Is this another example of a potentially crucial error by the VRD handler?

[G-Unit]

Was the alert to the clothing a precise alert or a general area alert? Was the alert to CC a general area alert or a precise alert? Was the alert in the garden a precise alert or general area alert? Can you see how the handler could have made a decision? E.g. was the purported alert to CC in the villa really an alert to something on the table, the chair or the far cupboard? Keela wasn't deployed so there may well have been blood deposits at any one of the aforementioned places  - a possible lost forensic opportunity. "

Let's continue to debate the alert which led to this thread being created; the one behind the couch. The alert which you claim is an example of a potentially crucial error by the dog's handler.

How do you know???? Obviously not by comparing that alert with other alerts, so how?

[G-Unit]

That's a pity ... so sorry about that ... but it seems perfectly clear to me so I can't help you any further than I have already.

I think it is perfectly valid to discuss what Eddie was doing at the couch from which Amaral thought Madeleine had fallen to her death ... making it quite an important piece of the jigsaw.

I also think it's valid to discuss Eddie's alert behind the couch. That's why I'm trying to ascertain on what basis a poster is accusing the dog handler of making a mistake.

[Alice Purjorick]

"It is not an exact science".  - Kate McCann

So?
Neither is mechanical engineering.

[G-Unit]

So?
Neither is mechanical engineering.

Or medicine.

[Brietta]

I also think it's valid to discuss Eddie's alert behind the couch. That's why I'm trying to ascertain on what basis a poster is accusing the dog handler of making a mistake.

Absolutely admirable ... and the way to do that is in my opinion through amicable discussion ... ultimately bearing the dog owner's repeated caveat in mind.

[misty]

Let's continue to debate the alert which led to this thread being created; the one behind the couch. The alert which you claim is an example of a potentially crucial error by the dog's handler.

How do you know???? Obviously not by comparing that alert with other alerts, so how?

I can see that the dog's nose is at the end of the sofa prior to the alert. The dog by-passes the area to which Grime stated the alert related to - you can see the movement of the curtains behind the sofa, then see the dog's nose, then see the dog's tail after it turns around & barks.
Can you show what evidence there is that Eddie was alerting to the location Grime stated any more than you can show what evidence there was Eddie alerted to CC - apart from the word of the handler?

[Robittybob1]

So?
Neither is mechanical engineering.

Why isn't it?

[Robittybob1]

I can see that the dog's nose is at the end of the sofa prior to the alert. The dog by-passes the area to which Grime stated the alert related to - you can see the movement of the curtains behind the sofa, then see the dog's nose, then see the dog's tail after it turns around & barks.
Can you show what evidence there is that Eddie was alerting to the location Grime stated any more than you can show what evidence there was Eddie alerted to CC - apart from the word of the handler?

You would need multiple cameras following Eddie to keep track of his every move.

[G-Unit]

I can see that the dog's nose is at the end of the sofa prior to the alert. The dog by-passes the area to which Grime stated the alert related to - you can see the movement of the curtains behind the sofa, then see the dog's nose, then see the dog's tail after it turns around & barks.
Can you show what evidence there is that Eddie was alerting to the location Grime stated any more than you can show what evidence there was Eddie alerted to CC - apart from the word of the handler?

As we don't know what Eddie alerted to behind the couch we can't judge if the position of his nose just before the alert mattered or not. Grime said on 31st July, during the inspection;

what I saw was that approximately in the centre of the wall where the window is, just along the tile area between the tiles and the wall, he's been scenting there a lot stronger than he has anywhere else and the when he's gone out there the second time he has decided yes that's what I'm looking for and that's when he has given me the bark indication.
http:/
/www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

The really significant alert was given by Keela;

 At this point over here where the victim recovery dog has indicated, as you saw on the video, the crime scene dog had actually given me what we call a passive indication where she freezes in this spot here which would indicate to me that there is some human blood there
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

[G-Unit]

You would need multiple cameras following Eddie to keep track of his every move.

And to make your opinion worthy of consideration you would need to explain why your opinion is more valid than that of his very experienced handler.

[Robittybob1]

And to make your opinion worthy of consideration you would need to explain why your opinion is more valid than that of his very experienced handler.

In rugby games they often revert to the video referee for confirmation.  Same here, everything is happening, blink and you've missed it.  The only reason we are discussing this thread is that the camera angle was different to what Martin Grime could see.

[Alice Purjorick]

Why isn't it?

The posh way of putting it is because materials particularly alloys are not homogeneous with consistent properties.
Sections are made to standard sizes not a calculated size.
"MacInhairies" used to describe it best referring to a "factor of ignorance" when calculating safety factors.

[Alice Purjorick]

In rugby games they often revert to the video referee for confirmation.  Same here, everything is happening, blink and you've missed it.  The only reason we are discussing this thread is that the camera angle was different to what Martin Grime could see.

I rather incline to the view it is only being discussed because posters know what a dog is.
See "The Bicycle Shed" in C Northcote Parkinsons book 
or Bike Shedding.

[misty]

As we don't know what Eddie alerted to behind the couch we can't judge if the position of his nose just before the alert mattered or not. Grime said on 31st July, during the inspection;

what I saw was that approximately in the centre of the wall where the window is, just along the tile area between the tiles and the wall, he's been scenting there a lot stronger than he has anywhere else and the when he's gone out there the second time he has decided yes that's what I'm looking for and that's when he has given me the bark indication.
http:/
/www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

The really significant alert was given by Keela;

 At this point over here where the victim recovery dog has indicated, as you saw on the video, the crime scene dog had actually given me what we call a passive indication where she freezes in this spot here which would indicate to me that there is some human blood there
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

I asked if those 2 alerts by Keela were fortuitous rather than based on what Grime believed Eddie had alerted to. We will never know what forensics may have been harvested from the end of the sofa because the opportunity was missed.

[G-Unit]

I asked if those 2 alerts by Keela were fortuitous rather than based on what Grime believed Eddie had alerted to. We will never know what forensics may have been harvested from the end of the sofa because the opportunity was missed.

Unless, of course, your opinion is wrong and the handler's was correct. I have seen nothing which suggests that your opinion is more valid than his.