McCanns appeal to the European Court of Human Rights

[Eleanor]

Ah, but do they?  Spot the difference.
 
https://www.portugalresident.com/former-mep-ana-gomes-faces-new-case-for-defamation/

https://www.theportugalnews.com/news/court-rejects-isabel-dos-santos-libel-case-against-ana-gomes/52738

Thanks, Misty.  So I am not wrong.

[jassi]

Thanks, Misty.  So I am not wrong.

As you said, "it makes no sense to me at all".

[Eleanor]

As you said, "it makes no sense to me at all".

Can you make any real sense of this sort of corruption?

[The General]

Can you make any real sense of this sort of corruption?

Yes, it's rife, global, ubiquitous and, therefore, inevitable. To make sense of it you need to come to terms with that fact and factor it in.

[Mr Gray]

Yes, it's rife, global, ubiquitous and, therefore, inevitable. To make sense of it you need to come to terms with that fact and factor it in.

some of us already have...thats why the action to the ECHR was necessary...imo..

how else do you counter a judicial system which gives a suspended sentence for a violent rape...and rules that a mans right to beat his wife is ok because the bilble says so

[ShiningInLuz]

Which is most important?  A right to Libel someone without Proof, or a Right to Defend oneself?  I do have some conception of what Portuguese Law is all about, probably influenced by the not so long ago Revolution, but it makes no sense to me at all.  Portugal is a Third World Country and will remain so while the Old Guard are still in charge.

Cobblers, IMO.  Mind you, I just happen to live here, so does it matter.

History.  Revolution was in 1974.  The Old Guard is dead.

[Eleanor]

Yes, it's rife, global, ubiquitous and, therefore, inevitable. To make sense of it you need to come to terms with that fact and factor it in.

I personally don't need to do anything and I certainly don't need to factor corruption into my life.

I don't know The McCanns or The Ciprianos, I am simply passing concerned about Miscarriages of Justice.  And at my age I don't have a lot else to do with parts of my days.

I have been involved with this case since June 2007 and have often been stunned by the Portuguese approach to Justice. 

Portugal is a beautiful country.  I was there on holiday during the Second Revolution and involved in a couple of hairy incidents which didn't actually faze me, but did faze some of my travelling companions.  I am very much a You and Whose Army sort of person having been a Bus Conductress out of Ibrox in my youth.  The drunken football fans were all lovely to me, incidentally.

The ECHR will ultimately have to sort this with some sort of decision.  Meanwhile Madeleine stays in The News.

[Eleanor]

Cobblers, IMO.  Mind you, I just happen to live here, so does it matter.

History.  Revolution was in 1974.  The Old Guard is dead.

You can cobble away all you like.  There were two Revolutions, by the way.

Amaral was born, raised and educated before any revolution happened and he is not yet sixty, so all of the Old Guard are not yet dead.

[The General]

I personally don't need to do anything and I certainly don't need to factor corruption into my life.

I don't know The McCanns or The Ciprianos, I am simply passing concerned about Miscarriages of Justice.  And at my age I don't have a lot else to do with parts of my days.

I have been involved with this case since June 2007 and have often been stunned by the Portuguese approach to Justice. 

Portugal is a beautiful country.  I was there on holiday during the Second Revolution and involved in a couple of hairy incidents which didn't actually faze me, but did faze some of my travelling companions.  I am very much a You and Whose Army sort of person having been a Bus Conductress out of Ibrox in my youth.  The drunken football fans were all lovely to me, incidentally.

The ECHR will ultimately have to sort this with some sort of decision.  Meanwhile Madeleine stays in The News.

My comment wasn't aimed at you; the 'you' was my perception of collective wariness of the insidious and ubiquitous nature of corruption. The UK is no panacea when it comes to judicial systems. (A decent read is The Secret Barrister, for example).

[Eleanor]

My comment wasn't aimed at you; the 'you' was my perception of collective wariness of the insidious and ubiquitous nature of corruption. The UK is no panacea when it comes to judicial systems. (A decent read is The Secret Barrister, for example).

Thank you for the explanation.  You can actually be half a decent Poster when you aren't trying to be a smart ass.

[Mr Gray]

My comment wasn't aimed at you; the 'you' was my perception of collective wariness of the insidious and ubiquitous nature of corruption. The UK is no panacea when it comes to judicial systems. (A decent read is The Secret Barrister, for example).

Of course the UK is not immune to corruption.. But that's not an automatic get out card to dismiss valid criticism of the Portuguese system..
A man convicted of the violent rape of a stranger gets a suspended sentence
A judge defends violence towards a wife because the bible says it right
Would a person bruised as much as cipriano appearing in court be ignored.

There may well be much much more

[The General]

Of course the UK is not immune to corruption.. But that's not an automatic get out card to dismiss valid criticism of the Portuguese system..
A man convicted of the violent rape of a stranger gets a suspended sentence
A judge defends violence towards a wife because the bible says it right
Would a person bruised as much as cipriano appearing in court be ignored.

There may well be much much more

I could provide a similar list from the UK from the last month.
As for the last question - I don't know. I have heard many 2nd hand accounts of police brutality, not dissimilar, but processes are different, bruises heal and police close ranks. Some of these miscreants tacitly 'agree' to these rules of engagement and gird their loins accordingly if apprehended. But that's inner city, granted.
I'm painting a bleak picture, not intentionally, but all of this is pretty routine, shocking as it may seem.

[Mr Gray]

I could provide a similar list from the UK from the last month.



As for the last question - I don't know. I have heard many 2nd hand accounts of police brutality, not dissimilar, but processes are different, bruises heal and police close ranks. Some of these miscreants tacitly 'agree' to these rules of engagement and gird their loins accordingly if apprehended. But that's inner city, granted.
I'm painting a bleak picture, not intentionally, but all of this is pretty routine, shocking as it may seem.

Can you find me an example of a violent stranger rapist found guilty and given a suspended sentence ...a judge using the bible to justify domestic violence..

Im sure you can't.  I'm happy to condemn any poor justice anywhere in the world including the uk

[Mr Gray]

I could provide a similar list from the UK from the last month.
As for the last question - I don't know. I have heard many 2nd hand accounts of police brutality, not dissimilar, but processes are different, bruises heal and police close ranks. Some of these miscreants tacitly 'agree' to these rules of engagement and gird their loins accordingly if apprehended. But that's inner city, granted.
I'm painting a bleak picture, not intentionally, but all of this is pretty routine, shocking as it may seem.

beating a confession out of a woman is not routine.....they were not concerned about the bruises because they were confident hey could get away with it

[The General]

Can you find me an example of a violent stranger rapist found guilty and given a suspended sentence ...a judge using the bible to justify domestic violence..

Im sure you can't.  I'm happy to condemn any poor justice anywhere in the world including the uk

So let me get this straight, you want me to find commensurate 'injustices' of a specifically exact nature, to enable me to bolster my belief that injustice is rife? Why?
As for the 2nd of the two, it's not apples with apples, as we have a secular society and separation of church and state. Portugal was up until recently a Catholic state. As Eleanor alluded to earlier, old habits die hard and I'm sure there's some Octogenarian dinosaurs sitting and presiding in a parochial, inadequate manner as we speak.