J B Campaign Ltd - Much Ado About Nothing...

[scipio_usmc]

Have you visited GH?  If not I can assure you it's the polar opposite of NJ. 

Yes statistically most people are fast asleep during the early hours of the morning but some aren't.  People do actually depart and arrive home during the early hours for a whole variety of reasons.  People also wake for a variety of reasons eg mothers feeding babies, couples having sex and then going to the loo, elderly men going to the loo with prostate problems. The list is infinite.  The night sky is often a source of wonderment and people have a tendency to gaze at it by looking out of windows. 

As for using the car your views are at odds with DI Miller:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-OlvzCVrmc&feature=youtu.be&t=25m30s

I'm not wasting time going round in circles discussing the bike.  It doesn't prove anything.  Yes JB could have cycled to and from WHF by bike but there's no evidence he did by way of cycle tracks and/or forensic evidence on the bike.  For me personally I would find it easier to run 4 miles across fields than cycle on a sit and beg type bike.

You are being silly. The sex there is so bad that people in the UK look out the window while having sex? 

Do the people there have night vision eyes so they are able to see with clarity who is riding a bike in the dark?  I have good eyes but I can't see the face of people riding bikes at night. Only if I know someone's routine will I be able to tell it is them.

How many crimes committed at night have eyewitness who accurately describe the color and make of the motor vehicle used to get away let alone ID the driver?  With the exception of people who KNOW the perp and happen to be out and about the very time the perp is leaving or arriving home there will be no witness who can say they saw the perp out and about. When it comes to bikes the odds are nil.

We know for a fact that Jeremy drove to WHF to meet police.  His neighbors didn't know he left in the middle of the night they heard nothing.  What dos that tell you?

Jeremy's perceptions shaped what he would do and the perceptions he presented to Julie was that the bike would provide the best mix of speed and stealth.  Because he expressed this perception that is why many believe he used a bike.

If his neighbors had heard his vehicle sometime overnight they still would not be able to swear to the time because they would have been no reason for them to document it.  He could have simply told police it was when he went to meet them. If they insisted they heard what they believed to be his car drive away at 1AM I bet you would say they might have gotten the time wrong or even it could have been a different car that they just assumed was his.  Most witnesses make assumptions and are not sure and thus are useless.  Knowing this I would have no fear of driving.  Jeremy initially was concerned about someone noticing something enough to want to use a bike.  Whether he followed through or not only he knows.  Only he knows whether his perceptions changed.

[Myster]

There's actually another possible route -by road- from Bourtree Cottage. If he'd turned left into Church Road at the Chequers, it would have cut 1-2 miles off the journey by going round the back of Goldhanger.. I imagine that more than half the houses in Head Street probably weren't there in the 1980's and those with long drives, protected by electronic gates wouldn't have heard him anyway. This also applies to Church Road, bearing out what you said about it being a sleepy, sparsely-populated hamlet. Back then, it wasn't as desirable an address as it now is.

I think you mean Church Street? and if I'm not mistaken the direction you mention above is on the GREEN road route. All three, GREEN, RED and BLUE converge at (B) the junction of Church Street, Head Street and Fish Street

[APRIL]

I think you mean Church Street? and if I'm not mistaken the direction you mention above is on the GREEN road route. All three, GREEN, RED and BLUE converge at (B) the junction of Church Street, Head Street and Fish Street

You're absolutely correct, Myster. When you next take a look, can you tell where the street lighting is. I know it was broad daylight when I was there, and I'm aware that they probably wouldn't want anything which looked much more modern than early 20th century, but I don't recall seeing any. They must be very discreet.

[Holly Goodhead]

You are being silly. The sex there is so bad that people in the UK look out the window while having sex? 

Do the people there have night vision eyes so they are able to see with clarity who is riding a bike in the dark?  I have good eyes but I can't see the face of people riding bikes at night. Only if I know someone's routine will I be able to tell it is them.

How many crimes committed at night have eyewitness who accurately describe the color and make of the motor vehicle used to get away let alone ID the driver?  With the exception of people who KNOW the perp and happen to be out and about the very time the perp is leaving or arriving home there will be no witness who can say they saw the perp out and about. When it comes to bikes the odds are nil.

We know for a fact that Jeremy drove to WHF to meet police.  His neighbors didn't know he left in the middle of the night they heard nothing.  What dos that tell you?

Jeremy's perceptions shaped what he would do and the perceptions he presented to Julie was that the bike would provide the best mix of speed and stealth.  Because he expressed this perception that is why many believe he used a bike.

If his neighbors had heard his vehicle sometime overnight they still would not be able to swear to the time because they would have been no reason for them to document it.  He could have simply told police it was when he went to meet them. If they insisted they heard what they believed to be his car drive away at 1AM I bet you would say they might have gotten the time wrong or even it could have been a different car that they just assumed was his.  Most witnesses make assumptions and are not sure and thus are useless.  Knowing this I would have no fear of driving.  Jeremy initially was concerned about someone noticing something enough to want to use a bike.  Whether he followed through or not only he knows.  Only he knows whether his perceptions changed.

I never said people look out the window while having sex.  I said they might have sex and then get up to use the loo and glance out a window.  You're obviously unfamiliar with the term 'Lie back and think of England' 

Did JM claim JB told her his intended mode of transport was the bike?  I thought he only ever told JM he arranged for MM to carry out the murders?  I don't recall any detail about how MM was supposed to have arrived and departed WHF?

Goldhanger is a sleepy little village with a population of 654 as at 2011.  It has recently received an influx of immigrants and now stands at circa 22 million which is obviously putting quite a strain on local infrastructure 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldhanger

[scipio_usmc]

I never said people look out the window while having sex.  I said they might have sex and then get up to use the loo and glance out a window.  You're obviously unfamiliar with the term 'Lie back and think of England' 

Did JM claim JB told her his intended mode of transport was the bike?  I thought he only ever told JM he arranged for MM to carry out the murders?  I don't recall any detail about how MM was supposed to have arrived and departed WHF?

Goldhanger is a sleepy little village with a population of 654 as at 2011.  It has recently received an influx of immigrants and now stands at circa 22 million which is obviously putting quite a strain on local infrastructure 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goldhanger

People just glancing out a window are not going to recognize who is on a bike at night even if they happen to look while someone is biking by.

You are conflating 2 distinct issues.

A) Prior to the murders, the plans Julie said that Jeremy told her about

B) Post murder- the few details about the murders that Jeremy told Julie about.

Post murder is when she said that he told her he had not done it himself but rather hired a hitman. Pre-murder she claimed he said he was going to do it.  She said that pre-murder Jeremy told her he planned to use a bike and that he had done a test run to see how long it would take by bike.

 

   

[Myster]

I never said people look out the window while having sex.  I said they might have sex and then get up to use the loo and glance out a window.  You're obviously unfamiliar with the term 'Lie back and think of England' 

No they don't!  After hot nooky they're too knackered to visit the loo, so they use a chamber pot from under the bed, then open the nearest window, shout "Gardez L'eau!!"... and hope there isn't a 24 year-old farmer passing by on a bike.

[Myster]

You're absolutely correct, Myster. When you next take a look, can you tell where the street lighting is. I know it was broad daylight when I was there, and I'm aware that they probably wouldn't want anything which looked much more modern than early 20th century, but I don't recall seeing any. They must be very discreet.

Looking briefly at Streetviews taken in 2009, I can't see any street lighting at all on the whole length of either Church Street or Maldon Road to Pages Lane. Only poles for house telephone cables on Church Street, and the odd high-voltage electric cable passing over Maldon Road...

[attachment deleted by admin]

[APRIL]

Looking briefly at Streetviews taken in 2009, I can't see any street lighting at all on the whole length of either Church Street or Maldon Road to Pages Lane. Only poles for house telephone cables on Church Street, and the odd high-voltage electric cable passing over Maldon Road...

Thanks, Myster. It puts a whole new slant on "creeping about under cover of darkness" doesn't it?

[Myster]

Thanks, Myster. It puts a whole new slant on "creeping about under cover of darkness" doesn't it?

All we need now is for Holly to have a cycling holiday in Goldhanger to see how well she can creep.

[APRIL]

All we need now is for Holly to have a cycling holiday in Goldhanger to see how well she can creep.

Depends how long she spends in the Chequers.

[Holly Goodhead]

All we need now is for Holly to have a cycling holiday in Goldhanger to see how well she can creep.

Creeping has never been my thing 

Bicycles have moving mechanical parts that make noises.  In the main legs and feet don't.  Of course footwear has the potential to leave footprints and evidence adhering to them by way of blood and soil but this would also apply to bicyle tyres. 

[Holly Goodhead]

People just glancing out a window are not going to recognize who is on a bike at night even if they happen to look while someone is biking by.

You are conflating 2 distinct issues.

A) Prior to the murders, the plans Julie said that Jeremy told her about

B) Post murder- the few details about the murders that Jeremy told Julie about.

Post murder is when she said that he told her he had not done it himself but rather hired a hitman. Pre-murder she claimed he said he was going to do it.  She said that pre-murder Jeremy told her he planned to use a bike and that he had done a test run to see how long it would take by bike.

Yes I agree anyone observing an individual on a bicycle in the dark of night might not be able to positively identify them but it would amount to quite compelling circumstanial evidence if JB told JM he intended to use a bike to cycle to and from WHF to murder his family and an individual is then seen during the early hours on a bike similar to June's sit up and beg.  As I said GH is a sleepy little village, so too the neighbouring areas, so anyone seen cycling about during the early hours on a sit up and beg bike would stand out a mile.

Was it ever confirmed whether or not JB had his own bike?  In which case why would he need June's?  He certainly had access to one when he was at Greshams whether it was his own or the schools I don't know.

JB claims he may have brought the bike to GH a few days before the murders:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1276

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1278

JM claims JB initially he said he would walk or use the bike:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1096

Then according to JM he was going to use a bike and have a trial run:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1104

Bah!  He was into windsurfing he could have part walked/run and used a windsurfer to sail up the river and of course would have looked the part wearing a wetsuit!

[Myster]

Creeping has never been my thing 

Bicycles have moving mechanical parts that make noises.  In the main legs and feet don't.  Of course footwear has the potential to leave footprints and evidence adhering to them by way of blood and soil but this would also apply to bicyle tyres.

Not even when you're wearing sneakers?

Maybe June's bike was well-oiled?

In a dry August what are the chances of mud adhering to the tyres, especially on the B1026 Maldon and B1023 Tollesbury Roads?

I was surprised at the total lack of any street lighting from Head Street/Church Street all the way to Pages Lane on a Streetview walkthrough, which makes me even more convinced that JB chose to pedal either the GREEN or RED route, but more likely the shorter latter one. Quite a few new houses appear have been built along Church Street, which means with fewer residents in '85 there was less chance of him being seen pedalling home like the clappers to break the news of his successful venture to Julie. I think you'll agree.

Just noticed in the Julie's interview you posted that she said JB would use the "back road" which to me means the RED route that passes the neighbouring Hyde Farm before coming out onto Maldon Road.

If Jeremy had his own bike, I'm certain that would have been forensically examined and we'd have heard about it.

[scipio_usmc]

Yes I agree anyone observing an individual on a bicycle in the dark of night might not be able to positively identify them but it would amount to quite compelling circumstanial evidence if JB told JM he intended to use a bike to cycle to and from WHF to murder his family and an individual is then seen during the early hours on a bike similar to June's sit up and beg.  As I said GH is a sleepy little village, so too the neighbouring areas, so anyone seen cycling about during the early hours on a sit up and beg bike would stand out a mile.

Was it ever confirmed whether or not JB had his own bike?  In which case why would he need June's?  He certainly had access to one when he was at Greshams whether it was his own or the schools I don't know.

JB claims he may have brought the bike to GH a few days before the murders:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1276

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=296.0;attach=1278

JM claims JB initially he said he would walk or use the bike:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1096

Then according to JM he was going to use a bike and have a trial run:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1104

Bah!  He was into windsurfing he could have part walked/run and used a windsurfer to sail up the river and of course would have looked the part wearing a wetsuit!

He didn't expect Julie to turn on him and rat him out. If he had the ability to see into the future and thus knew she was going to do that then he would not have followed through with the murders.  Julie saying all the other things she did was far worse than the details about the bike. Whether he used a bike or car to get there makes no difference at all. The fact she ratted out that he was planning to kill them, said tonight was the night etc is what was so damn devastating. If he feared her talking he would not have told her anything in the first place and if on the night of the murders he feared her talking then he would not have carried the murders out. Choosing a mode of transport based on being scared of Julie blabbing makes no sense.

 

[Myster]

Pour les personnes qui peuvent comprendre un peu de français...

http://tueursenserie.wifeo.com/jeremy-bamber-le-massacre-de-lessex.php