Why would an abductor 'hide' in the apartment ?

[icabodcrane]

We have been told by the McCanns that they think the abductor had been observing them all week,  noting their checking regime  ...  and even that he may have been in the apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared

So why would this note - taking abductor have placed himself inside the apartment at the exact time he would expect the children to be checked on  ... and then  'hide'  ( behind the door is Gerry's prefered  place  ) 

That makes no sense at all

[gilet]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

[Eleanor]

We have been told by the McCanns that they think the abductor had been observing them all week,  noting their checking regime  ...  and even that he may have been in the apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared

So why would this note - taking abductor have placed himself inside the apartment at the exact time he would expect the children to be checked on  ... and then  'hide'  ( behind the door is Gerry's prefered  place  ) 

That makes no sense at all

It makes perfect sense to me.  Why would he not have hidden behind the door?  I don't suppose that he wanted to be caught.

[icabodcrane]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

 In that case,  Jane Tanner could not  have seen the abductor making off with Madeleine at 915pm,  as she claimed

At that exact moment Gerry McCann was standing in the street  (  chatting to tennis buddy Jed  )  directly outside the gate that lead to the open patio doors

The abductor certainly didn't pass by Gerry and Jez to get into the apartment  (  to reappear moments later crossing the road with a child in his arms   ) 

If he wasn't  already in the apartment when Gerry did his check at 9.10  then Jane Tanner couldn't have seen him leaving with Madeleine five minutes later

[Eleanor]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

 In that case,  Jane Tanner could not  have seen the abductor making off with Madeleine at 915pm,  as she claimed

At that exact moment Gerry McCann was standing in the street  (  chatting to tennis buddy Jed  )  directly outside the gate that lead to the open patio doors

The abductor certainly didn't pass by Gerry and Jez to get into the apartment  (  to reappear moments later crossing the road with a child in his arms   ) 

If he wasn't  already in the apartment when Gerry did his check at 9.10  then Jane Tanner couldn't have seen him leaving with Madeleine five minutes later

The Abductor obviously left by the front door.  It has never been suggested that he left by the Patio Doors.
Think about it.

[icabodcrane]

We have been told by the McCanns that they think the abductor had been observing them all week,  noting their checking regime  ...  and even that he may have been in the apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared

So why would this note - taking abductor have placed himself inside the apartment at the exact time he would expect the children to be checked on  ... and then  'hide'  ( behind the door is Gerry's prefered  place  ) 

That makes no sense at all

It makes perfect sense to me.  Why would he not have hidden behind the door?  I don't suppose that he wanted to be caught.

Perfect sense  ?

Don't you think it would have made more sense to have gone into the apartment just after  a check had been made  ...  rather than just before one was due  ? 

[icabodcrane]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

 In that case,  Jane Tanner could not  have seen the abductor making off with Madeleine at 915pm,  as she claimed

At that exact moment Gerry McCann was standing in the street  (  chatting to tennis buddy Jed  )  directly outside the gate that lead to the open patio doors

The abductor certainly didn't pass by Gerry and Jez to get into the apartment  (  to reappear moments later crossing the road with a child in his arms   ) 

If he wasn't  already in the apartment when Gerry did his check at 9.10  then Jane Tanner couldn't have seen him leaving with Madeleine five minutes later

The Abductor obviously left by the front door.  It has never been suggested that he left by the Patio Doors.
Think about it.

I'm not talking about how he  got  out  of the apartment  ...  I'm talking about how he got in  to it

It had to be by the open patio doors,   but Gerry and Jez were standing at the gate directly outside them ...  so he couldn't have got in that way without them seeing him

If he was seen a few moments later by Jane Tanner,  making off with Madeleine, then he would  have    to have already been in there when Gerry did his check moments before

[gilet]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

 In that case,  Jane Tanner could not  have seen the abductor making off with Madeleine at 915pm,  as she claimed

At that exact moment Gerry McCann was standing in the street  (  chatting to tennis buddy Jed  )  directly outside the gate that lead to the open patio doors

The abductor certainly didn't pass by Gerry and Jez to get into the apartment  (  to reappear moments later crossing the road with a child in his arms   ) 

If he wasn't  already in the apartment when Gerry did his check at 9.10  then Jane Tanner couldn't have seen him leaving with Madeleine five minutes later

The Abductor obviously left by the front door.  It has never been suggested that he left by the Patio Doors.
Think about it.

I'm not talking about how he  got  out  of the apartment  ...  I'm talking about how he got in  to it

It had to be by the open patio doors,   but Gerry and Jez were standing at the gate directly outside them ...  so he couldn't have got in that way without them seeing him

If he was seen a few moments later by Jane Tanner,  making off with Madeleine, then he would  have    to have already been in there when Gerry did his check moments before

But could he not simply have had a key?

There were many keys for each apartment used by workmen, cleaners, owners etc.

[icabodcrane]

He probably did no such thing. As I recall that is just a feeling that Gerry had, that he may have been in the apartment at the same time as him. Whenever people go through traumatic experiences they have many different ideas as to what happened. I suspect this was just one of those.

 In that case,  Jane Tanner could not  have seen the abductor making off with Madeleine at 915pm,  as she claimed

At that exact moment Gerry McCann was standing in the street  (  chatting to tennis buddy Jed  )  directly outside the gate that lead to the open patio doors

The abductor certainly didn't pass by Gerry and Jez to get into the apartment  (  to reappear moments later crossing the road with a child in his arms   ) 

If he wasn't  already in the apartment when Gerry did his check at 9.10  then Jane Tanner couldn't have seen him leaving with Madeleine five minutes later

The Abductor obviously left by the front door.  It has never been suggested that he left by the Patio Doors.
Think about it.

I'm not talking about how he  got  out  of the apartment  ...  I'm talking about how he got in  to it

It had to be by the open patio doors,   but Gerry and Jez were standing at the gate directly outside them ...  so he couldn't have got in that way without them seeing him

If he was seen a few moments later by Jane Tanner,  making off with Madeleine, then he would  have    to have already been in there when Gerry did his check moments before

But could he not simply have had a key?

There were many keys for each apartment used by workmen, cleaners, owners etc.

Where did  you find that information ?  ...  about the  'many'  keys available to all and sundry,  I mean

[Eleanor]

We have been told by the McCanns that they think the abductor had been observing them all week,  noting their checking regime  ...  and even that he may have been in the apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared

So why would this note - taking abductor have placed himself inside the apartment at the exact time he would expect the children to be checked on  ... and then  'hide'  ( behind the door is Gerry's prefered  place  ) 

That makes no sense at all

It makes perfect sense to me.  Why would he not have hidden behind the door?  I don't suppose that he wanted to be caught.

Perfect sense  ?

Don't you think it would have made more sense to have gone into the apartment just after  a check had been made  ...  rather than just before one was due  ?

It might have done, if he knew precisely when that would be.  But according to you all, the McCanns were haphazard to say the least.  So perhaps he thought he had longer than he actually did have.
You can't have it every which way.  And it was possible to hide.

[Eleanor]

Look now, when did anyone need a key to get OUT of a house.  Do any of you need a key to get OUT of your houses?  I have never needed a key to get OUT of any of my houses.

[icabodcrane]

We have been told by the McCanns that they think the abductor had been observing them all week,  noting their checking regime  ...  and even that he may have been in the apartment the night before Madeleine disappeared

So why would this note - taking abductor have placed himself inside the apartment at the exact time he would expect the children to be checked on  ... and then  'hide'  ( behind the door is Gerry's prefered  place  ) 

That makes no sense at all

It makes perfect sense to me.  Why would he not have hidden behind the door?  I don't suppose that he wanted to be caught.

Perfect sense  ?

Don't you think it would have made more sense to have gone into the apartment just after  a check had been made  ...  rather than just before one was due  ?

It might have done, if he knew precisely when that would be.  But according to you all, the McCanns were haphazard to say the least.  So perhaps he thought he had longer than he actually did have.
You can't have it every which way.  And it was possible to hide.

What do you mean  'you all'  Eleanor  ?

It's my post you are responding to,  and I have never mentioned anything about the haphazardness of the McCann's checking regime

The McCanns insist they were being watched by the abductor that week  ...  and they insist their checking rituals were precise and routine

So why did he choose the worse possible moment to carry out his meticulously planned abduction ?

[sadie]

My dear Bod [is Bod ok?  The rest is too long.]

Have you never stayed in a big complex?  Hotels or apartments?

Everyone to do with the place has a master .. or at least has access to a key ... and the handing out of keys to various personnel is very casual at most places.


Now what do you think about this Bod?

1) There had been a series of burglaries at OC where entrance was thru the front door.  No break in .. so obviously a key was used ?  Mrs Fenns flat, above 5A, was entered this way ... and that was just a few weeks before The McCanns arrived.

2)  Holidaymakers, now were they on honeymoon, I forget?  Anyway a holidaying couple who were renting 5A just before The Mccanns, were truly upset because the cleaning ladies/maids were just walking into the apartment without warning.  Coming in thru a locked front door !


What do you think about that Bod?

[icabodcrane]

So why did he choose the worse possible moment to carry out his meticulously planned abduction ?

As it turns out, it wasn't the worst possible moment to carry out his meticulously planned abduction was it? Was he caught?  Has he been identified?  Seems to me he got clean away with it, a wholly successful abduction in other words (unfortunately).

Quite remarkable isn't it  ?

There he is,  this audacious abductor,  choosing to go into an apartment to steal a child away at the exact time he knows the childs father will be there  ...  hiding in such a confined space with aplomb  ...  then without care for any disturbance or noise made, he opens the window and shutters, for no real reason at all,  because he intends leaving through the front door anyway  ...  and off he boldly strides with the sleeping child in his arms  (  another stroke of luck there, in that she didn't  wake up  )  ...  straight across the road he unhesitatingly marches,  within yards  of the child's father,  his mate and a woman walking directly towards him  ...  and gets clean away

Remarkable indeed 

[icabodcrane]

My dear Bod [is Bod ok?  The rest is too long.]

Have you never stayed in a big complex?  Hotels or apartments?

Everyone to do with the place has a master .. or at least has access to a key ... and the handing out of keys to various personnel is very casual at most places.


Now what do you think about this Bod?

1) There had been a series of burglaries at OC where entrance was thru the front door.  No break in .. so obviously a key was used ?  Mrs Fenns flat, above 5A, was entered this way ... and that was just a few weeks before The McCanns arrived.

2)  Holidaymakers, now were they on honeymoon, I forget?  Anyway a holidaying couple who were renting 5A just before The Mccanns, were truly upset because the cleaning ladies/maids were just walking into the apartment without warning.  Coming in thru a locked front door !


What do you think about that Bod?

I don't mind Bod  ...  I won't call you Sad though  (  that seems a bit unkind ) 

Whilst  cleaners/ chambermaids/maintenance staff use master keys to access rooms in their working hours,  they are returned at the end of the working day   ...  they don't put them in their back pockets and go home with them