Could an intruder have opened the shutter and climbed in the window?

[Benice]

Smithman was out at that time but I don't think he was bundleman. But JT's unbelievable testimony doesn't help. She walked past Gerry and Jeremy on the same side of the road without either noticing and then spotted him. That's another big discrepancy.

Why would you claim JT's testimony was 'unbelievable' - when the man she saw has been identified by SY as almost certainly being a tourist carrying his own child - and insodoing have also proved JT to be correct in what she saw?

 

[AnneGuedes]

Why would you claim JT's testimony was 'unbelievable' - when the man she saw has been identified by SY as almost certainly being a tourist carrying his own child - and insodoing have also proved JT to be correct in what she saw?

 

No, Benice, this is speculation. DCI RW said nothing of that kind. He didn't even said where nor when this Innocentman walked, just near the McCann flat.

[pathfinder73]

You have to try and figure out Smithman's unusual behaviour and actions. I don't believe it's a coincidence that he was spotted after the alarm had been raised. Some think Madeleine wandered out of the apartment but there's no evidence to suggest that happened so I look at alternative solutions from the discrepancies in the statements and from the dog findings, window evidence etc. Smithman had to be quick but they were all running in different directions so he could get to where he needed to go very quickly.

[Benice]

SY studied likely and thoroughly the possibility that Smithman was another Innocentman. There are not many children matching Smithgirl in PDL in the beginning of May.
There are police boats all along that coast which is a border of the EU.

Amaral himself comments on the criminal activities which were taking place by boat along the Algarve coast.

Quote from his book

The Algarvian coast, very popular with sailing enthusiasts, is bordered by a large number of marinas. Pleasure boats from every province berth here. Situated 120 nautical miles from the African continent, between the Mediterranean and the Atlantic, it is the most accessible coast for entering the continent of Europe. It attracts many yachtsmen, who appreciate the beauty of its beaches and its inlets, but it also attracts all sorts of traffickers.
End quote

[AnneGuedes]

Amaral himself comments on the criminal activities which were taking place by boat along the Algarve coast.

Quote from his book

The Algarvian coast, very popular with sailing enthusiasts, is bordered by a large number of marinas. Pleasure boats from every province berth here. Situated 120 nautical miles from the African continent, between the Mediterranean and the Atlantic, it is the most accessible coast for entering the continent of Europe. It attracts many yachtsmen, who appreciate the beauty of its beaches and its inlets, but it also attracts all sorts of traffickers.
End quote

All sorts of drugs, but also Spanish boats, better equipped, that fish in Portuguese waters. That's why the coast is protected by many police boats.

[Benice]

No, Benice, this is speculation. DCI RW said nothing of that kind. He didn't even said where nor when this Innocentman walked, just near the McCann flat.

What speculation and by whom?    SY said there was compelling evidence to believe that the man JT saw was a man they have since identified.    If they didn't say that - then what did they say?   

The fact that they chose not to spend time during the programm in divulging every last tiny detail of their findings regarding that person is irrelevant imo.     The main message SY wanted to convey to the public was that this new information affected the timelines because it meant the abductor could have taken Madeleine after the time of JT's sighting.

[Benice]

All sorts of drugs, but also Spanish boats, better equipped, that fish in Portuguese waters. That's why the coast is protected by many police boats.

No Anne - he does not say ''all sorts of drugs''.  He says ''all sorts of traffickers''.

 ''All sorts of traffickers'' includes human traffickers.   

[pathfinder73]

Why would you claim JT's testimony was 'unbelievable' - when the man she saw has been identified by SY as almost certainly being a tourist carrying his own child - and insodoing have also proved JT to be correct in what she saw?

I don't doubt that she saw bundleman/tannerman but she couldn't have passed Gerry and Jez on the same side of the road without either noticing. That's the unbelievable bit.

[pegasus]

Here's an assumption:
"The person(s) who did or invented the window/shutter opening MUST be the same as the person(s) who disappeared a child"

Mr Spock would see the danger of that assumption immediately.
Yes it seems logical. But it is not. Quite the opposite.

Plus, it potentially risks missing the solving of the case, because it rules out the following possibility:
"The person(s) who did the window/shutter opening does not know, and has nothing to do with, the person(s) who disappeared a child"
which leads to much more plausible scenarios IMO.

[Lyall]

What speculation and by whom?    SY said there was compelling evidence to believe that the man JT saw was a man they have since identified.    If they didn't say that - then what did they say?   

The fact that they chose not to spend time during the programm in divulging every last tiny detail of their findings regarding that person is irrelevant imo.     The main message SY wanted to convey to the public was that this new information affected the timelines because it meant the abductor could have taken Madeleine after the time of JT's sighting.

Didn't Redwood say a man had contacted them and said he might be 9.15 man?

[Lyall]

What speculation and by whom?    SY said there was compelling evidence to believe that the man JT saw was a man they have since identified.    If they didn't say that - then what did they say?   

The fact that they chose not to spend time during the programm in divulging every last tiny detail of their findings regarding that person is irrelevant imo.     The main message SY wanted to convey to the public was that this new information affected the timelines because it meant the abductor could have taken Madeleine after the time of JT's sighting.

He contacted them, not the other way around.

If my memory serves me well... >@@(*&)

[AnneGuedes]

What speculation and by whom?    SY said there was compelling evidence to believe that the man JT saw was a man they have since identified.    If they didn't say that - then what did they say?   

The fact that they chose not to spend time during the programm in divulging every last tiny detail of their findings regarding that person is irrelevant imo.     The main message SY wanted to convey to the public was that this new information affected the timelines because it meant the abductor could have taken Madeleine after the time of JT's sighting.

The AG didn't share your opinion about what is irrelevant, he considered reconstitution was necessary about Ms Tanner passing along two persons without being seen.

[AnneGuedes]

He contacted them, not the other way around.

If my memory serves me well... >@@(*&)

They contacted him I think.

[AnneGuedes]

No Anne - he does not say ''all sorts of drugs''.  He says ''all sorts of traffickers''.

 ''All sorts of traffickers'' includes human traffickers.

You are extrapolating, GA doesn't speak of human traffic. Those precarious boats from Africa don't end up near the Portuguese coast, but in Mediterranean ones.

[pathfinder73]

Here's an assumption:
"The person(s) who did or invented the window/shutter opening MUST be the same as the person(s) who disappeared a child"

Mr Spock would see the danger of that assumption immediately.
Yes it seems logical. But it is not. Quite the opposite.

Plus, it potentially risks missing the solving of the case, because it rules out the following possibility:
"The person(s) who did the window/shutter opening does not know, and has nothing to do with, the person(s) who disappeared a child"
which leads to much more plausible scenarios IMO.

Madeleine didn't go out through the window and it wasn't a means of entry or exit for anyone. The only evidence found on it were fingerprints. The window will be used to show that an abductor didn't need to open it. Actually it would be crazy for an abductor to take the unnecessary risk and wasting precious time in raising those noisy shutters, never mind squeezing past cots, bed, chair in the dark without leaving any evidence. If an opportunist  burglar opened it and fled empty handed then he timed it very well because it wasn't open at 9.30 and JT and ROB both went through the car park at the front of the apartments after that time and didn't notice it being open. It was found open a short time later according to Kate.