The chain of command in the Bamber inquiry

[mrswah]

Chief Sup Harris decided it was murder/suicide. He was at soc long before DCI Jones.

So, do you think Chief Sup Harris influenced Taff Jones?  Were they at SOC at the same time?

I find it very difficult to believe that the police and firearms people waited so long to go in merely because they were influenced by what Jeremy said. I can't believe that's what  "first responders" do in an emergency !!

I also find it very difficult to believe that TWO senior police officers could have got things so wrong.

[APRIL]

Where you refer to DS Jones I assume you mean DCI Jones?

I think the delay in entering was partly down to waiting for daylight.  Although at that time of the year its light long before 7.30 am.

I don't buy into the police being over conditioned by what JB told then to the extent their minds were closed.  If that was the case why did soc officers collect and document numerous exhibits for forensic examination and take hundreds of soc images?

Yes, Holly. In my head, they remain Welsh Jones and Other Jones!!!

Okay. For starters, I think it would have been done ENTIRELY differently had Jeremy not been present. Whatever is said to the contrary, their actions were largely informed by Jeremy. None of them wanted to be dead heroes. Of course they'd have listened to him. I'm willing to bet they'd have gone in immediately after getting no response to their calls, but whilst someone was standing beside them talking about the alleged shooter's prowess with firearms and her two little boys, they remained hesitant. Not that I think the eventual outcome would have been any different.

[barrier]

Yes, Holly. In my head, they remain Welsh Jones and Other Jones!!!

Okay. For starters, I think it would have been done ENTIRELY differently had Jeremy not been present. Whatever is said to the contrary, their actions were largely informed by Jeremy. None of them wanted to be dead heroes. Of course they'd have listened to him. I'm willing to bet they'd have gone in immediately after getting no response to their calls, but whilst someone was standing beside them talking about the alleged shooter's prowess with firearms and her two little boys, they remained hesitant. Not that I think the eventual outcome would have been any different.

They had no reason to be suspicious of JB's actions/words at the time,so its logical to listen to him.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Chief Sup Harris decided it was murder/suicide. He was at soc long before DCI Jones.

No, in the VERY early stages he ASSUMED it was murder/suicide going by what Jeremy had said; not knowing Jeremy was a pathological liar & psychopath; and not having the nous to realise the rifle had been staged in Sheila’s lap to make it appear she’d committed suicide.

He may have been a fairly intelligent policeman in some ways, but he certainly didn’t use his grey matter on that day!

There were red flags all over the place; none of which he noticed — until much later when it had to pointed out to him and that’s when he realised he’d made a HUGE mistake.

[Robittybob1]

It's a long while since I read the book, please remind me if you have it.

There are some chapters online (Google books) but I crashed as I was reading it.  I haven't read enough of it to comment to any degree.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Where you refer to DS Jones I assume you mean DCI Jones?

I think the delay in entering was partly down to waiting for daylight.  Although at that time of the year its light long before 7.30 am.

I don't buy into the police being over conditioned by what JB told then to the extent their minds were closed.  If that was the case why did soc officers collect and document numerous exhibits for forensic examination and take hundreds of soc images?

Police have to take all evidence for forensics even if it’s a straightforward suicide of one person!

[barrier]

No, in the VERY early stages he ASSUMED it was murder/suicide going by what Jeremy had said; not knowing Jeremy was a pathological liar & psychopath; and not having the nous to realise the rifle had been staged in Sheila’s lap to make it appear she’d committed suicide.

He may have been a fairly intelligent policeman in some ways, but he certainly didn’t use his grey matter on that day!

There were red flags all over the place; none of which he noticed — until much later when it had to pointed out to him and that’s when he realised he’d made a HUGE mistake.

Did he admit  to it?

[Robittybob1]

Police have to take all evidence for forensics even if it’s a straightforward suicide of one person!

Can you provide a cite that confirms that?  I was under the impression the number of samples taken in a suicide case would be limited.

[Robittybob1]

Did he admit  to it?

He died in an accident, didn't he.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Did he admit  to it?

Yes.

After it emerged that Jeremy Bamber was the suspect all the police had a board meeting arranged by Taff Jones. He asked them all to say who they thought had done it: Jeremy or Sheila.

Every single officer, Harris included, said Jeremy.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Can you provide a cite that confirms that?  I was under the impression the number of samples taken in a suicide case would be limited.

You’ll have to Google it

I’ve a busy day ahead

[Holly Goodhead]

No, in the VERY early stages he ASSUMED it was murder/suicide going by what Jeremy had said; not knowing Jeremy was a pathological liar & psychopath; and not having the nous to realise the rifle had been staged in Sheila’s lap to make it appear she’d committed suicide.

He may have been a fairly intelligent policeman in some ways, but he certainly didn’t use his grey matter on that day!

There were red flags all over the place; none of which he noticed — until much later when it had to pointed out to him and that’s when he realised he’d made a HUGE mistake.

Chief Sup Harris saw the authentic soc ie SC's head raised against the bedside cabinet and everthing else in situ ie bible and rifle.  The soc images represent the soc after it had been interfered with not by JB but those at soc.

[Robittybob1]

Chief Sup Harris saw the authentic soc ie SC's head raised against the bedside cabinet and everthing else in situ ie bible and rifle.  The soc images represent the soc after it had been interfered with not by JB but those at soc.

You can't prove that either.   If her head was up how could the bullet end up in her brain?

[mrswah]

Yes.

After it emerged that Jeremy Bamber was the suspect all the police had a board meeting arranged by Taff Jones. He asked them all to say who they thought had done it: Jeremy or Sheila.

Every single officer, Harris included, said Jeremy.

That's how it was on the TV series!

I suspect there was at least a little  dramatic effect there,to be honest.

[Holly Goodhead]

So, do you think Chief Sup Harris influenced Taff Jones?  Were they at SOC at the same time?

I find it very difficult to believe that the police and firearms people waited so long to go in merely because they were influenced by what Jeremy said. I can't believe that's what  "first responders" do in an emergency !!

I also find it very difficult to believe that TWO senior police officers could have got things so wrong.

All officers at soc incl the police surgeon were signed up to murder/suicide.  DS Jones was the only early dissenter but he was never a rising star.  He retired at DS rank.

First respondents arrived circa 4 am.  They then had to call firearms and get authorisation for such an operation and wait until all these people arrived.  Upon arrival they sought JB's input re the layout of the farmhouse and assigned positions to firearms officers.  In between this they attempted to make contact with the farmhouse via a loud jailer.  All these things take time.