The Reconstruction

[Holly Goodhead]

I don't think that makes then bad parents... I don't think the McCanns are bad parents.. They did what they thought was right.  Intolerance of other people's views is not a very constructive or pleasant thing.. Imo

I don't think they're bad parents either, on the contrary, they just made a decision which with the benefit of hindsight was a disaster. 

What I find somewhat irritating though is that they seem unable to hold their hands up and admit leaving 3 children under the age of 4 unsupervised in the unsecured apartment was a disaster, period.  They seem to want to justify it by claiming it was akin to eating in the garden at home and yet we can see it wasn't hence when KM learned of MM's disappearance she did not shout from the balcony but ran to tapas.  Why? Because the distance was too great for her voice to carry.  Then they claim it was not them that committed the crime it was the abductor who stole a little girl from her bed or words to this effect.  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor. 

 

[Mr Gray]

I don't think they're bad parents either, on the contrary, they just made a decision which with the benefit of hindsight was a disaster. 

What I find somewhat irritating though is that they seem unable to hold their hands up and admit leaving 3 children under the age of 4 unsupervised in the unsecured apartment was a disaster, period.  They seem to want to justify it by claiming it was akin to eating in the garden at home and yet we can see it wasn't hence when KM learned of MM's disappearance she did not shout from the balcony but ran to tapas.  Why? Because the distance was too great for her voice to carry.  Then they claim it was not them that committed the crime it was the abductor who stole a little girl from her bed or words to this effect.  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor.

you have studied pschology so I would expect you to understand this even if others dont. They have been through a very traumatic experience. I would think they have been advised by pschologists not to blame themselves as that would send them it a downward spiral. Im sure inside they do put blame on thesmselves and they have said as much....if a women is raped because she got so drunk she couldnt consent should she put blame on herself...no

[jassi]

I don't think they're bad parents either, on the contrary, they just made a decision which with the benefit of hindsight was a disaster. 

What I find somewhat irritating though is that they seem unable to hold their hands up and admit leaving 3 children under the age of 4 unsupervised in the unsecured apartment was a disaster, period.  They seem to want to justify it by claiming it was akin to eating in the garden at home and yet we can see it wasn't hence when KM learned of MM's disappearance she did not shout from the balcony but ran to tapas.  Why? Because the distance was too great for her voice to carry.  Then they claim it was not them that committed the crime it was the abductor who stole a little girl from her bed or words to this effect.  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor.

12 years too late for that - should have been done immediately - IMO

[Miss Taken Identity]

I don't think they're bad parents either, on the contrary, they just made a decision which with the benefit of hindsight was a disaster. 

What I find somewhat irritating though is that they seem unable to hold their hands up and admit leaving 3 children under the age of 4 unsupervised in the unsecured apartment was a disaster, period.  They seem to want to justify it by claiming it was akin to eating in the garden at home and yet we can see it wasn't hence when KM learned of MM's disappearance she did not shout from the balcony but ran to tapas.  Why? Because the distance was too great for her voice to carry.  Then they claim it was not them that committed the crime it was the abductor who stole a little girl from her bed or words to this effect.  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor.

"  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor."

Two errors here Holly>
1.  we do NOT know if they commited a crime
2. The abductor is a theory. Nothng more.


"its this sort of comment that has alienated people"


A whole lot more of what they said. the way they said it. and their behaviour pre/post their daughters disappearance also played a hand it the public not buying into their story.

[Holly Goodhead]

you have studied pschology so I would expect you to understand this even if others dont. They have been through a very traumatic experience. I would think they have been advised by pschologists not to blame themselves as that would send them it a downward spiral. Im sure inside they do put blame on thesmselves and they have said as much....if a women is raped because she got so drunk she couldnt consent should she put blame on herself...no

Yes I agree I'm sure Alan Pike did counsel them to this effect but we also know they received a lot of guidance from others as to how to deal with the public and media eg KM was told when she made an appeal in the early days to avoid showing any emotion as to do so may have given the abductor some perverse kick.  So imo they would have been best placed to avoid trying to justify their decision in leaving the children and/or blaming the abductor.   

[Brietta]

Yes I agree I'm sure Alan Pike did counsel them to this effect but we also know they received a lot of guidance from others as to how to deal with the public and media eg KM was told when she made an appeal in the early days to avoid showing any emotion as to do so may have given the abductor some perverse kick.  So imo they would have been best placed to avoid trying to justify their decision in leaving the children and/or blaming the abductor.   

  ... and a The Reconstruction would have addresses the points raised in your post ... how?

Might it have shown that contrary to your supposition regarding the abductor ... that as time went on and Madeleine wasn't found that her parents were beside themselves at witnessing first hand the lack of coordinated procedures usual when a child goes missing?

[Holly Goodhead]

  ... and a The Reconstruction would have addresses the points raised in your post ... how?

Might it have shown that contrary to your supposition regarding the abductor ... that as time went on and Madeleine wasn't found that her parents were beside themselves at witnessing first hand the lack of coordinated procedures usual when a child goes missing?

I thought KM said she did not want to be part of a reconstruction as to do so would be too traumatic?  We can see from the reconstruction that did take place JT became visibly upset.

Given the state of 5A ie no signs of forced entry and unsecured, coupled with the fact that Portugal doesn't have a history of child abductions from holiday apartments, PJ proceeded on the basis MM had simply wandered off.  All concerned were then faced with cultural, language and legal differences and a highly transient population.  Having looked through the files its difficult to see what more PJ could have done which has been borne out by the fact MET have spent millions over years and got nowhere.

[Holly Goodhead]

"  We know they did not commit a crime but imo its this sort of comment that has alienated people.  They could do with being more contrite and leave it at that instead of trying to justify their actions and blaming the abductor."

Two errors here Holly>
1.  we do NOT know if they commited a crime
2. The abductor is a theory. Nothng more.


"its this sort of comment that has alienated people"


A whole lot more of what they said. the way they said it. and their behaviour pre/post their daughters disappearance also played a hand it the public not buying into their story.

Fair enough. 

[Miss Taken Identity]

Yes I agree I'm sure Alan Pike did counsel them to this effect but we also know they received a lot of guidance from others as to how to deal with the public and media eg KM was told when she made an appeal in the early days to avoid showing any emotion as to do so may have given the abductor some perverse kick.  So imo they would have been best placed to avoid trying to justify their decision in leaving the children and/or blaming the abductor.   

..So Kate says.  If true however, what a great actress!

[G-Unit]

you have studied pschology so I would expect you to understand this even if others dont. They have been through a very traumatic experience. I would think they have been advised by pschologists not to blame themselves as that would send them it a downward spiral. Im sure inside they do put blame on thesmselves and they have said as much....if a women is raped because she got so drunk she couldnt consent should she put blame on herself...no

So women who get drunk are no longer expected to take any responsibility for themselves?

[Miss Taken Identity]

I thought KM said she did not want to be part of a reconstruction as to do so would be too traumatic?  We can see from the reconstruction that did take place JT became visibly upset.

Given the state of 5A ie no signs of forced entry and unsecured, coupled with the fact that Portugal doesn't have a history of child abductions from holiday apartments, PJ proceeded on the basis MM had simply wandered off.  All concerned were then faced with cultural, language and legal differences and a highly transient population.  Having looked through the files its difficult to see what more PJ could have done which has been borne out by the fact MET have spent millions over years and got nowhere.

I thought KM said she did not want to be part of a reconstruction as to do so would be too traumatic?

Yes, but perhaps it could be measured as  not as traumatic as what her daughter may have been subjected to? ME,ME,ME  and I

We can see from the reconstruction that did take place JT became visibly upset.

when Gerry contradicted her version of the 'meeting on road' she was visibly upset.


Gerry managed to conduct himself very well... considering

[Miss Taken Identity]

So women who get drunk are no longer expected to take any responsibility for themselves?

Responsibility for her own behaviour yes, being attacked and raped  because she is drunk  down to others behaviour-No.  IMO.

[G-Unit]

Responsibility for her own behaviour yes, being attacked and raped  because she is drunk  down to others behaviour-No.  IMO.

Saying yes to something she might regret later when she sobers up?

[Mr Gray]

Saying yes to something she might regret later when she sobers up?

we are talking about not giving consent...you seem to want to justify the criminals action and blame the victim

[Holly Goodhead]

we are talking about not giving consent...you seem to want to justify the criminals action and blame the victim

Adults need to take responsibility to reduce the risk of being the victim of a crime. 

In an ideal world if I left my car unlocked and a purse/handbag/expensive items on display they would remain in-situ but we know we don't live in an ideal world so the onus is on me to remove any valuables from sight and lock the car.  Its why car manufacturers fit locks and insurance companies don't usually pay out if the insured doesn't take reasonable steps to mitigate risk.