Jeremy Corbyn for PM!!

[faithlilly]

By him and his supporters of course!  You’re always telling us about what a principled man he is aren’t you?

Nobody’s perfect.

[faithlilly]

Oh please Faithlilly, spare me the sanctimonious, emotive claptrap.

So which of those things aren’t happening ?

[Venturi Swirl]

So which of those things aren’t happening ?

Well for a start my “nan” isn’t lying in her own urine, she’s kicking up the daisies.  Of course the NHS is in crisis and social care is a massive and growing problem, everyone recognises that.  Both the Tories and Labour committed to spending huge amounts of money on the NHS in their manifestos, Labour were also committed to freedom of movement for all if Diane Abbott was to be believed, which could only have meant an even greater strain on the NHS as anyone could have come to Britain to make use of our NHS for free. 

 I advocated “caring capitalism” but I did not claim that the Tories were advocates of same did I??  You seem to be convinced that I am a Tory simply because I think Jeremy is a useless leader. 

[faithlilly]

Oh well you win then.  Because I can’t provide 201 names, then [ censored word]emitism does not exist within the Labour Party and was simply invented by Corbyn’s enemies.  Nice one, enjoy your victory.   

I didn’t say [ censored word]emitism didn’t exist, in a party with a membership of half a million, it would be stupid to assume that it didn’t but it didn’t come with Corbyn and he didn’t turn a blind eye to it as his investigation into [ censored word]emitism and the procedures he has put in place to deal with it shows.


And I didn’t ask for 201 members or supporters who have been victims of [ censored word]emitism within the Labour Party, 50 will do, what with it being such a widespread problem that should be easy, surely ?

[faithlilly]

Well for a start my “nan” isn’t lying in her own urine, she’s kicking up the daisies.  Of course the NHS is in crisis and social care is a massive and growing problem, everyone recognises that.  Both the Tories and Labour committed to spending huge amounts of money on the NHS in their manifestos, Labour were also committed to freedom of movement for all if Diane Abbott was to be believed, which could only have meant an even greater strain on the NHS as anyone could have come to Britain to make use of our NHS for free. 

 I advocated “caring capitalism” but I did not claim that the Tories were advocates of same did I??  You seem to be convinced that I am a Tory simply because I think Jeremy is a useless leader.

And while free movement ceases those NHS and social care jobs won’t be  filled which compounds the crisis in understaffing that already exists.

Are you really suggesting that there isn’t a direct connection between the capitalist system we are following atm and the shocking poverty and lack of resources afflicting our public services ?

[Venturi Swirl]

And while free movement ceases those NHS and social care jobs won’t be  filled which compounds the crisis in understaffing that already exists.

Are you really suggesting that there isn’t a direct connection between the capitalist system we are following atm and the shocking poverty and lack of resources afflicting our public services ?

Please supply the data that proves a caring capitalist society (which is what I have advocated) directly causes poverty.  Meanwhile, please look at this list of socialist states and pick the ones you feel have eradicated poverty in their countries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_socialist_states

Incidentally what exactly was Labour’s position of freedom of movement?  That anyone who wanted to live here from anywhere in the world could do so?

[faithlilly]

Please supply the data that proves a caring capitalist society (which is what I have advocated) directly causes poverty.  Meanwhile, please look at this list of socialist states and pick the ones you feel have eradicated poverty in their countries. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_socialist_states

Incidentally what exactly was Labour’s position of freedom of movement?  That anyone who wanted to live here from anywhere in the world could do so?

A caring capitalist society.....isn’t that an oxymoron?

There is no state, capitalist or socialist, that has completely eradicated poverty.

[Venturi Swirl]

A caring capitalist society.....isn’t that an oxymoron?

There is no state, capitalist or socialist, that has completely eradicated poverty.

No,  but it is your contention is it not that capitalism is directly responsible for poverty, and that the answer is socialism, so it stands to reason that socialist states should have lower levels of poverty.  Kindly point to those socialist states on the list that you believe have succeeded in significantly reducing poverty in their countries. 

[Venturi Swirl]

Meanwhile, back in the real world

“Indeed, capitalism – in the form of enterprise and trade – has been the driving force behind the most remarkable decline in global poverty ever witnessed in human history. In the past 200 years, extreme poverty has collapsed from a whopping 94% of the entire world population to less than 10% today.

This is even more remarkable when you remember the global population has ballooned from one billion to over seven billion in that time, largely due to better life expectancy. Even now, more than 60,000 people on average are escaping extreme poverty every single day”

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/04/capitalism-is-having-an-identity-crisis-but-it-is-still-the-best-system


I couldn’t have put it better myself.  I’m also not interested in a long drawn out argument about which system is better,  I have my views and you have yours, arguing about it won’t change a thing.  And that’s my last word on the subject.
.

[faithlilly]

No,  but it is your contention is it not that capitalism is directly responsible for poverty, and that the answer is socialism, so it stands to reason that socialist states should have lower levels of poverty.  Kindly point to those socialist states on the list that you believe have succeeded in significantly reducing poverty in their countries.

As I have said before we are the fifth richest country in the world yet have some of the worst rates of inequality in the developed world.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2019/nov/27/parts-of-england-have-higher-mortality-rates-than-turkey

And it wasn’t socialism that caused those appalling statistics.

[faithlilly]

Meanwhile, back in the real world

“Indeed, capitalism – in the form of enterprise and trade – has been the driving force behind the most remarkable decline in global poverty ever witnessed in human history. In the past 200 years, extreme poverty has collapsed from a whopping 94% of the entire world population to less than 10% today.

This is even more remarkable when you remember the global population has ballooned from one billion to over seven billion in that time, largely due to better life expectancy. Even now, more than 60,000 people on average are escaping extreme poverty every single day”

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/feb/04/capitalism-is-having-an-identity-crisis-but-it-is-still-the-best-system


I couldn’t have put it better myself.  I’m also not interested in a long drawn out argument about which system is better,  I have my views and you have yours, arguing about it won’t change a thing.  And that’s my last word on the subject.
.

Absolutely but you have to agree that under this particular government brand of capitalism has been used to enrich the few while driving more and more families into poverty ?

[Venturi Swirl]

Absolutely but you have to agree that under this particular government brand of capitalism has been used to enrich the few while driving more and more families into poverty ?

My views have been very clear, I have repeatedly said I am not a supporter of Tory policy, I have nothing further to add.

[faithlilly]

My views have been very clear, I have repeatedly said I am not a supporter of Tory policy, I have nothing further to add.

So if not here, where do you think what you call ‘caring capitalism’ is working ?

[Mr Gray]

So if not here, where do you think what you call ‘caring capitalism’ is working ?

You would have to define working... Do you think the UK would be better off under a Marxist govt.

[faithlilly]

You would have to define working... Do you think the UK would be better off under a Marxist govt.

Could it be much worse ?