Could the silencer have been contaminated by bloodied water from the bucket?

[Caroline]

But we're not talking uncontaminated menstrual blood.  We're talking menstrual blood heavily diluted in water and whether or not it then smells differently to normal blood also heavily diluted in water.  My experiment showed no discernible difference in odour.

What do you know about the buckets at WHF? Like how much water? How soiled the garment was? You can't just do one experiment and claim that it disproves something. I keep telling you this, also, why did you have a bucket just filled with water? That was totally unnecessary - the control bucket was the one with ordinary blood. If you're going to spring Bamber with your daring do as a forensic specialist - you really must learn this stuff. 

[Robittybob1]

I'm not sticking my nose in this one.

[Robittybob1]

read the first paragraph of this link post by Holly on another thread:  http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3171.0;attach=3600

[Holly Goodhead]

What do you know about the buckets at WHF? Like how much water? How soiled the garment was? You can't just do one experiment and claim that it disproves something. I keep telling you this, also, why did you have a bucket just filled with water? That was totally unnecessary - the control bucket was the one with ordinary blood. If you're going to spring Bamber with your daring do as a forensic specialist - you really must learn this stuff. 

The control bucket was necessary as all the kit was new and I needed to eliminate any odours coming from this.

It didn't matter anout the precise quantities of blood and water.  The fact remains when it's diluted down with water it becomes odourless. 

The experiment was carried out nearly 7 years ago at a time I was only getting into my stride 

It has nothing to do with the new forensic tests. 

[Robittybob1]

The control bucket was necessary as all the kit was new and I needed to eliminate any odours coming from this.

It didn't matter anout the precise quantities of blood and water.  The fact remains when it's diluted down with water it becomes odourless. 

The experiment was carried out nearly 7 years ago at a time I was only getting into my stride 

It has nothing to do with the new forensic tests.

You couldn't be used as a cadaver dog if you say blood and water mixed becomes odourless.

[Caroline]

The control bucket was necessary as all the kit was new and I needed to eliminate any odours coming from this.

It didn't matter anout the precise quantities of blood and water.  The fact remains when it's diluted down with water it becomes odourless. 

The experiment was carried out nearly 7 years ago at a time I was only getting into my stride 

It has nothing to do with the new forensic tests.

Of course it would matter how much water was used; look up how dilution works.

No the third bucket wasn't needed - it wasn't a test for the smell of plastic  and you used new buckets for both the blood groups so they would either both smell of plastic or neither would . Also you didn't mention this new variable in your experiment?

Also, AE didn't mean the water smelled of menstrual blood, she mean the knickers.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

I have to agree with you. I'd always believed the menstrual flow smelled differently from say, a cut knee. In fact, I believe it was I who put this forward, or maybe Ann said it and I agreed. However, as Holly went to such great -not to mention, PAINFUL lengths to disprove it, there's little more I can suggest....................other than perhaps some do and some don't?

Absolutely, April

We all have our own distinct body chemistry and smell. Even eating certain foods can change body odour. People who eat lots of spicy foods such as curry will have a scent of spices just when they sweat, and all those spices are in the blood too. Any pungent food: garlic, onions etc will cause one’s body odour to become more pungent.

I’ve smelt fresh blood from a dead body (not through choice I may add) and I know that too has a certain odour. It’s unmistakable.

And menstrual blood has its own distinct aroma too. Without going into embarrassing detail, I can categorically say that if you were unable to change a pad when menstruating if, say, driving for almost 24 hours in Australia outback before being able to shower and change, the aroma is on the pad is unpleasant. And that’s normal.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Great to know you have some Brie 

The experiment met the objective which was to determine whether or not there was any discernible odour between fabric containing menstrual blood and fabric containing arterial blood when left to soak in water. 

Buckets found at soc containing blood stained clothes needed to be taken away for analysis.  Instead they were left for relatives to do with as they saw fit; relatives that gained financially from JB:s conviction.

Even the officer in charge, DCI Ainsley, told AE the defence at trial might allege she put blood in the silencer from SC's underwear.  He also asked her how she knew it was menstrual blood and she said it smelled differently but my experiment showed no discernible odour between the bowls

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3171.0;attach=3598

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=3171.0;attach=3600

Think you’ll find the clue that it was menstrual blood in the bucket was Sheila’s bloodstained knickers

That aside, to replicate a scientific experiment you need to produce it in IDENTICAL conditions

You didn’t do that

Secondly, you used your blood, and your blood would have a scent of its own. It also depends on if you’re taking the contraceptive pill, what your hormone balance is, if you’re on HRT and are just having a bleed rather than a proper period...a whole host of things.

But ultimately, whatever your own research shows (depending on how good your sense of smell is) the whole thing is futile.  Just because you couldn’t detect any difference in smell doesn’t mean others wouldn’t. Just as we all have our own palate and taste things differently, we all smell things differently too. That’s why wine testers who work for major distributors are so strict on the conditions when the sample wine. They also make sure they don’t eat certain foods for a few days; they don’t wear perfume when testing; even surroundings can alter taste.

Out of interest, have you had your nose checked? Some people have a poor sense of smell, whilst others have a powerful sense of smell. I’m sure a dog would detect the difference in those buckets of blood you had laying in the kitchen.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

But we're not talking stand alone menstrual blood.  We're talking menstrual blood diluted in water with the ratio hundreds to one.  AE said it smells differently but it doesn't in such a diluted form.

Soiled bloodied knickers soaking in water for a week would develop a smell.

You’re also forgetting there’s been five corpses in the house, and Nevill’s in the kitchen.  Flies & bluebottles get in, and they lay maggots. It was hot weather too. Bluebottles would have swarmed around that bloodied bucket.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

The control bucket was necessary as all the kit was new and I needed to eliminate any odours coming from this.

It didn't matter anout the precise quantities of blood and water.  The fact remains when it's diluted down with water it becomes odourless. 

The experiment was carried out nearly 7 years ago at a time I was only getting into my stride 

It has nothing to do with the new forensic tests.

It certainly does matter how much water is added

Sheila’s bloodstained knickers were in a bucket of water: you only put yours in 1cm of water. I’m surprised it didn’t evaporate after a week...

[APRIL]

Absolutely, April

We all have our own distinct body chemistry and smell. Even eating certain foods can change body odour. People who eat lots of spicy foods such as curry will have a scent of spices just when they sweat, and all those spices are in the blood too. Any pungent food: garlic, onions etc will cause one’s body odour to become more pungent.

I’ve smelt fresh blood from a dead body (not through choice I may add) and I know that too has a certain odour. It’s unmistakable.

And menstrual blood has its own distinct aroma too. Without going into embarrassing detail, I can categorically say that if you were unable to change a pad when menstruating if, say, driving for almost 24 hours in Australia outback before being able to shower and change, the aroma is on the pad is unpleasant. And that’s normal.

Spy, OUCH!!! I can imagine!!

I recall when I was in college, being asked to consider, and name, all those things which our bodies secrete. Whilst within the confines of our bodies, we never think about how offensive we, and indeed, others, may find these secretions when they hit the air. Menstrual blood, containing uterine and vaginal debris, is naturally going to have a smell other than that of blood from a wound.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Spy, OUCH!!! I can imagine!!

I recall when I was in college, being asked to consider, and name, all those things which our bodies secrete. Whilst within the confines of our bodies, we never think about how offensive we, and indeed, others, may find these secretions when they hit the air. Menstrual blood, containing uterine and vaginal debris, is naturally going to have a smell other than that of blood from a wound.

Absolutely.

It’s waste products of the human body. It’s organic and always has an odour.

The inside of a body has a distinct smell, which is why when an autopsy is carried out and police have to attend they often feel sick due to the odour emitting from the inside of the bodies.

In fact, a dead body will start to release unpleasant odour just hours after death. It’s awful, but natural.

[APRIL]

Absolutely.

It’s waste products of the human body. It’s organic and always has an odour.

The inside of a body has a distinct smell, which is why when an autopsy is carried out and police have to attend they often feel sick due to the odour emitting from the inside of the bodies.

In fact, a dead body will start to release unpleasant odour just hours after death. It’s awful, but natural.

Those of you with delicate sensitivities LOOK AWAY NOW!!! The closest I can get is likening it to the smell of a pheasant's entrails when they're removed.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Those of you with delicate sensitivities LOOK AWAY NOW!!! The closest I can get is likening it to the smell of a pheasant's entrails when they're removed.

Gosh, I can imagine 🤢

Apparently, dogs find humans rather smelly, but they have powerful noses.

It isn’t pleasant thinking about body waste, but we all have it

Even our urine and faeces has an aroma...and that can change if we’re unwell or have eaten certain foods. Some people refuse to eat asparagus because it can cause their urine to smell unpleasant, but only certain people can detect that smell.

Faeces has an unpleasant aroma, unless you’re one of the lucky ones who claims theirs smells like roses. Maybe Jeremy Bamber’s does and that’s why he covered himself in it for days...

[Holly Goodhead]

Think you’ll find the clue that it was menstrual blood in the bucket was Sheila’s bloodstained knickers

That aside, to replicate a scientific experiment you need to produce it in IDENTICAL conditions

You didn’t do that

Secondly, you used your blood, and your blood would have a scent of its own. It also depends on if you’re taking the contraceptive pill, what your hormone balance is, if you’re on HRT and are just having a bleed rather than a proper period...a whole host of things.

But ultimately, whatever your own research shows (depending on how good your sense of smell is) the whole thing is futile.  Just because you couldn’t detect any difference in smell doesn’t mean others wouldn’t. Just as we all have our own palate and taste things differently, we all smell things differently too. That’s why wine testers who work for major distributors are so strict on the conditions when the sample wine. They also make sure they don’t eat certain foods for a few days; they don’t wear perfume when testing; even surroundings can alter taste.

Out of interest, have you had your nose checked? Some people have a poor sense of smell, whilst others have a powerful sense of smell. I’m sure a dog would detect the difference in those buckets of blood you had laying in the kitchen.

The buckets contained other items too.  From memory SC's jogging bottoms and twin's tracksuit bottoms.

How many more times...my signature odour is irrelevant.  The experiment was carried out in an attempt to determine any discernible difference in odour between two pieces of fabric left to soak in bowls: one stained with arterial blood the other stained with menstrual blood.

If you want to use wine tasters as an anology you would need to pour about 2 teaspoons of say Beaujolais into one bowl of water and 2 teaspoons of say Bordeaux into another bowl of water and then see if the tasters were able to discern the wine by smell.

Surely it's not difficult to understand that stained fabric left to soak in water eradicates the smell by way of dilution?  May I suggest you carry out your own experiment.

AE isn't a dog!