what I am saying.  I am suggesting that it is possible that the dogs were not following Madeleine' scent.

We have no idea who was last to touch the blanket the dogs were given to sniff.

Surely the predominant scent on the blanket would have been Madeleine's.

[Brietta]

Surely the predominant scent on the blanket would have been Madeleine's.

We are going to get this conversation scrubbed, Robbity, way off topic.  Being familiar with babies and cuddle blankets I am aware the blanket would be washed constantly and in my opinion certainly before they left for Portugal.

There could be a stronger scent than Madeleine's associated with it or associated with the apartment and the passageway which the dogs followed back to source.

[sadie]

Well dear Jass, one could, if one wanted to, prevent a kidknapping by merely looking after ones child.


Oh do you think that was a general question?  ah no worries same  answer applies!

A 6 yr old in the UK was taken from her bath whilst her mother and brother were in their home and had just left her.  She was in earshot of them

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2006/oct/20/ukcrime

The mother was unable to prevent the abduction because she was unaware of it despite being so close.  This mother and all reasonable people would be very distressed to hear you say that if she wanted to, she could have prevented a kidnapping; that she wasn't looking after her child. 

https://www.theguardian.com/uk/2006/oct/20/ukcrime

[sadie]

Let's have a look
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARMANDO_MORAIS.htm  "Armando" - great name!

What the heck does this mean?  "As he did not obtain any results in the area close to the resort, he extended the perimeter of the search to a distance of 1 km."

Does he mean the radius of the search was 1 KM or the circumference was 1 km.  I take it to mean he kept approximately 1 km  from the apartment and did a full circuit from a start point.  Remember circumference = 2 pi radius squared.   so that is about a 7 km long circuit. Quite a task.  But why did he do that if his dog picked up nothing close by you'd wonder why go further out.  Maybe the scent on the clothing wasn't that great.  What clothing item was it?  Was it Madeleine's? Did Kate confirm that it was?

Soz Rob,

Have another look at your formula.

Circumference should be 2pi radius.


The squared bit only comes in when one is considering area of the circle

[sadie]

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ANTONIO_DUARTE.htm
Duarte was above Roque and this is what Roque reported to him "After Roque checked that the child was not in the apartment, he gathered information from the mother and father. He was told by the patrol, that the father had put forward a theory saying that it could have been an abduction. He was also told that there was a shutter that had been 'raised'." 

Kidnapping or abduction all about the same in my book.


Who was plugging in ideas that contradicted the parent's theory?  Was it Silvia as her role as translator?  Was she was able to plug in her ideas and how do we know what the Tapas 9 wanted to say was translated properly?  Did she translate it with conviction?
 
I've already complained to Operation Grange that Silvia Batista had a conflict of interest when she was translating for the Tapas 9 and representing the management of the OC at the same time.

In her statement I see evidence of her undermining the McCanns and Jane Tanner.

Another hardworking forum poster who I admired for her logic and thoroughness, also expressed doubt at the veracity of Sylvia Batista

[Robittybob1]

Another hardworking forum poster who I admired for her logic and thoroughness, also expressed doubt at the veracity of Sylvia Batista

Can you recall who that might have been Sadie?  In her book Kate raves on about how helpful Silvia was.  No doubt she helped, but Kate and Gerry really needed the GNR to accept the "Madeleine was abducted" theory.  I see one part of the GNR team stopped a caravan and searched it.   I wonder how much more effective the GNR could have been if the officers without dogs or even all of them searched vehicles leaving PdL.  I think the dogs could be really useful to sniff out any hidden compartment in a vehicle containing a girl.

[Robittybob1]

Didn't the McCanns give the GNR dog handlers the blanket. I would imagine they would give the police something that would be covered in Madeleine's scent IMO.

There are three descriptions of the items given to the GNR for the purposes of giving their dogs a scent to follow.
Two of the items seem successful in getting the dogs active
1. That was the Turkish towel
2. The pink blanket.
3  But the third was described as "clothing" and that dog did not pick up any trail; around the apartment. 
Was this a third item or just a bad description?

[Miss Taken Identity]

The last few posts were attempts to answer Miss Taken Identity's question about what the GNR knew of their reason for being there. 
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10184.msg490480#msg490480   and a subsequent post.

She puts up very challenging posts that are not the easiest to reply to.

I'm looking at all aspects of the GNR and PJ arrival, who when why etc.  What they did, what they report, could all be included in the thread really.

"She puts up very challenging posts that are not the easiest to reply to. "


Indeed, lots of questions which have no real easy explanation- but thanks for trying.