Why was the window open ?

[icabodcrane]

The "rubbish" videos are neither inaccurate nor misleading if you read properly in what context they were made.

Nobody knows if the glass panes were locked or not. If they were not locked, this is my hypothesis:

May 3rd. 2007: between 21:40 and 21:49 approximately (or maybe between 21:15 and 21:19 approximately) the abductor took Madeleine without entering the apartment 5A, opening the window from the outside. Awakened by the noise and/or light from the opening, believing was one of her parents, Madeleine went to the window (in the floor, not in the bed aside the window), somewhat somnolent and very tired, and was taken.

I am sure taking a 4 years old somnolent toddler is as easy as taking this sack. I had no a better dummy, but it can be repeated even with a toddler.

http://espacioexterior.blogspot.com

Also, this demonstrates that if the glass panes were not locked (and nobody knows) the "break-in" is possible leaving the window as Kate found it, and without damaged.

Sorry Heriberto on two counts. 

Firstly I didn't see your response so thank you for pointing it out to me in your pm.

Secondly, my rubbish comment was probably a bit strong so I apologise.  You and your friend went to a lot of trouble to film the videos and you are to be congratulated for your work.

However, and this is where I don't agree with your theory.  It is very unlikely that the McCanns left the window open and it is very unlikely that anyone was able to open it from the outside.  I believe this was attempted by the police but they were unable to do it.  The window was not forced.  In addition, what you are suggesting is that the abductor was an opportunist and took advantage of a situation.  I don't believe that for a minute.

The operation to snatch Madeleine was meticulously planned from beginning to end.  The suspicious characters seen lurking around on the street outside evidences the fact that the apartment was probably being watched for some time.  Whoever was involved wanted to establish what the pattern was with the parents when a suitable victim was identified.  They wanted to ensure that they were not disturbed when they went to abduct Maddie.  What they didn't bargain on was Jane Tanner doing an unscheduled check and nearly catching them at it.

I believe the open window theory and Madeleine walking over to it and being lifted out is a theory too far.  In addition, getting out of that window with a child was not easily done and would have probably taken two adults to accomplish.

The most likely scenario is that the abductors simply let himself in to the apartment and left by the same manner.  The open window and shutter was probably a cover to hide the fact that they had a key to the apartment.

But John,  if the abductor was meticulous and had been watching the Tapas group's coming and goings for some time,  then he would be aware that they had been leaving the patio doors unlocked since Sunday night

He would know there was no need  to open the window in order to disguise the fact that he had a key  because the apartment was unsecured in any event,  allowing free entry to any and all, whether they had a key or not

[Redblossom]

You are wrong heriberto, the fact is that Gerry Mccann said because he saw the door more open that is the only reason he looked inside the childrens bedroom, when he never did before ever

Prood here from 5 mins


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=na4aBr5PTYY&feature=youtube_gdata_player

And Kate says in her book that Gerry immediately saw the door was open too wide,  and,  assuming Madeleine must have got up and gone to their room, he went there to check  before going  into the children's room

You'd think he would do it the other way round, wouldn't you ?

The childrens bedroom was straight in front of him,  with the door open,  yet istead of looking in to see if Madeleine  had  got out of bed, he went directly to his and Kate's room to look for her

The first place he looked for Madeleine was not in her own bed

Did she say that? IIRC if was Matt Oldfield in his rogatory or his wifes  that said he wondered where Mwddie slept and went to look at her parents room but he never actually checked the kids room, what a conundrum

[Heriberto Janosch]

The "rubbish" videos are neither inaccurate nor misleading if you read properly in what context they were made.

Nobody knows if the glass panes were locked or not. If they were not locked, this is my hypothesis:

May 3rd. 2007: between 21:40 and 21:49 approximately (or maybe between 21:15 and 21:19 approximately) the abductor took Madeleine without entering the apartment 5A, opening the window from the outside. Awakened by the noise and/or light from the opening, believing was one of her parents, Madeleine went to the window (in the floor, not in the bed aside the window), somewhat somnolent and very tired, and was taken.

I am sure taking a 4 years old somnolent toddler is as easy as taking this sack. I had no a better dummy, but it can be repeated even with a toddler.

http://espacioexterior.blogspot.com

Also, this demonstrates that if the glass panes were not locked (and nobody knows) the "break-in" is possible leaving the window as Kate found it, and without damaged.

Sorry Heriberto on two counts. 

Firstly I didn't see your response so thank you for pointing it out to me in your pm.

Secondly, my rubbish comment was probably a bit strong so I apologise.  You and your friend went to a lot of trouble to film the videos and you are to be congratulated for your work.

However, and this is where I don't agree with your theory.  It is very unlikely that the McCanns left the window open and it is very unlikely that anyone was able to open it from the outside.  I believe this was attempted by the police but they were unable to do it.  The window was not forced.  In addition, what you are suggesting is that the abductor was an opportunist and took advantage of a situation.  I don't believe that for a minute.

The operation to snatch Madeleine was meticulously planned from beginning to end.  The suspicious characters seen lurking around on the street outside evidences the fact that the apartment was probably being watched for some time.  Whoever was involved wanted to establish what the pattern was with the parents when a suitable victim was identified.  They wanted to ensure that they were not disturbed when they went to abduct Maddie.  What they didn't bargain on was Jane Tanner doing an unscheduled check and nearly catching them at it.

I believe the open window theory and Madeleine walking over to it and being lifted out is a theory too far.  In addition, getting out of that window with a child was not easily done and would have probably taken two adults to accomplish.

The most likely scenario is that the abductors simply let himself in to the apartment and left by the same manner.  The open window and shutter was probably a cover to hide the fact that they had a key to the apartment.

No problem, John.

I copy and paste something I wrote ... "Do you know that in this type of window people left the shutter down but no too much leaving gaps between the bars, and the glass panes closed but not too much (not locked) leaving a slight (one centimeter or so) gap, to ventilate the room? And in this particular case, we do not know, so we can not assign a "likelihood" to this event ... My hypothesis is based on (a) shutter down and (b) glass panes closed but NOT LOCKED ... So it could be opened from the outside without damaged (a break-in without damage)."

My hypothesis/theory is plausible, maybe true or maybe false, but plausible. Your theory is also plausible, and I do not discard it. In fact I said in my blog that there is a lot of plausible theories, including planned/team/car abduction and unplanned/solitaire/no car abduction, etc. ...

Which I did not find is a PLAUSIBLE theory which does NOT involved an ABDUCTOR STRANGER TO TAPAS9!

Now yes I am going to sleep ... 

   

[amaraltheofficeboy]

Redblossom

"IIRC"

don't you think it is time to provide facts and not guesses from your memory?

too much of this goes on to mislead and distract.

your memory may be right or it may be wrong.

I remember a sheet of steel.

[Redblossom]

Redblossom

"IIRC"

don't you think it is time to provide facts and not guesses from your memory?

too much of this goes on to mislead and distract.

your memory may be right or it may be wrong.

I remember a sheet of steel.

if you repost that in coherent English grammar and also state the exact subject you are talking about, I may, just, start,just,  even consider the possibility of beginning to think about the possibility of responding to it
 

[icabodcrane]

This is an interesting thread,  and a conversation was progressing nicely

Please don't disrupt like this ... the petty squabbles are spoiling the board in my opinion

[Angelo222]

This is an interesting thread,  and a conversation was progressing nicely

Please don't disrupt like this ... the petty squabbles are spoiling the board in my opinion

I have to agree icabodcrane and I am fed up having to moderate such petty bickering.  The name of the topic is "Why was the window open."  Anything else will be removed.

[amaraltheofficeboy]

This is an interesting thread,  and a conversation was progressing nicely

Please don't disrupt like this ... the petty squabbles are spoiling the board in my opinion

oh yes let's see - oh you started the thread, 11 pages and 152 replies later the question "Why was the window open  ?" has not been answered to your satisfaction.

So yes - keep on chatting about it and at the end of the day you will achieve - nothing.

A child is missing and remains missing - focus on finding her - not about some petty gripe about a window.

[Angelo222]

You are wrong heriberto, the fact is that Gerry Mccann said because he saw the door more open that is the only reason he looked inside the childrens bedroom, when he never did before ever

Searching for a burglar? No. Seeing if Madeleine wake up and moved the door? ... Oh, Madeleine could wake up and walk by the room ... Maybe she could go to the window if somebody open it from the outside ...

Good night.

Didnt understand a word of that but goodnight

Those sliding windows lock automatically when pushed shut and some can then be security locked as well.  There is no way the McCanns would have left the window open when the bedroom was so close to the street.  My own theory is that the abductor looked out to see if the coast was clear or possibly even to get a signal from an accomplice.

[Redblossom]

What abductor? More strange than the acarlet pimpernel, only he was real

[Angelo222]

What abductor? More strange than the acarlet pimpernel, only he was real

The one who abducted Madeleine McCann of course, who else?

[Redblossom]

What abductor? More strange than the acarlet pimpernel, only he was real

The one who abducted Madeleine McCann of course, who else?

Any serious evidenve or proof of that? Nope

[Angelo222]

What abductor? More strange than the acarlet pimpernel, only he was real

The one who abducted Madeleine McCann of course, who else?

Any serious evidenve or proof of that? Nope

Well yes lots of evidence including a sighting of a suspect beside the apartment   Where is the evidence that her parents had anything to do with her disappearance?  Not a shred rendering an abduction the only possible scenario.  Even the PJ had to admit defeat in the end in trying to pin the blame on the McCanns.

Had Maddie met with an accident of some sort at the apartment  Matthew and Jane would not have been sent to check on her.

[C.Edwards]

What abductor? More strange than the acarlet pimpernel, only he was real

The one who abducted Madeleine McCann of course, who else?

Any serious evidenve or proof of that? Nope

Well yes lots of evidence including a sighting of a suspect beside the apartment   Where is the evidence that her parents had anything to do with her disappearance?  Not a shred rendering an abduction the only possible scenario.  Even the PJ had to admit defeat in the end in trying to pin the blame on the McCanns.

Had Maddie met with an accident of some sort at the apartment  Matthew and Jane would not have been sent to check on her.

I thought you said this thread was to do with the window and anything else would be removed?  What's that little rant of personal opinion ^^^ got to do with an open window?

You're entitled to your opinion but please understand that others are entitled to theirs too.

The "open window" is entirely to do with staging - just my opinion of course and one that is not shared by all. I'm fine with that.

[Cudge]

It is  only a rare possibility that the window would have been left unlocked. A flat occupied by two parents and three kids one would assume they would make sure the window was closed and locked , then again the Mccanns left their kids alledgedly in an unlocked apartment via the patio doors, I suppose unlocked open windows wouldnt have bothered them either!!!!
You go out of your holiday flat and lock everything. Indeed, Gerry says he locked the flat when he went out every day, but they left it unlocked at night with their kids in there that theynever checked on physically? For three hours plus?Come on!

Are you speaking for everybody. I have a flat in Italy when I go out I leave the shutters closed but the windows behind them are open in order to keep the air flow fresh.