Amaral and the dogs

[Alice Purjorick]

There are those who think nice DCI Redwood may have got it wrong. Just like the 'Drs McCann' they prefer Tannerman. I wonder why? Perhaps because nasty Mr Amaral favoured Smithman.

Who it has to be said was a person of interest who needed to be identified according to that same nice DCI Redwood formerly of "probably the best police force in the world".
It would seem he hasn't come forward yet or The Yard are keeping shtum about it.

[G-Unit]

Who it has to be said was a person of interest who needed to be identified according to that same nice DCI Redwood formerly of "probably the police force in the world".
It would seem he hasn't come forward yet or The Yard are keeping shtum about it.

You do realise we're off topic don't you? Never mind, I think everyone else is having Sunday tea. I wonder who he could be? He can't be another innocent Dad from the night creche coz I assume nice ex - DCI Redwood found all eight families who were using it that night. He didn't look like any of the other e-fits either.

[Eleanor]

Okay, back On Topic or the inevitable will occur.

[pathfinder73]

Amaral's exact theory (which I think is wrong) has discovery in the last check about 10.00pm at location = sofa lounge. Then at 10.05pm he has location = Rua 25 Abril.
His theory provides no time and no reason to unnecessary sandwich another location = cupboard other bedroom in between. And what would be the point of that?

Amaral believes the cadaver was moved from behind the sofa and hidden out of sight in the wardrobe so why he said Kate found the cadaver at that time is confusing to say the least. You would hide something if you thought it may be seen by others. You don't hide a cadaver there when people are opening wardrobes and frantically looking for a missing child. Any cadaver would be found so that puts the timeline back for that theory to work. The only credible solution for that theory is two separate moves - one out of 5A and a second later move to further away i.e. Smithman sighting.

[G-Unit]

Okay, back On Topic or the inevitable will occur.

Hi Eleanor, thought you'd gone somewhere ha ha.

[Eleanor]

Hi Eleanor, thought you'd gone somewhere ha ha.

No chance.  I'm a 24/7 sort of person.

[mercury]

Amaral believes the cadaver was moved from behind the sofa and hidden out of sight in the wardrobe so why he said Kate found the cadaver at that time is confusing to say the least. You would hide something if you thought it may be seen by others. You don't hide a cadaver there when people are opening wardrobes and frantically looking for a missing child. Any cadaver would be found so that puts the timeline back for that theory to work. The only credible solution for that theory is two separate moves - one out of 5A and a second later move to further away i.e. Smithman sighting.

It will have been puzzling to anyone, tryng to piece together all the evidence gathered. And, as far as I know, all he has insisted on was a belief that there was no abductor. The rest  was hypothesising., ie the how, when and where of the child's demise. Remember, the Portuguese police had not even heard of cadaver dogs, let alone use them, before this case. (source was a PJ spokesman, whose name escapes me-the one who had said they are not suspects and days later said they were)

[pathfinder73]

It will have been puzzling to anyone, tryng to piece together all the evidence gathered. And, as far as I know, all he has insisted on was a belief that there was no abductor. The rest  was hypothesising., ie the how, when and where of the child's demise. Remember, the Portuguese police had not even heard of cadaver dogs, let alone use them, before this case. (source was a PJ spokesman, whose name escapes me-the one who had said they are not suspects and days later said they were)

They were suspects to the PJ but not officially. Adrian Prout was not officially a suspect when they charged him. Eddie's alert changed that case it was after the Madeleine McCann one.

28 January 2009
The husband of a missing Gloucestershire woman is no longer suspected of her murder, police have confirmed.
Kate Prout, 56, disappeared on 5 November 2007 from her farm at Redmarley in the Forest of Dean.
Adrian Prout, 46, was arrested that month on suspicion of her murder. He was arrested again in February 2008.
He has not been charged with any offence. He was due to answer police bail on Friday but has been released.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/gloucestershire/7856110.stm

10 Mar 2009
Adrian Prout, the husband of retired teacher Kate Prout, who disappeared 16 months ago from her 200-acre farm in Redmarley D'Abitot, Gloucestershire, has been charged with her murder.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/4967338/Farmer-charged-with-murder-of-missing-wife-Kate-Prout.html

[mercury]

Yes, they were, especially after the dogs were brought in, and in mid August 2007 it was said there is evidence somethng may have happened to the child inside the apartment but that the parents were not suspects.

I remembered his name now,Olegario Sousa

They were not made suspects till nearly a month later...proof I would have thought that the PJ were not really gunning for them or seeking to "frame" but just following evidence as they saw it

[sadie]

Before asking if the PJ checked the night creche records you first need to establish that they existed.

Ahhh....

Good to be able to agree with you.


Did they actually exist?

[Brietta]

It will have been puzzling to anyone, tryng to piece together all the evidence gathered. And, as far as I know, all he has insisted on was a belief that there was no abductor. The rest  was hypothesising., ie the how, when and where of the child's demise. Remember, the Portuguese police had not even heard of cadaver dogs, let alone use them, before this case. (source was a PJ spokesman, whose name escapes me-the one who had said they are not suspects and days later said they were)

There is really no excuse for not making oneself familiar with with workplace instruments, particularly if they are to be used as an integral part of one's job.

The Rebelo investigation probably put the correct interpretation on the expert advice given by the handler ...


" Every alert can be subject to interpretation, it has to be confirmed.

The signals of an alert are only just that.

Once the alert has been given by the dog, it is up to the investigator/forensic scientist to locate, identify and scientifically provide the evidence of DNA, etc." MARTIN GRIME: ROGATORY STATEMENT:03-CARTAS ROGATORIA 5 Pages 21 to 25


That certainly was clear enough at the time; unfortunately Mr Amaral just didn't understand it at the time or perhaps it wasn't explained to him as succinctly as it was laid out in the rog.

The Rebelo investigation didn't just run with the advertising blurb ... they wanted to know how the mechanism actually worked ... it seems they were able to accomplish that which led in due course to the release of the Drs McCann from their arguido status and unfortunately the shelving of the investigation into Madeleine's case.

Quote
PJ admits innocence of the McCann couple

They also doubt that the dogs that were used by the British police could have detected cadaver odour.

If the child did, in fact, die in the bedroom, was the short period that she stayed there, enough for odours to be released?

What biological transformations occur during the first hour after death?

These are the questions that they are looking for answers to.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?53176-Portuguese-Press-(Translations)-No-Discussion/page12
Unquote

[G-Unit]

There is really no excuse for not making oneself familiar with with workplace instruments, particularly if they are to be used as an integral part of one's job.

The Rebelo investigation probably put the correct interpretation on the expert advice given by the handler ...


" Every alert can be subject to interpretation, it has to be confirmed.

The signals of an alert are only just that.

Once the alert has been given by the dog, it is up to the investigator/forensic scientist to locate, identify and scientifically provide the evidence of DNA, etc." MARTIN GRIME: ROGATORY STATEMENT:03-CARTAS ROGATORIA 5 Pages 21 to 25


That certainly was clear enough at the time; unfortunately Mr Amaral just didn't understand it at the time or perhaps it wasn't explained to him as succinctly as it was laid out in the rog.

The Rebelo investigation didn't just run with the advertising blurb ... they wanted to know how the mechanism actually worked ... it seems they were able to accomplish that which led in due course to the release of the Drs McCann from their arguido status and unfortunately the shelving of the investigation into Madeleine's case.

Quote
PJ admits innocence of the McCann couple

They also doubt that the dogs that were used by the British police could have detected cadaver odour.

If the child did, in fact, die in the bedroom, was the short period that she stayed there, enough for odours to be released?

What biological transformations occur during the first hour after death?

These are the questions that they are looking for answers to.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?53176-Portuguese-Press-(Translations)-No-Discussion/page12
Unquote

Who translated that? Are you sure it's correct? 

[mercury]

There is really no excuse for not making oneself familiar with with workplace instruments, particularly if they are to be used as an integral part of one's job.

The Rebelo investigation probably put the correct interpretation on the expert advice given by the handler ...


" Every alert can be subject to interpretation, it has to be confirmed.

The signals of an alert are only just that.

Once the alert has been given by the dog, it is up to the investigator/forensic scientist to locate, identify and scientifically provide the evidence of DNA, etc." MARTIN GRIME: ROGATORY STATEMENT:03-CARTAS ROGATORIA 5 Pages 21 to 25


That certainly was clear enough at the time; unfortunately Mr Amaral just didn't understand it at the time or perhaps it wasn't explained to him as succinctly as it was laid out in the rog.

The Rebelo investigation didn't just run with the advertising blurb ... they wanted to know how the mechanism actually worked ... it seems they were able to accomplish that which led in due course to the release of the Drs McCann from their arguido status and unfortunately the shelving of the investigation into Madeleine's case.

Quote
PJ admits innocence of the McCann couple

They also doubt that the dogs that were used by the British police could have detected cadaver odour.

If the child did, in fact, die in the bedroom, was the short period that she stayed there, enough for odours to be released?

What biological transformations occur during the first hour after death?

These are the questions that they are looking for answers to.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?53176-Portuguese-Press-(Translations)-No-Discussion/page12
Unquote

Any seasoned policeman or woman would take the dog alert as significant and not just "open to interpretation".
There would be no use using cadaver dogs if you could interpret their alerts as coming possibly from pizza or people having BO!

[Mr Gray]

Any seasoned policeman or woman would take the dog alert as significant and not just "open to interpretation".
There would be no use using cadaver dogs if you could interpret their alerts as coming possibly from pizza or people having BO!

How do you know what any seasoned policeman would think...the alerts indicate nothing and are evidence of nothing...at least that is what Grime said

[mercury]

How do you know what any seasoned policeman would think...the alerts indicate nothing and are evidence of nothing...at least that is what Grime said

You better write to all police forces worldwide who use cadaver dogs and let them know their alerts mean nothng, might save them some time energy and money

And please don't twist Grime's words to suit