Author Topic: Strange Witness Statements  (Read 241442 times)

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Online pathfinder73

Strange Witness Statements
« on: October 18, 2013, 10:15:13 PM »
Here's one I've just read:

Witness statement  2007.11.21 (in English)

Statement of Carolyn Kish

Statement date 21.11.07

 I am a British national, and I live in a house in the village in Portugal having lived there for 9 years.

 I used to live in Worcester and my family still live there.

 I came back to UK on 23rd April 07 to Coventry. I believe with Fly Thomson and was travelling alone.

 I flew back with the same airline on 30th April from Coventry to Faro.

 I had booked my travel arrangements through a company in Lagos. Part of the package included collecting me from faro and taking me home.

 I didn't see any news as my T.V. was not working.

On the afternoon of Monday 7.5.07 I was in Lagos as I needed to do some banking. My car is xxxx coloured and has an English Registration.

 Near to the main road in Lagos is a pedestrian area. There are parking spaces at the side and I parked in one of those spaces. There are ATMS near there and I went to the one on the left hand. I don't know what the bank is called but it is about 3 doors away from the Banco Espirito Santos.

 On walking towards the ATM I was aware of a man in the pedestrian area. He was holding something to his ear which I thought might be a Dictaphone but later assumed it was a mobile phone.

I noticed him as he was talking very loudly. I remember him saying 'PLEASE DO NOT HURT MADELEINE' There was a lot of other speech, but I can only remember that phrase.

 I think he had a notebook in his left hand and I think he was holding the phone in his right hand. The notebook seemed to be the type that journalists use. He seemed very upset and the way he was acting and with the notebook I assumed he was an actor or journalist.

 It was very quiet and no-one else was around.

 He was pacing up and down, being 10 metres away from me at the furthest, and the closest he was just a few feet away as he walked past me at the back while I was using the ATM.

 I would describe him as a white male about 5.6' with pale mousey coloured hair. It think he was wearing an overcoat or raincoat of dark coloured with grey being the main colour I remember. I thought he was talking with a slight Irish accent.

 I withdrew 150 Euros at the bank and I also withdraw some cash from my fathers account. I was at the machine for a couple of minutes and when I left the man was still there walking and pacing up and down. I thought to myself 'who's Madeleine'. When I got back into my car the man was still there as I drove away.

 I had a lot of chances to see the man's face during that time, and I had never seen him before.


 The account the card services is xxxxxxxxxxxxxx in my name at the xxxxx branch. The sort code xxxxxxxx and the account no. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. The card has now been replaced with another sand I don't have the old card number.


 I was then going to xxxxxx (a two minute drive away. I was going to do some insurance paperwork.

 I have been a member of this bank for many years and am known by staff there. There were 3 staff working and I know that lunch is between 1pm and 2pm, so I think my visit was before that. One of the staff was xxxxx, one was xxx. I was talking to the one of the staff xxxxx. She has a daughter called xxxxx and she always chats when I visit.

 She asked me if I heard about the missing English girl. I said I hadn't seen any news. She told me the missing child was called Madeleine and had gone missing from a resort along the coast. I told her that the man I had just heard must have been the father of the child. I only assumed this by logic and from the conversation AFTER the fact.

 In relation to the identity of the man I saw I thought initially that he must be the father based on what he said and what the staff had said about the missing girl.

 I went to the third local bank to do some more banking.

 I don't usually watch or follow news. But months after this saw a news report on the local TV station at home. The footage showed the father of the missing girl. At that point I realised it was the man I had seen on the occasion above. I had not seen this picture before, but I am as sure as can be that he is the person.

 I have been asked whether I have made this assumption but I do not believe I have. I am 99.99% sure if shown his photograph with lots of others I would have picked him out as the man.

 I have heard GM on t.v. And my interpretation of his accent is that it's slight Scottish or Irish.

 I am more interested in the case and have been following it since this event.



765/2268
« Last Edit: August 05, 2016, 01:26:42 AM by John »
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Cariad

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Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #1 on: October 18, 2013, 10:19:36 PM »
Thank you, I've never read that one! Bizarre!

Offline LagosBen

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2013, 10:20:05 PM »
I thought that was dismissed by the PJ as it being GMcCann.

Offline Benice

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #3 on: October 18, 2013, 10:29:10 PM »
I thought that was dismissed by the PJ as it being GMcCann.

IIRC it was proved from the phone records that Gerry was elsewhere at the time.
The notion that innocence prevails over guilt – when there is no evidence to the contrary – is what separates civilization from barbarism.    Unfortunately, there are remains of barbarism among us.    Until very recently, it headed the PJ in Portimão. I hope he was the last one.
                                               Henrique Monteiro, chief editor, Expresso, Portugal

Offline LagosBen

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #4 on: October 18, 2013, 10:30:13 PM »
IIRC it was proved from the phone records that Gerry was elsewhere at the time.

Thought so  - Thanks Benice.

Online pathfinder73

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #5 on: October 19, 2013, 10:49:31 AM »
Jose Manuel Conceicao Pacheco Statement Processo Vol XIII 3924 to 3926 - 30th October 2007

"He gave them the key to the church on the 7th or 8th May upon the suggestion of John Geraghty, a resident of the parish, so that they could calmly go to the church without any media pressure. Someone from the church gave the key to John Geraghty, who then passed it on to the McCann's, with Father Pacheco's permission.
He does not remember the date upon which the key was returned."

Where is this church location?
« Last Edit: October 19, 2013, 11:15:57 AM by pathfinder73 »
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline C.Edwards

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #6 on: October 19, 2013, 11:59:56 AM »
IIRC it was proved from the phone records that Gerry was elsewhere at the time.

How could this be done?  logically, I mean?  If GM had a PAYG phone, it could have been him. If someone else had GM's phone in PDL at the same time, this man could still have been him.

How do phone records rule this out and where's the evidence of it being done, benice?  Lagos Ben may be happy to accept your word, but you're hardly impartial, are you?  8(0(*

Offline Benice

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #7 on: October 19, 2013, 12:49:01 PM »
How could this be done?  logically, I mean?  If GM had a PAYG phone, it could have been him. If someone else had GM's phone in PDL at the same time, this man could still have been him.

How do phone records rule this out and where's the evidence of it being done, benice?  Lagos Ben may be happy to accept your word, but you're hardly impartial, are you?  8(0(*

From Kates Book

Quote
One witness reported having seen Gerry in Lagos on 7th May on his mobile phone saying to somebody, 'Don't hurt Madeleine'.  At the time we were both in Praia da Luz surrounded by media, police and embassy officials, as of course Gerry's phone records  showed.
End Quote.

I don't know anything about mob phones or phone pings.  But I do remember reading that phone pings established that Gerry could not have been in Lagos at that time.   Soz haven't got time to look for that now.

The notion that innocence prevails over guilt – when there is no evidence to the contrary – is what separates civilization from barbarism.    Unfortunately, there are remains of barbarism among us.    Until very recently, it headed the PJ in Portimão. I hope he was the last one.
                                               Henrique Monteiro, chief editor, Expresso, Portugal

AnneGuedes

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Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #8 on: October 19, 2013, 01:12:25 PM »
The only indisputable proof would be imo that an independent person said Mr McCann was with him elsewhere at the time indicated by the receipts of the multiple bank operations of the witness.

Offline C.Edwards

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #9 on: October 19, 2013, 01:38:16 PM »
From Kates Book

Quote
One witness reported having seen Gerry in Lagos on 7th May on his mobile phone saying to somebody, 'Don't hurt Madeleine'.  At the time we were both in Praia da Luz surrounded by media, police and embassy officials, as of course Gerry's phone records  showed.
End Quote.

I don't know anything about mob phones or phone pings.  But I do remember reading that phone pings established that Gerry could not have been in Lagos at that time.   Soz haven't got time to look for that now.

With respect... that's no proof!  In fact I find it odd that Kate even takes the time to refute something in this manner where she seems over-keen to play down a sighting almost.  It draws attention to something that didn't really need to be mentioned.  As Anne says, independent witnesses would be good. Phone pings are useless as there's no way of knowing who had Gerry's phone at the time really.

Offline jassi

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #10 on: October 19, 2013, 01:42:27 PM »
With respect... that's no proof!  In fact I find it odd that Kate even takes the time to refute something in this manner where she seems over-keen to play down a sighting almost.  It draws attention to something that didn't really need to be mentioned.  As Anne says, independent witnesses would be good. Phone pings are useless as there's no way of knowing who had Gerry's phone at the time really.

Yes, who was being phoned at the time might be of more interest and use.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -  10 years and still no solution.

Offline xtina

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #11 on: October 19, 2013, 02:10:26 PM »
This is  really uncanny...only  last  night  was  i  sat thinking about  the  past week events ....and was [albeit wishful thinking] expecting the concrete around he  mccs to crack  ...but as yet  this  doesn't  seem likely again.

ararom the beginning  ...nothing  IMO seemed  to fit  ...[at first my heart  went  out  to them] then felt  some  thing was not  right some thing was very wrong.without listing numerous  things  it is as if they knew  from the beginning  they were  in for  the long haul.....an never IMO  acted lile they thought maddie was with a peado or  in  any real  danger ....at one point felt it was a scam ...as in maddie would turn up in a church or some where perfectly  safe...

None of it  ever makes  sense  ...if it was a film you  would think  it too far fetched ..over  the  top..to unbelievable..

but it is real and this  is why last night  trying to make sense of it i actually thought could  it be someone knows who has  her ....and  this  is  why it  is   they get  so so much  protection ....like from the beginnig Gordon  brown was involved it turned  political.....government  top  pr  man [clarence mitchel] at there beck  and call every  time in a  corner  ..it always went there  way  [too many instances to mention]

like the op ...it could be it did happen yet  another  thing changed  to suit....the many many people i have  talke to about this  case  everyone  who have thought the  mccs  innocent all  agree that something is  not right  ...

Now OK  within the  click of a finger the 9 15  sighting doesn't fit  ....ye right if a child was lifted from a bed in a  hurry accectable to be  dressed  in  only  pyjamas  ....

but  comeeee onnnnn  not  when  picked  up from  a creche in the  cold of night carried  in that position[not snuggled up to his  body]  wearing no coat ..................or shoes/slippers

just trying  to make some sense of it all...
All my posts are IMO

Offline DCI

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Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #12 on: October 19, 2013, 03:18:17 PM »
Thank you, I've never read that one! Bizarre!

I wonder why it took Roman Stern to report her sighting, on the 8th September, to the police, after she had told him, that day?.
Why did the PJ have to track her down from her CV  to get a statement? Finally giving a statement 6 months after the event.
She said she hadn't heard about Madeleine's abduction, till the 7th May, after being told by a bank worker.

Makes interesting reading.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CAROLYN-KISH.htm
Kate's 500 Mile Cycle Challenge

https://www.justgiving.com/KateMcCann/

Online pathfinder73

Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #13 on: October 19, 2013, 03:52:48 PM »


When Kate was interviewed on 26 April last year on the Oprah Winfrey show, she made an appeal: "I hope that the abductors cover her with her blanket." The mother of Maddie, who disappeared in Praia da Luz in 2007, was referring to the pink blanket which 4 year old Maddie slept with every night. This same blanket was photographed by the PJ on the day following the disappearance, but it was never seen again. "If the blanket was there the next day, how was it possible for the abductors to take it. It is also with this that I will try to get the case reopened.", stated Gonçalo Amaral, ex-coordinator of the PJ in Portimão.

Is this true?

Also was Smithman going in the direction of that church the McCann's got the keys to on 7/8 May?
« Last Edit: October 19, 2013, 04:12:41 PM by pathfinder73 »
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline DCI

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  • Why are some folks so sick in the head!!!
Re: Strange Witness Statements
« Reply #14 on: October 19, 2013, 05:24:01 PM »
You will find the GNR had that pink blanket.

It never was missing - it was given to Portuguese Dog handler.

The just talked to some colleagues from the PJ and asked for a piece of clothing that Madeleine had worn or used recently. They were given a pink/orange blanket that the child had been covered with in her bed.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CARLOS-LACAO.htm
Kate's 500 Mile Cycle Challenge

https://www.justgiving.com/KateMcCann/