Cadaver dogs are unreliable - Eugene Zapata

[Venturi Swirl]

Perhaps they did use them, but had no alerts. If the tip off warranted any investigation, then they may as well go the whole hog and dig the place up irrespective.

if they used dogs but there were no alerts and then they find a body what can we deduce from this regarding dog reliability?  Surely if dogs are that reliable all that needs happen is for dogs to be brought in to the house and garden and if there are no alerts then there can be no body?

[faithlilly]

But should still be detectable by a cadaver dog worth it’s sausages, surely?

Do we know cadaver dogs haven’t been used already ?

[The General]

if they used dogs but there were no alerts and then they find a body what can we deduce from this regarding dog reliability?  Surely if dogs are that reliable all that needs happen is for dogs to be brought in to the house and garden and if there are no alerts then there can be no body?

There may be some protocol that they follow that requires a search irrespective of dog alerts, although this would negate the requirement to send the dogs in.
Or perhaps the dogs weren't available, but then, it's not as if the unfortunate victim is going anywhere any time soon.
I dunno....there did seem to be a very convenient track that runs along side the house.

[Venturi Swirl]

Do we know cadaver dogs haven’t been used already ?

No news report has made mention of them, and often they do when they are being used in a high profile body search.

[Sunny]

Why is there all this speculation on whether any dogs alerted on not when we don't even know if the dogs were used to search that site or not.

Pointless IMO.

[misty]

Why is there all this speculation on whether any dogs alerted on not when we don't even know if the dogs were used to search that site or not.

Pointless IMO.

The police had had a specific tip-off back in 2002, which was not properly followed up at the time. Irrespective of any dog alerts, the concrete panel in the garage would require removing anyway. Dogs have been known to fail to alert to buried bodies wrapped in plastic sheeting.

[Venturi Swirl]

Why is there all this speculation on whether any dogs alerted on not when we don't even know if the dogs were used to search that site or not.

Pointless IMO.

My original question was to ask why, if they had been used, it has beennecessary to do such extensive excavation when dogs are supposed to be able to pinpoint the exact location of a body.  If they haven’t been used I wonder why not.  If you find my posts pointless then just scroll past them, problem solved.

[faithlilly]

My original question was to ask why, if they had been used, it has beennecessary to do such extensive excavation when dogs are supposed to be able to pinpoint the exact location of a body.  If they haven’t been used I wonder why not.  If you find my posts pointless then just scroll past them, problem solved.

Extensive excavations ? I believe it’s a certain section of someone’s back garden so hardly ‘extensive’. Even if dogs had pinpointed the site I’ve yet to find one who can dig up concrete, have you ?

[Sunny]

My original question was to ask why, if they had been used, it has beennecessary to do such extensive excavation when dogs are supposed to be able to pinpoint the exact location of a body.  If they haven’t been used I wonder why not.  If you find my posts pointless then just scroll past them, problem solved.

And my answer to yours wasn't that your post was pointless. My answer explained that they were removing concrete. That isn't done in a few minutes VS.

[Robittybob1]

And my answer to yours wasn't that your post was pointless. My answer explained that they were removing concrete. That isn't done in a few minutes VS.

I think one factor to be considered is the question - when was the concrete poured?  Before or after the victim went missing?

[Sunny]

I think one factor to be considered is the question - when was the concrete poured?  Before or after the victim went missing?

If the police are digging up the concrete I believe it was obviously after she went missing.

[Robittybob1]

If the police are digging up the concrete I believe it was obviously after she went missing.

One would hope so.

Unless the builders on site were part of the plot it would be unlikely to be the day of the pour.
But any time after the boxing is in place would be ok.

But if it was your mother's place you might be able to convince her to build over a burial site.
"Police are searching at a house in Sutton Coldfield, Birmingham, once owned by the mother of John Cannan - the prime suspect in Suzy's killing." https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-46027522

[Sunny]

The police had had a specific tip-off back in 2002, which was not properly followed up at the time. Irrespective of any dog alerts, the concrete panel in the garage would require removing anyway. Dogs have been known to fail to alert to buried bodies wrapped in plastic sheeting.

It would be the concrete pad on which the garage stood misty, not a panel.

You say dogs have been know to fail to alert to buried bodies wrapped in plastic sheeting.  To me you appear to be implying a general statement that all dogs would not alert. The relevant question IMO is has Eddie ever failed to alert to a buried body wrapped in plastic sheeting. I think the answer to that is no.   IMO your statement on this has no validity in the McCann case and could have no validity anywhere else without a cite.

[Brietta]

It would be the concrete pad on which the garage stood misty, not a panel.

You say dogs have been know to fail to alert to buried bodies wrapped in plastic sheeting.  To me you appear to be implying a general statement that all dogs would not alert. The relevant question IMO is has Eddie ever failed to alert to a buried body wrapped in plastic sheeting. I think the answer to that is no.   IMO your statement on this has no validity in the McCann case and could have no validity anywhere else without a cite.

Please think carefully about the implication of the following statement for which a cite is provided.

The cadaver dog was apparently unable to make an alert when the item for inspection was wrapped in brown paper and only did so when the paper wrapping was slashed on request.



Snip
He said they then went to a Detroit Police Department evidence room, where investigators wrapped Bianca's car seat in brown paper and hid it in an office within a number of rooms.

Grime said there was no response during the first search, when the car seat was sealed inside the brown paper. He then asked officers to put a slit in the paper and move the car seat to another room.

"The second time, when the dog got close to the package, he put his nose in the package and gave a positive response," Grime said.
http://eddieandkeela.blogspot.com/2012/10/expert-testifies-that-cadaver-dog-gave.html

[Robittybob1]

It would be the concrete pad on which the garage stood misty, not a panel.

You say dogs have been know to fail to alert to buried bodies wrapped in plastic sheeting.  To me you appear to be implying a general statement that all dogs would not alert. The relevant question IMO is has Eddie ever failed to alert to a buried body wrapped in plastic sheeting. I think the answer to that is no.   IMO your statement on this has no validity in the McCann case and could have no validity anywhere else without a cite.

Thick plastic is often used under concrete flooring too.  I think the reliability being questioned here is the reliability of an alert rather that a non alert.  Looking at what is the chances the dog has made an error (a false positive) rather than the chances of the dog not alerting to an actual body deposition site (called false negative).