Sadie's theory, the watcher and a getaway car.

[Robittybob1]

Oh no it doesn't !!

Give me one statement from the main protagonists that mentions seeing a moving car between 9-9.30 ?

Arlindo  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
". When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; "  A car had moved.

[G-Unit]

I dont know for certain if there is a way through as I stated a few posts back ... but ....

Has it occurred to you that the watcher might have rented (or gained free entrance to) the ground floor flat in block 6 adjacent to the balconies?   With all the burglary entries apparently via front doors, keys seem to have been available from some source.

We have measured to slightly different spots but basically to a metre or so, I agree with your measurements.

Had The Getaway driver pulled out, straightened up and stopped 15 metres***** before the vehicle reached Gerry and Jez, then the distance to Tannerman would have been 45 metres.   Even with the low level lamps, Tannerman would be lit up.  With high level lamps he woulf be lit up royally ... and Jane would be enabled to see colours as she claimed.


[***** 15 metres is being generous to you cos he might have driven closer than that before realizing who he was approaching.  He also needed stopping distance.  THen he would have been well inside the 45 metres to Tannerman rather than on the edge of it.]

I have been reading for years about a 'watcher' exiting block 6 into the car park to the south. Now it seems that statement was made without any research being done to make sure that it was possible. Now a new suggestion based on no evidence is being made.

The 'watcher' is deemed to exist because someone saw some cigarette butts on a balcony. There's no evidence to suggest a 'getaway driver' existed. There's definitely no evidence of a car moving in the vicinity of three witnesses. 

A theory which rests on no evidence can't be proved or disproved.  Discussion becomes an exchange of opinions, not an examination of facts and evidence.

[barrier]

Oh, but it does.  Where is that formidable "thinking cap" of yours?


Despite the fact that the evidence DOES support my theory, unlike some on here I do not claim that it is fact.

Unlike some, i can see that there are things that we do not know which could preclude my theory

But you are quite incorrect Gunit, my theory is backed in several ways by evidence or facts.


It could have happened like I am thinking, IMO, and it seems the opinion of others.

Opinions won't solve it,hard evidence is what will and it's clearly lacking.

[barrier]

Arlindo  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
". When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; "  A car had moved.

His time puts the alert at around 9:20 pm Hmmm,

A few minutes later, when it was around 21H20, he heard some clamour, which made him leave toward the restaurant, a few meters away, and was then informed that a child had disappeared. Given the importance of this, believed that he should be in the surroundings. At that moment, he did not leave the area of the restaurant, and did not have the opportunity to check if the vehicle mentioned before was situated in the same location;

[G-Unit]

Although keys are often mentioned there's no evidence that any keys were available to anyone. An unnamed man allegedly told a British newspaper that someone lost the keys to the whole of block 5.
http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/458798/Apartment-key-theft-cover-up-by-resort-staff-in-Madeleine-McCann-case

The maintenance staff were;

Director of Maintenance Services, Silvia M C R Batista
Supervisor, Maria Bernadete Calado Gloria
Head of Maintenance, Joao Carlos Silva Batista
Mario Domingos Mareira Handyman
Jaime Pedro Oliveira Graca
Luis Ferro
Tiago Pires Luz da Silva
Nuno Conceicao,

Silvia would issue maintenance requests from guests and each morning these would be handed out to the person or persons for them to deal with. Keys were given out and his was noted down at the time of issue. It would have been unusual to issue keys for a whole block unless the problem was affecting the whole block.

[G-Unit]

Arlindo  http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm
". When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; "  A car had moved.

A car which had been parked next to the Tapas reception at 9.10 when he arrived, so it wasn't in that car park.

[Robittybob1]

His time puts the alert at around 9:20 pm Hmmm,

Considering Arlindo is a manager of some sort how does one explain his statement?  Was he drunk?  That he was hearing things and then at a certain time he leaves himself in a motor car.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm

"and is employed as executive chef of the kitchen. He clarifies that along with being responsible for the five (5) kitchens (one of whom is the Tapas) of the Ocean Club, his post essentially centres on the principal kitchen next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE. His work takes him occasionally to the other kitchens;
. He records that the past Thursday, 3rd of May, he left the central kitchen with the objective of going to the Tapas restaurant in order to determine that everything was functioning smoothly; "

So how does he get from A to B?
"When he arrived there, by vehicle , at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one.

So one presumes when he left he left by vehicle too.
"Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples;
. When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; "  So even if you discount the rest of his statement he comes and goes by car but also describes another car had left as  well.

Now Faithlilly wanted "Give me one statement from the main protagonists that mentions seeing a moving car between 9-9.30 ?"  Now Arlindo himself must fit that bill, and if he is correct about the other vehicle there was two car movements.

[barrier]

Considering Arlindo is a manager of some sort how does one explain his statement?  Was he drunk?  That he was hearing things and then at a certain time he leaves himself in a motor car.

What kind of  slur is that to suggest he might be drunk,he drove to the tapas from the central kitchen (how far was that?)what if his times were correct? it would certainly lend more credence to Tannerman if its so.imo

[Robittybob1]

What kind of  slur is that to suggest he might be drunk,he drove to the tapas from the central kitchen (how far was that?)what if his times were correct? it would certainly lend more credence to Tannerman if its so.imo

Well how was I to interpret your emoticon?  "His time puts the alert at around 9:20 pm Hmmm, "   What were you meaning?
Being drunk is always a possibility?

[barrier]

Well how was I to interpret your emoticon?  "His time puts the alert at around 9:20 pm Hmmm, "   What were you meaning?

That the other times are incorrect? the whole nine yards is because of the alleged time keeping and checking written on the scrap book,all scenarios are still in according to Rowley,which if his timings(chef) are correct lends even more credence to Tannerman imo.Maybe that's why as some like to point out Tannerman and Crecheman mighten be the same.

[G-Unit]

Considering Arlindo is a manager of some sort how does one explain his statement?  Was he drunk?  That he was hearing things and then at a certain time he leaves himself in a motor car.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/ARLINDO-PELEGA.htm

"and is employed as executive chef of the kitchen. He clarifies that along with being responsible for the five (5) kitchens (one of whom is the Tapas) of the Ocean Club, his post essentially centres on the principal kitchen next to a reception, close to the restaurant MIRAGE. His work takes him occasionally to the other kitchens;
. He records that the past Thursday, 3rd of May, he left the central kitchen with the objective of going to the Tapas restaurant in order to determine that everything was functioning smoothly; "

So how does he get from A to B?
"When he arrived there, by vehicle , at around 21:10, he remembers that next to the Tapas reception, he saw a vehicle, dark blue in colour, with Portuguese license plates. Although he cannot be definite, he believes it was a Fiesta or Focus. The deponent furthers that is was not a small car, and for this reason it could very well have been a Focus and not a Fiesta. He tells that he does not remember any sticker indicating that it was a rental car. Inside the vehicle he saw no one.

So one presumes when he left he left by vehicle too.
"Later, at around 21:40, he left the restaurant passing through the same esplanade where moments before, he had seen the same table occupied by the three couples, empty, who had left in the meanwhile various items, principally clothing. He was told by his colleagues that the child who had disappeared was a child of one of those couples;
. When he left, he noticed that the dark blue vehicle was no longer in its location (previously noted) and does not know of the existence or any connection between the presence of that vehicle and the disappearance of the child; "  So even if you discount the rest of his statement he comes and goes by car but also describes another car had left as  well.

Now Faithlilly wanted "Give me one statement from the main protagonists that mentions seeing a moving car between 9-9.30 ?"  Now Arlindo himself must fit that bill, and if he is correct about the other vehicle there was two car movements.

Suggesting that he might have been drunk on duty without any evidence is libellous in my opinion.

As we are discussing Sadie's theory with a getaway vehicle in the car park south of block 6, this guy's statement doesn't support that idea. Only a completely brainless getaway driver would park close to the Tapas entrance imo.

[Alice Purjorick]

Oh for heavens sake!
PdL is a holiday resort, there will be little hatchbacks, carrying Hertz, Avis or Europcar logos, being driven by all manner of holiday makers at most times of the day. 
The idea that a car will be a rarity is manifest nonsense.
Anyway were a heist planned no doubt the perps would use a car that looked like it should be there and did not stick out like a sore thumb.

[G-Unit]

All sorts of people were driving around that night. I can name four without trying;

Jenny Murat.
Hayley May Crawford
Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja
Maria Manuela Martins da Silva

[Robittybob1]

All sorts of people were driving around that night. I can name four without trying;

Jenny Murat.
Hayley May Crawford
Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja
Maria Manuela Martins da Silva

What happens if you put their driving times in too?
Jenny Murat. - too early
Hayley May Crawford  - 21H00 a bit early
Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja - Suspicious
Maria Manuela Martins da Silva - too late

[Brietta]

What happens if you put their driving times in too?
Jenny Murat. - too early
Hayley May Crawford  - 21H00 a bit early
Arlindo Epifanio Goncalves Fernandes Peleja - Suspicious
Maria Manuela Martins da Silva - too late

Without being bothered to check it out, Robitty, how many of the statements of the people who volunteered the information that they were driving that night was corroborated by others?
I can't think of any.  Which suggests to me that persons interviewed weren't asked about traffic movement or parked vehicles.  I think it is unrealistic to assume that there was no vehicular movement in Luz within the timescale of, for the sake of argument 2100 to 2230.
I think only two witnesses mentioned parked vehicles.  There is no CCTV of vehicle movement either within the environs of Luz or further afield apart from service stations.

In my opinion the investigation neglected to tie in Madeleine's disappearance with the possibility she had been transferred to a vehicle and driven as far away and as quickly as possible from Luz.

In my opinion Sadie's theory rectifies that omission by including the possibility, perhaps even the probability that there was a waiting vehicle nearby in which it was intended to move Madeleine.