Author Topic: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights  (Read 530302 times)

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Offline misty

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #135 on: September 11, 2017, 08:52:42 PM »
A judge can decide based on evidence bruises etc.  You might be wrong about that.

It can also be determined via a private prosecution for damages.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #136 on: September 11, 2017, 08:57:45 PM »
It can also be determined via a private prosecution for damages.
They use a different word in that case, but it means about the same as guilty to most people.
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Offline Miss Taken Identity

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #137 on: September 11, 2017, 09:03:07 PM »
A judge can decide based on evidence bruises etc.  You might be wrong about that.

Not of person A's lawyer said the bruises were self inflicted and or were done by someone else. 8(0(*
'Never underestimate the power of stupid people'... George Carlin

Offline Brietta

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #138 on: September 11, 2017, 09:10:33 PM »
That is why I asked you. Evidently, you don't comprehend the implications.

The McCann's have no grounds to go to the E.C.H.R.

Never did.

All bluster and arrogance on their part.

I.M.H.O. obviously.

Time will tell won't it.

The McCann legals think they have.  The Mccanns think they have.  Not that it matters I think they have.

So let's just wait and see if their application is accepted by the court;  I think there is every chance it will be.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #139 on: September 11, 2017, 09:10:58 PM »
When the alleged abductors are finally arrested, the McCanns will also have the option of suing the Portuguese police for the incompetent way the first team handled matters. Think Harvey Proctor.

If an abductor is arrested it doesn't necessarily follow that the first investigation was incompetent.

Harvey Proctor's case is entirely different in that there's a report in existence which strongly criticises the Met's handling of Operation Midland as well as the Met having publicly apologised to him. I expect he'll get an out of court settlement as others already have.
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Offline Brietta

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #140 on: September 11, 2017, 09:19:34 PM »
How did the courts verify the facts in the book & documentary if not by using the official files? Are the contents of the official files not all legal documents?

The SC changed the filing article from 277/1 to 277/2 which effectively changed the opinion of the PP/AG at the time of filing regarding the reasons behind the filing. Innocence does not need to be proven when the nature of a crime, if indeed there was one, has not been established. Even nine years after the archival, the SC is not able to legally rule that the McCanns have not demonstrated their innocence - in fact, it's quite the opposite state of affairs.

I actually see this whole fiasco as a cop-out by the SC. By making the decision they did, Amaral finally had his sequestered assets released to him, so mission accomplished for him. The lawyers & the court system will be the
bodies fighting for their money which is of no concern to the SC. There is no guarantee any claim to the ECHR will be successful & even if it is, it won't be the SC's problem but merely another ruling for their archives. The state will foot any compensation awarded by ECHR, not Amaral.

All IMO.

"I actually see this whole fiasco as a cop-out by the SC. By making the decision they did, Amaral finally had his sequestered assets released to him, so mission accomplished for him. The lawyers & the court system will be the
bodies fighting for their money which is of no concern to the SC. There is no guarantee any claim to the ECHR will be successful & even if it is, it won't be the SC's problem but merely another ruling for their archives. The state will foot any compensation awarded by ECHR, not Amaral." Misty

Maybe I'm just in a cynical mood tonight, Misty.  But all of that makes perfect sense to me.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #141 on: September 11, 2017, 09:25:28 PM »
Time will tell won't it.

The McCann legals think they have.  The Mccanns think they have.  Not that it matters I think they have.

So let's just wait and see if their application is accepted by the court;  I think there is every chance it will be.

No way Jose.


Offline Robittybob1

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #142 on: September 11, 2017, 09:38:45 PM »
Not of person A's lawyer said the bruises were self inflicted and or were done by someone else. 8(0(*
Judges are wise people in most cases. 
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Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #143 on: September 11, 2017, 09:54:08 PM »
Judges are wise people in most cases.

The law requires a charge to be proved beyond reasonable doubt. An accusation by one person against another person with no witnesses doesn't meet that criterion.
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Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #144 on: September 11, 2017, 10:36:09 PM »
How did the courts verify the facts in the book & documentary if not by using the official files? Are the contents of the official files not all legal documents?

The SC changed the filing article from 277/1 to 277/2 which effectively changed the opinion of the PP/AG at the time of filing regarding the reasons behind the filing. Innocence does not need to be proven when the nature of a crime, if indeed there was one, has not been established. Even nine years after the archival, the SC is not able to legally rule that the McCanns have not demonstrated their innocence - in fact, it's quite the opposite state of affairs.

I actually see this whole fiasco as a cop-out by the SC. By making the decision they did, Amaral finally had his sequestered assets released to him, so mission accomplished for him. The lawyers & the court system will be the
bodies fighting for their money which is of no concern to the SC. There is no guarantee any claim to the ECHR will be successful & even if it is, it won't be the SC's problem but merely another ruling for their archives. The state will foot any compensation awarded by ECHR, not Amaral.

All IMO.
How did it change the opinion of the PP?
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Offline slartibartfast

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #145 on: September 11, 2017, 10:47:33 PM »
I thought everyone has.  Haven't you ?

Doesn't exactly answer the question...
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Offline misty

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #146 on: September 11, 2017, 11:45:02 PM »
How did it change the opinion of the PP?

The AG decided that the case was to be filed under 277/1 - the crime has not been verified or the defendant has not committed the crime under investigation.

The SC decided, in their not-so-infinite wisdom, that what had actually been shown in the volumes of files which they hadn't read, was that the public prosecution hadn't collected sufficient signs of the verification of the crime or of its agents - thus altering the context of the application of law in a legal document.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LEGAL_SUMMARY.htm
*snipped

The archiving reported is worded as follows:-
- Despite all of this, it was not possible to obtain any piece of evidence that would allow for a medium man, under the light of the criteria of logics, of normality and of the general rules of experience, to formulate any lucid, sensate, serious and honest conclusion about the circumstances under which the child was removed from the apartment (whether dead or alive, whether killed in a neglectful homicide or an intended homicide, whether the victim of a targeted abduction or an opportunistic abduction), nor even to produce a consistent prognosis about her destiny and inclusively - the most dramatic - to establish whether she is still alive or if she is dead, as seems more likely.

But therefore we do not possess any minimally solid and rigorous foundation in order to be able to state, with the safety that is requested, which was or were the exact and precise crime(s) that was or were practised on the person of the minor Madeleine McCann - apart from the supposed but dismissed crime of exposure or abandonment - or to hold anyone responsible over its authorship.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #147 on: September 12, 2017, 12:02:28 AM »
"the supposed but dismissed crime of exposure or abandonment"  some people need to remember that the PJ dismissed this supposed crime.
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stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #148 on: September 12, 2017, 03:18:38 AM »
"the supposed but dismissed crime of exposure or abandonment"  some people need to remember that the PJ dismissed this supposed crime.

Have you forgotten what the Portuguese former Minister said on this ?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #149 on: September 12, 2017, 05:01:50 AM »
Have you forgotten what the Portuguese former Minister said on this ?
No because I have never known it.  You tell me please?  Does he have jurisdiction in this case or was it just his opinion?
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