Author Topic: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views  (Read 213901 times)

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Offline rulesapply

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1140 on: August 04, 2021, 11:02:26 PM »
Perhaps she has you down as a troll…and you know what you should never do to trolls?

You've said that before so I'll say again, I have never been rude to Sandra Lean, I have never been disrespectful to Sandra Lean. There has never  been argument between SL and myself, to my knowledge. SL has answered my questions except the ones I wanted answers to most.

Offline Parky41

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1141 on: August 05, 2021, 12:11:31 AM »
I’ve said several times on here now that I think Luke murdered Jodi, but cannot say he is guilty beyond reasonable doubt. Here are a few reasons why I’m still not 100% sure he’s guilty:

Just back from a camping hol there, so had some time to read more of IB. In ch.13, from p.233 - 244, SL offers an account that suggests that there may have been a mistaken identity between Luke and Mark Kane on the NB rd on 30.06.03. She makes it clear that MK was in the case files as early as the first week of the investigation, as a person to be traced an interviewed. Although no names are given, an independent witness, according to what MK himself had allegedly told another witness,  is said to have seen MK running up the NB rd on the early evening of 30.06.03, on his way to buy alcohol from either the Morning, noon & night store or Eskbank Trading store. Furthermore, he was named by another 3 separate people to police in the incipient stages of the investigation, as someone the police should speak to. Why did these people draw MK to the police’s attention? Well, the inference is that he was an erratic character, often carried knives, regularly consumed drugs and alcohol (was even on a methadone programme at the time) and was an avid fan of Marilyn Manson and Nirvana. Above all, however, it was his strong resemblance to Luke; he had the same colour & structure of hair to Luke’s, albeit that his was shorter at the back, was of the same build, had the same shape of face, and wore similar clothing (it was established as fact that MK had wore a parka jacket often since 2002). Only difference was that MK was 7 years older and was taller (does anyone know how much taller?). SL indicates, rightly, imo, that given he was on the NB rd that evening, it is possible that the sighting by F & W could have been MK and not Luke — especially as this ‘parka’ type jacket they seen the suspicious looking youth at the gate wearing @ 1744 on the NB rd that fateful night was the type of garment he wore habitually since 2002. Also, F&W said that the person they saw was wearing dark trainers, whereas LM was wearing white trainers/snowboarding boots. (Those 3 cyclists that saw Luke on the nb rd @ 1755 & then 1 of them again at 1820, I know they testified and identified him as wearing the green bomber jacket, but what did they say he was wearing on his feet? Anyone remember? Maybe they never mentioned footwear.)

It seems strange that when the appeal came around, the crown never checked those 2 stores above to see if MK was in them in the early evening, but accepted the footage which placed him in an off-licence at closing time (2200 HRs) meant he had no involvement in the murder? And, more importantly, why was MK deemed ‘untraceable’ when he was living in the student accomodation 6 weeks after the murder?

The above is just one of several little elements of the case that prevent me from saying LM was categorically guilty or that his guilt is beyond reasonable doubt. I will add some more examples of aspects of the case that effuse niggling doubts re LM’s guilt when I have time.

Oh, btw, while I’m here ........ did Leonard Kelly say where behind the wall he heard the disturbing ‘strangling’ noise? Did he say it was nearer to the west or east? Or about halfway? Did he mention the V break in the wall?



And again, this free to give "Make of it what you will?"

Pie in the sky. Those cherry picked areas from the SCCRC (as with everything), of any similarities between Mitchell and MK. That hair parting is something else. is it not? And onto the credibility of both Ms Lean and the claimed witnesses. Whom MK had told that he had ran for booze that evening. Mainly, she highlights only which is necessary for the story and points she wishes to make. That report, as with everything needs entirety of context, not Ms Leans choosing at will, what suits. Even for the very limited areas she does show, with far more self narrative around it - It clearly shows that they were not interested in Ms Leans rather odd logic? Plain and simple. The information and all else was not new.

Where one can clearly see themselves, outwith the cherry picking - that there are no striking similarities between Mitchell and MK. Furthermore there was absolutely no evidence of MK being on that stretch of road at the given time. The only running MK had been doing, as he clearly stated to anyone, was to catch that off licence before it closed at 10pm. And this was confirmed by the very fact of being on that CCTV. Footage that was obtained in 2003.

That MK most definitely had NOT purchased any alcohol at "Morning, Noon and night" nor that of Eskbank Trading - this nonsense of no CCTV footage being checked for him? Where does one imagine the police managed to obtain any? In short, as we had with the claimed witness who gave a statement, of a bike at the V break in the wall - is was not credible, it was impossible. It was confirmed to be lacking of any credible substance. The exact same as with SF, and these other two who gave an account, placing that ? upon MK.

Ms Lean attempts to infer that the SCCRC were missing the point? That being one of mistaken ID? Really? Ms Leans waffle reaches far beyond that of simple mistaken ID. The SCCRC had every right to include, nothing that placed him as suspect in the actual murder. That it, as I have always stated - does not change the evidence against LM, one bit. Perhaps if Ms Lean had not attempted to go the "whole hog" with MK, as she does in the book - then they may just, have given a little more credibility to her logic?? - nope, for every part of the input Ms Lean put in, clearly showed that Ms Lean is rather lacking where common sense comes into play, is she not? Or logic. in one of the "blindingly obvious" Q's she asked in her book?

Quote
The Parka and the Log Burner. P 223. IB.

"Amongst all the confusion and lack of logical reasoning, there is one blindingly obvious question. If the murderer was "not necessarily" bloodstained (the prosecution's position at trial), what possible reason would there be for completely destroying an article of clothing alleged to be associated with the murder?"


And as stated, the whole report, everything put forward. MK and the section 14 interview were only a part of Ms Leans submission - the whole lot giving a rather thoughtful insight, into Ms Lean working mind? She appears genuinely offended at the slight on her credibility - which she has clearly taken the wrong way? They were saying to her, that any similarities did not matter, for there was nothing credible in the first instance to place him, where she stated. That the whole fact the CCTV footage had been obtained, that he had clearly run (tying in with what he had related to others) to catch the shop, to buy the booze before closing time.

Which in itself cancels out a lot more, of this being out of his head, on booze, drugs and all else - not so much? that he managed to run and catch the shop prior to closing - this is logic. Not being off his head, scratched and all else with claimed amnesia, that he ran to get booze after 5.30, did god knows what else before and after. Then ran to get booze again pre 10pm - BS.

Intelligence and common sense stretch much further here. Parka if it were to be MK, no Parka just length, if it were not to be him? If it were him, and this striking resemblance?! wearing khaki green clothing,?? but missing the other one in khaki green clothing? On the same stretch of road. Then if it were not at the gate but further down, to tie in with the jogger, then it was LM, but near to the Abbey entrance where he said he was? So in this they got his ID spot on? But only if it was not at the gate? So what happened to MK?, who Ms Lean goes to extraordinary lengths to place him on the road at the same time?  - is it at all surprising the SCCRC were putting this in the trash?

"Lack of logical reasoning?" - Indeed. MK was NOT seen running on NB road at that time. Really, but not which direction? Nonsense. CCTV of CM after 5pm but nothing more - BS. As with Eskbank Trading, lots of footage checked.

Offline rulesapply

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1142 on: August 05, 2021, 12:12:04 AM »
Perhaps she has you down as a troll…and you know what you should never do to trolls?
Yeah. You should never give them or anyone else a straight answer, it would seem.




Offline rulesapply

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1143 on: August 05, 2021, 12:17:53 AM »


And again, this free to give "Make of it what you will?"

Pie in the sky. Those cherry picked areas from the SCCRC (as with everything), of any similarities between Mitchell and MK. That hair parting is something else. is it not? And onto the credibility of both Ms Lean and the claimed witnesses. Whom MK had told that he had ran for booze that evening. Mainly, she highlights only which is necessary for the story and points she wishes to make. That report, as with everything needs entirety of context, not Ms Leans choosing at will, what suits. Even for the very limited areas she does show, with far more self narrative around it - It clearly shows that they were not interested in Ms Leans rather odd logic? Plain and simple. The information and all else was not new.

Where one can clearly see themselves, outwith the cherry picking - that there are no striking similarities between Mitchell and MK. Furthermore there was absolutely no evidence of MK being on that stretch of road at the given time. The only running MK had been doing, as he clearly stated to anyone, was to catch that off licence before it closed at 10pm. And this was confirmed by the very fact of being on that CCTV. Footage that was obtained in 2003.

That MK most definitely had NOT purchased any alcohol at "Morning, Noon and night" nor that of Eskbank Trading - this nonsense of no CCTV footage being checked for him? Where does one imagine the police managed to obtain any? In short, as we had with the claimed witness who gave a statement, of a bike at the V break in the wall - is was not credible, it was impossible. It was confirmed to be lacking of any credible substance. The exact same as with SF, and these other two who gave an account, placing that ? upon MK.

Ms Lean attempts to infer that the SCCRC were missing the point? That being one of mistaken ID? Really? Ms Leans waffle reaches far beyond that of simple mistaken ID. The SCCRC had every right to include, nothing that placed him as suspect in the actual murder. That it, as I have always stated - does not change the evidence against LM, one bit. Perhaps if Ms Lean had not attempted to go the "whole hog" with MK, as she does in the book - then they may just, have given a little more credibility to her logic?? - nope, for every part of the input Ms Lean put in, clearly showed that Ms Lean is rather lacking where common sense comes into play, is she not? Or logic. in one of the "blindingly obvious" Q's she asked in her book?


And as stated, the whole report, everything put forward. MK and the section 14 interview were only a part of Ms Leans submission - the whole lot giving a rather thoughtful insight, into Ms Lean working mind? She appears genuinely offended at the slight on her credibility - which she has clearly taken the wrong way? They were saying to her, that any similarities did not matter, for there was nothing credible in the first instance to place him, where she stated. That the whole fact the CCTV footage had been obtained, that he had clearly run (tying in with what he had related to others) to catch the shop, to buy the booze before closing time.

Which in itself cancels out a lot more, of this being out of his head, on booze, drugs and all else - not so much? that he managed to run and catch the shop prior to closing - this is logic. Not being off his head, scratched and all else with claimed amnesia, that he ran to get booze after 5.30, did god knows what else before and after. Then ran to get booze again pre 10pm - BS.

Intelligence and common sense stretch much further here. Parka if it were to be MK, no Parka just length, if it were not to be him? If it were him, and this striking resemblance?! wearing khaki green clothing,?? but missing the other one in khaki green clothing? On the same stretch of road. Then if it were not at the gate but further down, to tie in with the jogger, then it was LM, but near to the Abbey entrance where he said he was? So in this they got his ID spot on? But only if it was not at the gate? So what happened to MK?, who Ms Lean goes to extraordinary lengths to place him on the road at the same time?  - is it at all surprising the SCCRC were putting this in the trash?

"Lack of logical reasoning?" - Indeed. MK was NOT seen running on NB road at that time. Really, but not which direction? Nonsense. CCTV of CM after 5pm but nothing more - BS. As with Eskbank Trading, lots of footage checked.

Hope you're well.

Offline Parky41

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1144 on: August 05, 2021, 12:24:44 AM »
Hope you're well.

Thank you. I was just going in to add that to the post. Thanks everyone for the well wishes. Not quite a clean bill of health, but I am fine. :-)

Offline rulesapply

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1145 on: August 05, 2021, 01:16:11 AM »
I’ve said several times on here now that I think Luke murdered Jodi, but cannot say he is guilty beyond reasonable doubt. Here are a few reasons why I’m still not 100% sure he’s guilty:

Just back from a camping hol there, so had some time to read more of IB. In ch.13, from p.233 - 244, SL offers an account that suggests that there may have been a mistaken identity between Luke and Mark Kane on the NB rd on 30.06.03. She makes it clear that MK was in the case files as early as the first week of the investigation, as a person to be traced an interviewed. Although no names are given, an independent witness, according to what MK himself had allegedly told another witness,  is said to have seen MK running up the NB rd on the early evening of 30.06.03, on his way to buy alcohol from either the Morning, noon & night store or Eskbank Trading store. Furthermore, he was named by another 3 separate people to police in the incipient stages of the investigation, as someone the police should speak to. Why did these people draw MK to the police’s attention? Well, the inference is that he was an erratic character, often carried knives, regularly consumed drugs and alcohol (was even on a methadone programme at the time) and was an avid fan of Marilyn Manson and Nirvana. Above all, however, it was his strong resemblance to Luke; he had the same colour & structure of hair to Luke’s, albeit that his was shorter at the back, was of the same build, had the same shape of face, and wore similar clothing (it was established as fact that MK had wore a parka jacket often since 2002). Only difference was that MK was 7 years older and was taller (does anyone know how much taller?). SL indicates, rightly, imo, that given he was on the NB rd that evening, it is possible that the sighting by F & W could have been MK and not Luke — especially as this ‘parka’ type jacket they seen the suspicious looking youth at the gate wearing @ 1744 on the NB rd that fateful night was the type of garment he wore habitually since 2002. Also, F&W said that the person they saw was wearing dark trainers, whereas LM was wearing white trainers/snowboarding boots. (Those 3 cyclists that saw Luke on the nb rd @ 1755 & then 1 of them again at 1820, I know they testified and identified him as wearing the green bomber jacket, but what did they say he was wearing on his feet? Anyone remember? Maybe they never mentioned footwear.)

It seems strange that when the appeal came around, the crown never checked those 2 stores above to see if MK was in them in the early evening, but accepted the footage which placed him in an off-licence at closing time (2200 HRs) meant he had no involvement in the murder? And, more importantly, why was MK deemed ‘untraceable’ when he was living in the student accomodation 6 weeks after the murder?

The above is just one of several little elements of the case that prevent me from saying LM was categorically guilty or that his guilt is beyond reasonable doubt. I will add some more examples of aspects of the case that effuse niggling doubts re LM’s guilt when I have time.

Oh, btw, while I’m here ........ did Leonard Kelly say where behind the wall he heard the disturbing ‘strangling’ noise? Did he say it was nearer to the west or east? Or about halfway? Did he mention the V break in the wall?
Mr. Apples, I ask this all the time of lots of people. If Scott Forbes believed Kane had murdered and mutilated poor Jodi Jones, why did  he wait for nearly three years to make sure he was heard? When did these other witnesses, concerned about Kane come forward? Did they also wait three years? Did all of these supposed, concerned people risk a child killer to be at large for three years? What if another child had been brutally murdered? Did all of these genuine, concerned witnesses just let an innocent sixteen year old be sentenced to life imprisonment before they made any real effort to approach CM? It all smells like BS to me, Mr.Apples. it is what it is. It's nonsense.




Offline Mr Apples

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1146 on: August 06, 2021, 04:24:01 AM »
MK was nothing like LM in appearance.

Hair - different.

Shape of face - different - MK had very distinctive features.

Same build? Don't think so - MK was very lean.

Similar clothing? Not really - LM seemed to dress like a goth - MK would dress much more plainly.

Not sure about the height similarity/difference.

If MK was seen on NB that's probably because we was resident at NB College.

Wasn't MK filmed on CCTV in one of those shops on the night?

I always thought those who named MK to the police did so after prompts by SF.

I wouldn’t say they looked nothing like one another. There were, imo, some similarities — similarities that could easily result in a mistaken identity, especially as every eyewitness except the bicycle boys trio merely had a momentary glance  at this person from a passing car travelling at 30/40 mph. Furthermore, each eyewitness gave different descriptions of what they saw. For example, AB said she saw a male and female at the entrance to the path in Easthouses, that the male had thick shaggy brown hair sticking up in clumps at the back and was wearing a khaki hip-length fisherman’s type jacket with matching khaki trousers (LM was wearing baggy black jeans); LF & RW spotted a male youth leaning on a gate on N’battle rd and said he was wearing a parka-like jacket (cos it ‘went down to his bum’ and he ‘had a haircut that reminded them of Liam Gallagher’). And then, just to throw another spanner in the works, we had the couple (MO & DH) who claimed they saw a male youth on the N’battle rd wearing a green bomber jacket just before 6 o’clock (who both said categorically at trial that it definitely wasn’t LM they saw). You see the problem here? Lack of consistency with all of their descriptions & eyewitness accounts. And that’s not even factoring in that in 2 of those 3 aforementioned accounts, 1 (in the case of witness AB) was shown a photo of Luke from a photo album to ID him — in a photo with a white background so as to make it stand out more from the other photos! The rest of the photos never had a white background & were all quite similar in their own way; no variety in the photos. And the other (in the case of LF & RW), they had seen lots of photos of the prime suspect LM in newspapers and identified him from those. Totally unfair; an id parade should have been used. Moreover, what if the police and media had used a photo of Mark Kane? The investigation might’ve taken a very different path. I’m not saying Mark Kane was guilty, but given he was a person of interest and drawn to the police’s attention on 3 separate occasions in the initial stages of the investigation, he should have been traced and interviewed.

Luke Mitchell lived  near N’battle rd, too. What’s your point?

There were 3 independent witness accounts in the case files from the very beginning of the investigation — all placing MK on the N’battle rd on early evening of 30.06.03 and they all
gave different accounts of why he should have been traced and interviewed and why he had scratches on his face the day after the murder and all noted he was acting erratically in the few days after the murder, too. No prompts from SF; SL makes this clear in p.233-244 of her book, IB. It seems that they dismissed MK because they thought LM guilty quite early on and devoted all their resources & man hours into building a case around LM. I personally think it was quite unprofessional of the not to have fully checked MK out, given all they knew about him and the fact he was drawn to their attention on 3 separate instances within the first few weeks of the investigaton by 3 separate people. It seems they had a hunch early on that LM was the prime suspect and, as a result, devoted all of their resources and man hours into building a case around Luke at expense of exploring other leads. This, imo, highlights that this investigation wasn’t as thorough and professional as it should have been. Investigating MK further could’ve yielded some positive results and eliminated remaining doubts about this case. Like I said, I am more convinced than not that LM was responsible for this horrific crime, but would just like it if these niggling doubts, such as this MK aspect of the case, were banished.






Offline Mr Apples

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1147 on: August 06, 2021, 04:52:09 AM »


And again, this free to give "Make of it what you will?"

Pie in the sky. Those cherry picked areas from the SCCRC (as with everything), of any similarities between Mitchell and MK. That hair parting is something else. is it not? And onto the credibility of both Ms Lean and the claimed witnesses. Whom MK had told that he had ran for booze that evening. Mainly, she highlights only which is necessary for the story and points she wishes to make. That report, as with everything needs entirety of context, not Ms Leans choosing at will, what suits. Even for the very limited areas she does show, with far more self narrative around it - It clearly shows that they were not interested in Ms Leans rather odd logic? Plain and simple. The information and all else was not new.

Where one can clearly see themselves, outwith the cherry picking - that there are no striking similarities between Mitchell and MK. Furthermore there was absolutely no evidence of MK being on that stretch of road at the given time. The only running MK had been doing, as he clearly stated to anyone, was to catch that off licence before it closed at 10pm. And this was confirmed by the very fact of being on that CCTV. Footage that was obtained in 2003.

That MK most definitely had NOT purchased any alcohol at "Morning, Noon and night" nor that of Eskbank Trading - this nonsense of no CCTV footage being checked for him? Where does one imagine the police managed to obtain any? In short, as we had with the claimed witness who gave a statement, of a bike at the V break in the wall - is was not credible, it was impossible. It was confirmed to be lacking of any credible substance. The exact same as with SF, and these other two who gave an account, placing that ? upon MK.

Ms Lean attempts to infer that the SCCRC were missing the point? That being one of mistaken ID? Really? Ms Leans waffle reaches far beyond that of simple mistaken ID. The SCCRC had every right to include, nothing that placed him as suspect in the actual murder. That it, as I have always stated - does not change the evidence against LM, one bit. Perhaps if Ms Lean had not attempted to go the "whole hog" with MK, as she does in the book - then they may just, have given a little more credibility to her logic?? - nope, for every part of the input Ms Lean put in, clearly showed that Ms Lean is rather lacking where common sense comes into play, is she not? Or logic. in one of the "blindingly obvious" Q's she asked in her book?


And as stated, the whole report, everything put forward. MK and the section 14 interview were only a part of Ms Leans submission - the whole lot giving a rather thoughtful insight, into Ms Lean working mind? She appears genuinely offended at the slight on her credibility - which she has clearly taken the wrong way? They were saying to her, that any similarities did not matter, for there was nothing credible in the first instance to place him, where she stated. That the whole fact the CCTV footage had been obtained, that he had clearly run (tying in with what he had related to others) to catch the shop, to buy the booze before closing time.

Which in itself cancels out a lot more, of this being out of his head, on booze, drugs and all else - not so much? that he managed to run and catch the shop prior to closing - this is logic. Not being off his head, scratched and all else with claimed amnesia, that he ran to get booze after 5.30, did god knows what else before and after. Then ran to get booze again pre 10pm - BS.

Intelligence and common sense stretch much further here. Parka if it were to be MK, no Parka just length, if it were not to be him? If it were him, and this striking resemblance?! wearing khaki green clothing,?? but missing the other one in khaki green clothing? On the same stretch of road. Then if it were not at the gate but further down, to tie in with the jogger, then it was LM, but near to the Abbey entrance where he said he was? So in this they got his ID spot on? But only if it was not at the gate? So what happened to MK?, who Ms Lean goes to extraordinary lengths to place him on the road at the same time?  - is it at all surprising the SCCRC were putting this in the trash?

"Lack of logical reasoning?" - Indeed. MK was NOT seen running on NB road at that time. Really, but not which direction? Nonsense. CCTV of CM after 5pm but nothing more - BS. As with Eskbank Trading, lots of footage checked.

Thanks once again for your input, Parky. Will try and respond to your post in due course (will hopefully have some time over the weekend). But, just quickly, why was MK untraceable? He was mentioned on 3 separate occasions within the first few weeks of this investigation. I would have thought that it was a matter of urgency? Remember, LM wouldn’t have been their prime suspect yet, but, still, they couldn’t find this young man who was a local and who was living in the college residence? A tad odd, imo.,

The dark footwear seen by f&w ... thought LM was wearing white? Did he change into the dark footwear because the weather was wet and grey after school? Anticipating bad weather that night? Did he change back into the white  footwear after the f&w sighting, along with changing back into the green bomber jacket between 1742 - 1800? What did mo & DH, the Scottish executive employee and the bicycle boys trio say about footwear?

Finally, can you give me a link to the article that mentions Luke’s friends saying he was more kempt than usual on 30.06.03? I stumbled across it months ago but can’t find it again.

Cheers.

« Last Edit: August 06, 2021, 04:55:55 AM by Mr Apples »

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1148 on: August 06, 2021, 10:06:26 AM »
I wouldn’t say they looked nothing like one another.   

Luke Mitchell lived  near N’battle rd, too. What’s your point?

I would.

My point is that there would be nothing unusual about seeing MK in Newbattle Road, given that he was resident at the College.

Is anyone claiming to have seen MK near Roan's Dyke Path?  At either entrance?

MK's mother says he was investigated and cleared.

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1149 on: August 06, 2021, 10:34:42 AM »


And again, this free to give "Make of it what you will?"

Pie in the sky. Those cherry picked areas from the SCCRC (as with everything), of any similarities between Mitchell and MK. That hair parting is something else. is it not? And onto the credibility of both Ms Lean and the claimed witnesses. Whom MK had told that he had ran for booze that evening. Mainly, she highlights only which is necessary for the story and points she wishes to make. That report, as with everything needs entirety of context, not Ms Leans choosing at will, what suits. Even for the very limited areas she does show, with far more self narrative around it - It clearly shows that they were not interested in Ms Leans rather odd logic? Plain and simple. The information and all else was not new.

This is exactly what she does - among other things - and why nothing will come of the bs being promoted publicly

Many others will be aware of the ‘entirety of context’ including I suspect [Name removed]’s family
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1150 on: August 06, 2021, 10:39:32 AM »
Where one can clearly see themselves, outwith the cherry picking - that there are no striking similarities between Mitchell and MK. Furthermore there was absolutely no evidence of MK being on that stretch of road at the given time. The only running MK had been doing, as he clearly stated to anyone, was to catch that off licence before it closed at 10pm. And this was confirmed by the very fact of being on that CCTV. Footage that was obtained in 2003.

Mark Kane was and is factually innocent of any involvement in this case!

Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Mr Apples

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1151 on: August 06, 2021, 02:22:19 PM »
This is exactly what she does - among other things - and why nothing will come of the bs being promoted publicly

Many others will be aware of the ‘entirety of context’ including I suspect [Name removed]’s family

Hi, Nicholas. Good to see you’re still around and contributing to the forum. Is there anything online that could give this ‘entirety of context’? All the Scots court literature I’ve read thus far doesn’t mention MK at all. In fact, the only reason I know of him is a direct result of the C5 documentary and SL’s book, IB. My gut feeling is that you’re probably right, in terms of her cherry-picking when it suits, and adding arms and legs to strawmen arguments; IB, imo, is replete with weak arguments, a lot of whataboutery, repetition and clutching at straws. I’m not lambasting SL or anything like that — she’s a strong, independent and intelligent woman that I respect to a degree — but her theories, inferences and conclusions are not without flaw. Btw, does anyone know on what grounds she initially thought LM to be guilty? Would be interesting to read her original take on the case before she reversed her opinion.

Oh, that reminds me . . . Nicholas, do you and Parky know Sandra personally? Have you both met her? Have you both studied at postgraduate level? Not being a nosey git, just curious.   8(0(*

Offline mrswah

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Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1152 on: August 06, 2021, 06:57:44 PM »
Hi, Nicholas. Good to see you’re still around and contributing to the forum. Is there anything online that could give this ‘entirety of context’? All the Scots court literature I’ve read thus far doesn’t mention MK at all. In fact, the only reason I know of him is a direct result of the C5 documentary and SL’s book, IB. My gut feeling is that you’re probably right, in terms of her cherry-picking when it suits, and adding arms and legs to strawmen arguments; IB, imo, is replete with weak arguments, a lot of whataboutery, repetition and clutching at straws. I’m not lambasting SL or anything like that — she’s a strong, independent and intelligent woman that I respect to a degree — but her theories, inferences and conclusions are not without flaw. Btw, does anyone know on what grounds she initially thought LM to be guilty? Would be interesting to read her original take on the case before she reversed her opinion.

Oh, that reminds me . . . Nicholas, do you and Parky know Sandra personally? Have you both met her? Have you both studied at postgraduate level? Not being a nosey git, just curious.   8(0(*

Didn't realise SL originally thought LM was guilty !

Perhaps, she was seduced by the media coverage, like everyone else.

Offline Paranoid Android

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1153 on: August 06, 2021, 07:25:36 PM »
Didn't realise SL originally thought LM was guilty !

Perhaps, she was seduced by the media coverage, like everyone else.

Not everyone who believes LM is guilty was seduced by media coverage.

Naughty.

Offline rulesapply

Re: Is Luke Mitchell guilty - your views
« Reply #1154 on: August 06, 2021, 08:33:02 PM »
Not everyone who believes LM is guilty was seduced by media coverage.

Sorry, for mrswah.

Naughty.

Maybe you were seduced by media coverage, mrswah.