Author Topic: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights  (Read 530286 times)

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Offline Carana

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1260 on: June 18, 2018, 11:50:30 PM »
"You do not examine legislation in the light of the benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in the light of the wrongs it would do and the harms it would cause if improperly administered".


Tony Blair once wanted to have a law where a person could be arrested "if it looked like they were about to commit a crime".
"Liberals" by default will provide all the legal means whereby totalitarians can legitimately and easily take over...OT I know.

Ok, thanks.

Offline faithlilly

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1261 on: June 19, 2018, 12:01:35 AM »
I've no idea what he actually thought. IMO, he got catapulted in but couldn't take it from scratch as there were arguidos and the clock was ticking. He basicly had to get to the bottom of as many loose ends as possible to clarify if there was any evidence of a crime and whether any of the arguidos were involved. If so then slap whomever with charges, if not, the investigation would have to be shelved. There was simply not enough time to start going systematically through every potential lead as the UK police have been doing (nor the resources).

I don’t remember Rebelo asking Murat to a reconstitution. Do you ?  The McCanns and their friends were asked. What does that tell you ?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1262 on: June 19, 2018, 12:36:50 AM »
I don’t remember Rebelo asking Murat to a reconstitution. Do you ?  The McCanns and their friends were asked. What does that tell you ?
Staying at home with your mum shouldn't be too difficult.
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Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1263 on: June 19, 2018, 06:24:52 AM »
I can't see any real intention by the PJ to do a reconstruction.  IMO they were just seeing whether the  Tapas 7 and others were willing to attend.

An investigation is archived when enough evidence has been gathered to reach certain conclusions (277/1), or when it hasn't been possible to gather enough evidence (277/2)

By refusing to attend the reconstitution the witnesses prevented the PJ from gathering evidence. (277/2)

It could be that the PJ knew the request would be refused and the significance of that to the archiving process. It's clear that the witnesses, suspects and their lawyers didn't understand it's significance.
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Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1264 on: June 19, 2018, 07:00:37 AM »
In it's rejection of the request for annulment of it's ruling the SC made it's position on the archiving dispatch clear again;

In fact, that dispatch was not proclaimed by virtue of the Public Ministry having gained the conviction that the appellants had not committed any crime (cf. art. 277 of the CPP).

The filing, in this case, was decided because it was not possible for Public Ministry to obtain sufficient evidence of the practice of crimes by the appellants (cf. the cited art. 277-2)
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

If 277/1 was the correct article as the McCann team argued, the investigation couldn't have been reopened;

The fact that the aforementioned “memorandum for the media”, published by the Attorney General office on the same day as the filing order, informed that the investigation could be reopened “if new evidence arose that could lead to serious, pertinent and consequential proceedings”, precisely points out that the order was issued pursuant to article 277-2 of the CPP.

In fact, if the investigation had been closed according to the terms of the first paragraph of the same article, it could not be reopened
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm
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Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1265 on: June 19, 2018, 08:27:33 AM »
In it's rejection of the request for annulment of it's ruling the SC made it's position on the archiving dispatch clear again;

In fact, that dispatch was not proclaimed by virtue of the Public Ministry having gained the conviction that the appellants had not committed any crime (cf. art. 277 of the CPP).

The filing, in this case, was decided because it was not possible for Public Ministry to obtain sufficient evidence of the practice of crimes by the appellants (cf. the cited art. 277-2)
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

If 277/1 was the correct article as the McCann team argued, the investigation couldn't have been reopened;

The fact that the aforementioned “memorandum for the media”, published by the Attorney General office on the same day as the filing order, informed that the investigation could be reopened “if new evidence arose that could lead to serious, pertinent and consequential proceedings”, precisely points out that the order was issued pursuant to article 277-2 of the CPP.

In fact, if the investigation had been closed according to the terms of the first paragraph of the same article, it could not be reopened
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

The case was closed under item 2771/1...and it was reopened before the SC changed it to 2771/2.

Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1266 on: June 19, 2018, 09:17:07 AM »
The case was closed under item 2771/1...and it was reopened before the SC changed it to 2771/2.

The archiving dispatch quoted 277/1. The attorney General's press release at the time described 277/2. It seems the mistake wasn't noticed at the time.
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Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1267 on: June 19, 2018, 09:20:44 AM »
The archiving dispatch quoted 277/1. The attorney General's press release at the time described 277/2. It seems the mistake wasn't noticed at the time.
You are avoiding the point... The case was re-opened yet it was, archived under 277/1...which contradicts your claim..
Do you have, a, cite to support your claim that the case could not be reopened under 277/1....because it  was...
Was, this just another mistake

Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1268 on: June 19, 2018, 09:25:14 AM »
So according to gunit a case can not be reopened if filed under 277/1 .. It doesn't make sense
So if a case is archived and someone confesses the case can't be Re opened.... That can't be true
More like the case can only be Re opened if new evidence cones to light... That makes sense all round

Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1269 on: June 19, 2018, 09:36:07 AM »
The archiving dispatch quoted 277/1. The attorney General's press release at the time described 277/2. It seems the mistake wasn't noticed at the time.

in your opinion...which imo..is looking a little suspect

Offline G-Unit

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1270 on: June 19, 2018, 09:59:03 AM »
You are avoiding the point... The case was re-opened yet it was, archived under 277/1...which contradicts your claim..
Do you have, a, cite to support your claim that the case could not be reopened under 277/1....because it  was...
Was, this just another mistake

In fact, if the investigation had been closed according to the terms of the first paragraph of the same article, it could not be reopened (cf. CPP, reviewed, 2016, 2nd ed., by Henriques Gaspar, Santos Cabral, Maia Costa, Oliveira Mendes, Pereira Madeira and Henriques da Graça, pp.929, 932-3.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

Article 277 - Archiving of the investigation

1 - The Public Ministry shall, by dispatch, close the investigation, as soon as it has gathered sufficient evidence that the crime was not confirmed, that the arguido did not practice it in any way or that the procedure is legally inadmissible
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Annulment_request.htm

It's obvious that a crime was committed, because Madeleine disappeared. There was no evidence saying that a crime wasn't committed.

Although the crime wasn't identified, it wasn't possible to gather 'sufficient evidence' to prove that the arguidos 'did not practice it (the unidentified crime) in any way.'
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Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1271 on: June 19, 2018, 10:03:15 AM »
In fact, if the investigation had been closed according to the terms of the first paragraph of the same article, it could not be reopened (cf. CPP, reviewed, 2016, 2nd ed., by Henriques Gaspar, Santos Cabral, Maia Costa, Oliveira Mendes, Pereira Madeira and Henriques da Graça, pp.929, 932-3.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

Article 277 - Archiving of the investigation

1 - The Public Ministry shall, by dispatch, close the investigation, as soon as it has gathered sufficient evidence that the crime was not confirmed, that the arguido did not practice it in any way or that the procedure is legally inadmissible
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Annulment_request.htm

It's obvious that a crime was committed, because Madeleine disappeared. There was no evidence saying that a crime wasn't committed.

Although the crime wasn't identified, it wasn't possible to gather 'sufficient evidence' to prove that the arguidos 'did not practice it (the unidentified crime) in any way.'

Could you explain how the investigation was re-opened... On what basis

I haven't had time to check the reliability of your cite... Is the cite you quoted made by the court or is it something added by someone else.... An amaral supporter perhaps
« Last Edit: June 19, 2018, 10:23:01 AM by Davel »

Offline Venturi Swirl

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1272 on: June 19, 2018, 10:22:01 AM »
In fact, if the investigation had been closed according to the terms of the first paragraph of the same article, it could not be reopened (cf. CPP, reviewed, 2016, 2nd ed., by Henriques Gaspar, Santos Cabral, Maia Costa, Oliveira Mendes, Pereira Madeira and Henriques da Graça, pp.929, 932-3.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/STJ_21_03_2017_Rejected.htm

Article 277 - Archiving of the investigation

1 - The Public Ministry shall, by dispatch, close the investigation, as soon as it has gathered sufficient evidence that the crime was not confirmed, that the arguido did not practice it in any way or that the procedure is legally inadmissible
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Annulment_request.htm

It's obvious that a crime was committed, because Madeleine disappeared. There was no evidence saying that a crime wasn't committed.

Although the crime wasn't identified, it wasn't possible to gather 'sufficient evidence' to prove that the arguidos 'did not practice it (the unidentified crime) in any way.'
In theory then it should be possible to write a book about Robert Murat’s involvement in the disappearance of Madeleine McCann and get away with it, in Portugal at any rate.
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline Brietta

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1273 on: June 19, 2018, 10:25:09 AM »
Judiciary Police press statement Polícia Judiciária

With thanks to Joana Morais for translation

Similarly to what happens in all the cases of missing children, notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation concerning her disappearance, and as was always publicly stated, the Judiciary Police continued to be attentive to any and all information likely to enable the understanding of the whereabouts of the minor Madeleine McCann, the circumstances in which her disappearance occurred and the identity of its author(s).

With that objective, the National Director of the Judiciary Police, in March 2011, assigned to a team of investigators from the North Directorate a task to re-examine the whole wide range of information contained in the inquest, with the aim to identify information whose further understanding could be revealed useful and possible.

That reanalysis task, which took place during the last two and a half years, helped identify new evidence, which by imposing further investigation, meet the requirements set by article 279º no 1 of the Code of Criminal Procedure for the reopening of the investigation.

The proposal was made in conformity to the Hon. Prosecutor in the district of Portimão, the same was granted.

October 24, 2013
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Nigel/id466.htm
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Mr Gray

Re: McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights
« Reply #1274 on: June 19, 2018, 10:39:21 AM »
Judiciary Police press statement Polícia Judiciária

With thanks to Joana Morais for translation

Similarly to what happens in all the cases of missing children, notwithstanding the formal archival of the investigation concerning her disappearance, and as was always publicly stated, the Judiciary Police continued to be attentive to any and all information likely to enable the understanding of the whereabouts of the minor Madeleine McCann, the circumstances in which her disappearance occurred and the identity of its author(s).

With that objective, the National Director of the Judiciary Police, in March 2011, assigned to a team of investigators from the North Directorate a task to re-examine the whole wide range of information contained in the inquest, with the aim to identify information whose further understanding could be revealed useful and possible.

That reanalysis task, which took place during the last two and a half years, helped identify new evidence, which by imposing further investigation, meet the requirements set by article 279º no 1 of the Code of Criminal Procedure for the reopening of the investigation.

The proposal was made in conformity to the Hon. Prosecutor in the district of Portimão, the same was granted.

October 24, 2013
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Nigel/id466.htm

This confirms my posts on the subject
« Last Edit: June 19, 2018, 10:47:29 AM by Davel »