Video: Uncle reveals how Joana Cipriano was murdered and later fed to the pigs.

[misty]

How were they able to video evidence which had been lost/ destroyed? (according to the court case)

[Angelo222]

How were they able to video evidence which had been lost/ destroyed? (according to the court case)

The forensic evidence was there for all to see.  Poor little sod, the drug crazed blighter fed her to the porkies.

[misty]

The forensic evidence was there for all to see.  Poor little sod, the drug crazed blighter fed her to the porkies.

Cite for where all that "evidence" was found, please.

[Angelo222]

Cite for where all that "evidence" was found, please.

All the information is contained in the video misty but in Portuguese.

[misty]

All the information is contained in the video misty but in Portuguese.

It's not consistent with the court case, Angelo. No blood or hair was found pertaining to Joana. What are the contents of the bags supposed to be?

[Angelo222]

It's not consistent with the court case, Angelo. No blood or hair was found pertaining to Joana. What are the contents of the bags supposed to be?

I think you need to read the Supreme Court decision again misty because it was determined that vestiges of blood found belonged to the 8-year-old minor.

There has also been no insurmountable contradiction in the motivation of not having been understood as being of the deceased CC the vestiges collected through the projectina technique and the understanding that the remains of human blood collected in the house where the facts took place or between this conclusion and Namely that, by the action of the defendants, it was not possible to determine the DNA of such blood. This is because it was through many other elements of evidence that it was concluded that the blood of the smaller one was collected in the house..

When they arrived they saw that the interior of the room had been washed, and that washing was in contrast with the lack of cleaning and tidying up of the rest of the house, but even so they still found traces of blood on the floor, on the walls, in the bucket and mop and on the sole Of sneakers that were in the room..

These traces, according to expert reports, are of human blood and of human and animal blood (cf., pages 235), and although they are insufficient to ascertain who they belong to through DNA (pages 1780 ss), they reveal that in Room where the CC lived and where it was headed something terrible happened, something that gave rise to human blood on the floor and walls, which were cleaned with a mop and bucket, and the blood that was in the mop He found on the stem, revealing that whoever used the mop had his hands dirty with blood.

The CC2 medical and veterinary witness at the DGAA stated that adult pigs eat a corpse of an 8-year-old human, explaining that if they are 5 or 6 pigs they eat an 8-year-old corpse in 10 or 12 hours and That if the corpse is cut it will be even faster. He said that the pigs eat the corpse completely, making it disappear completely and only leaving residues in the feces that were not digested.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

[misty]

I think you need to read the Supreme Court decision again misty because it was determined that vestiges of blood found belonged to the 8-year-old minor.

There has also been no insurmountable contradiction in the motivation of not having been understood as being of the deceased CC the vestiges collected through the projectina technique and the understanding that the remains of human blood collected in the house where the facts took place or between this conclusion and Namely that, by the action of the defendants, it was not possible to determine the DNA of such blood. This is because it was through many other elements of evidence that it was concluded that the blood of the smaller one was collected in the house..

When they arrived they saw that the interior of the room had been washed, and that washing was in contrast with the lack of cleaning and tidying up of the rest of the house, but even so they still found traces of blood on the floor, on the walls, in the bucket and mop and on the sole Of sneakers that were in the room..

These traces, according to expert reports, are of human blood and of human and animal blood (cf., pages 235), and although they are insufficient to ascertain who they belong to through DNA (pages 1780 ss), they reveal that in Room where the CC lived and where it was headed something terrible happened, something that gave rise to human blood on the floor and walls, which were cleaned with a mop and bucket, and the blood that was in the mop He found on the stem, revealing that whoever used the mop had his hands dirty with blood.

The CC2 medical and veterinary witness at the DGAA stated that adult pigs eat a corpse of an 8-year-old human, explaining that if they are 5 or 6 pigs they eat an 8-year-old corpse in 10 or 12 hours and That if the corpse is cut it will be even faster. He said that the pigs eat the corpse completely, making it disappear completely and only leaving residues in the feces that were not digested.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

Where does it say the blood was that of Joana? Is that hair or part of the mop in the first picture?
Incidentally, what did they do with the clothes Joana was wearing?
When I get the time, I will google translate the sub-titles on that video.

[Angelo222]

Where does it say the blood was that of Joana? Is that hair or part of the mop in the first picture?
Incidentally, what did they do with the clothes Joana was wearing?
When I get the time, I will google translate the sub-titles on that video.

From my original post #68

...it was not possible to determine the DNA of such blood. This is because it was through many other elements of evidence that it was concluded that the blood of the smaller one was collected in the house.

The smaller one being Joana.

The Supreme Court judgement was very clear that blood from the child was left in several places and Leonor attempted to clean it all using bleach. It appears both Leonor and John Cipriano were off their head on drugs and both hit Joana when she came home unexpectedly.  She hit her head badly on a corner of a wall causing fatal injury.  Both were correctly judged guilty imo.

[Carana]

Of course there was Carana.  From memory there was blood on the door and wall where John Cipriano indicated, blood on shoes under a settee and in a fridge/freezer. 
Video timestamp 5.53



Video timestamp 10.49




Here is some physical evidence you might not have seen before.
Video timestamp 10.00



And further physical evidence
Video timestamp 10.39

Thanks for the images, John. What exactly are they supposed to show in terms of Joana's supposed fate.

Did any of the forensic tests correspond to her a) DNA and b) if so, to any substance that would have indicated that she'd died there in the manner of the PJ theory?

I don't find a photo of Joao pointing to a small freezer unit as indicative of anything other than he was told to point to that unit. How could that have contained a child's body without anyone noticing?

[Carana]

Oh dear...so much for the no physical evidence claim.  Do you feel foolish now Carana?

Not at all, but thanks for your concern, Angelo.

Have you found any forensic evidence yet?

[Carana]

All the information is contained in the video misty but in Portuguese.

Which video?

[Carana]

From my original post #68

...it was not possible to determine the DNA of such blood. This is because it was through many other elements of evidence that it was concluded that the blood of the smaller one was collected in the house.

The smaller one being Joana.

The Supreme Court judgement was very clear that blood from the child was left in several places and Leonor attempted to clean it all using bleach. It appears both Leonor and John Cipriano were off their head on drugs and both hit Joana when she came home unexpectedly.  She hit her head badly on a corner of a wall causing fatal injury.  Both were correctly judged guilty imo.

The police didn't inspect the house until 18 days later or whatever the time lapse was.

And what evidence of the interior of the house having been cleaned with bleach?

[John]

The police didn't inspect the house until 18 days later or whatever the time lapse was.

And what evidence of the interior of the house having been cleaned with bleach?

Chemicals were purchased by the Ciprianos after Joana disappeared for that specific purpose.  See appeal transcript.

[Carana]

Chemicals were purchased by the Ciprianos after Joana disappeared for that specific purpose.  See appeal transcript.

Are we looking at the same case? According to this, it was Leandro's mother who told her to buy creosote to get rid of bugs on the outside of the house. Leonor couldn't find any and came back with some petroleum-based product (possibly kerosene). It was the mother who dealt with it with a mop.

Sorry for the gobbledygook that's crept in. I'll replace it if I find the passage without them.

A testemunha AA5, mãe de II, declarou que a CC esteve em sua casa desde 5ª feira a domingo, dia 12 de Setembro, indo para a Figueira com a mãe pelas 18 h. Nesse dia à noite (já estava deitada) o II telefonou-lhe a perguntar se estava lá a CC, tendo a testemunha respondido que a CC tinha ido com a mãe, ao que o II a informou que a CC tinha desaparecido. Disse ainda a testemunha que a arguida BB tinha a casa sempre limpa e tratava bem da casa. Num dia, depois de lá ter ido a SIC, reparou que havia carraças à porta de casa e num pilar e disse à BB para ela ir comprar creolina para as matar. A BB comprou petróleo, dizendo que não havia creolina, e foi a própria testemunha que procedeu à limpeza, no exterior da casa, com a esfregona.

[John]

"aad) on 18:09, BB defendant acquired oil and a steel scrubber, with which washed the house, taking advantage to erase nearly all the evidence than there had been, leaving only human blood traces inside the house, contaminated the products used;"

"The CC4 witness, chief inspector of the PJ, confirmed the auto search and seizure of pgs. 173 in the house of BB defendant when found blood residues on the floor, the walls, the bucket and mop and on the sole of a shoes that were in the room. He noted that the remains were very small and it was apparent that the interior of the house had been washed, and not only the floor, noting also the marks of passing the mop on the walls and doors. She indicated that washing the floor and walls contrasted with the rest of the house, which was "filthy" with dirty clothes everywhere and crockery unwashed "15 days""

"On the other hand, acts contained in the auto replenishment are compatible with RBC traces collected in the room (note that the reconstitution takes place in the room), as is clear from search and seizure carried out in self 22.9.2004 (cfr. pgs. 173 and 233 ff), which states that traces were collected on the floor near the front door, outwardly and inwardly along the inner electrical switch to the right of the entrance door at the entrance of the left side of the couch, a pair MM tennis Silva that was between the sofas, in a mop (stalk) and respective bucket. These traces, as made skills are of human blood and human blood and animal (cfr. Pgs. 235), and although they are insufficient to determine who owns via DNA (pgs. 1780 ff), are revealing that this room it happened something terrible,something that gave rise to that there was human blood on the floor and the walls, which were cleaned with a mop and bucket, and the blood that was in the mop was in the stem, revealing that those who used the mop had in turn dirty hands of blood. Thus, traces collected in the room reinforce the reliability of reconstitution."

https://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=auto&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.dgsi.pt%2Fjstj.nsf%2F954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814%2Fbfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89%3FOpenDocument%26Highlight%3D0%2Ccipriano