Author Topic: Amaral and the dogs  (Read 841604 times)

0 Members and 3 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Eleanor

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4380 on: August 29, 2015, 10:58:57 AM »
We all have our views on this case, for whatever reason we are on this forum for.

Of course we do.  And so we should, within reason.  Just try to stay On Topic.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4381 on: August 29, 2015, 11:11:11 AM »
In a nutshell, the handler of a dog trained to alert to the scent of dead bodies says that the dog alerted in places in 5a and a dog trained to alert to the scent of blood did not alert in the same place.
no...the dog trained to alert to dead bodies and blood alerted.....the handler was asked whether he could confirm this was to cadaver scent and he does not confirm
The dog that was trained to alert repeatedly did not alert to objects before being brought back several times and eventually alerted...

the handler stated these alerts had no evidential reliablity..it is clear why

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4382 on: August 29, 2015, 11:12:45 AM »


Of what value is your opinion, when you are totally biased in favour of the mccanns ?

and try answering Faithlilly's question, which I have asked you many times before with no response on your behalf.

it is Grime's and Harrison's opinion that the alerts are unreliable

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4383 on: August 29, 2015, 11:15:06 AM »
You never have backed up any of your personal claims.

They remain pure fiction.

you stated I could not back up my claims...you are wrong as I can...you repeatedly make the same mistake and you repeatedly disrupt threads by making personal attacks on me

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4384 on: August 29, 2015, 11:15:32 AM »
it is Grime's and Harrison's opinion that the alerts are unreliable

When did either say a dead body could not have been  detected ?

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4385 on: August 29, 2015, 11:30:08 AM »
When did either say a dead body could not have been  detected ?

we all accept the dogs could have been alerting to remnant cadaver scent

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4386 on: August 29, 2015, 11:33:34 AM »
How many years experience have you as a dog handler ferryman ?

it is not neccesary to have experience of a dog handler to criticise Grime or the alerts....it is quite acceptable these days to question a professional ...it happens all the time and quite often professionals make mistakes.
Ashya King's parents used google to question the doctors during their son's care

Offline Brietta

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4387 on: August 29, 2015, 11:44:23 AM »
Everyone can have an opinion, but ferryman posts as those his are absolute facts.

It also has to be viewed in terms of his personal bias.

From what I have seen of Ferryman's posts everything without exception which is stated as fact is backed up with a cite proving just that.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4388 on: August 29, 2015, 11:48:41 AM »
From what I have seen of Ferryman's posts everything without exception which is stated as fact is backed up with a cite proving just that.

From what you have seen, i.e. those that support your position.

So perhaps you can tell me this, where does Martin Grime state the alerts could not have indicated the presence of a body ?

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4389 on: August 29, 2015, 11:50:43 AM »
From what you have seen, i.e. those that support your position.

So perhaps you can tell me this, where does Martin Grime state the alerts could not have indicated the presence of a body ?

I answered this question at 11.15 today

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4390 on: August 29, 2015, 11:53:14 AM »
I answered this question at 11.15 today

No you didn't.

Offline Brietta

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4391 on: August 29, 2015, 11:55:13 AM »
I answered this question at 11.15 today

The handler clearly knows that the dogs are not an exact science and do not necessarily get it right 100% of the time either in training or in the field.
I think that is evident from reading his statements, and that of Harrison.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

stephen25000

  • Guest
Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4392 on: August 29, 2015, 12:02:33 PM »
The handler clearly knows that the dogs are not an exact science and do not necessarily get it right 100% of the time either in training or in the field.
I think that is evident from reading his statements, and that of Harrison.

What is the % success rate of locating bodies when Martin Grime utilized Eddie and Keela ?

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4393 on: August 29, 2015, 12:07:26 PM »
What is the % success rate of locating bodies when Martin Grime utilized Eddie and Keela ?

you make the mistake at looking at figures such as these and relating them directly to remnant scent
« Last Edit: August 29, 2015, 12:11:45 PM by davel »

Offline Lace

Re: Amaral and the dogs
« Reply #4394 on: August 29, 2015, 12:09:25 PM »
The thing is,  other professionals who have trained cadaver dogs,   some from forensic police training have said that these dogs can give false alerts to decaying vegetation.

Grime says Eddie was an 'enhanced' victim recovery dog,   yet the only training Eddie had to become this 'Enhanced dog'   was through going to America and being trained to alert to the decaying human bodies,   which Grime says smells the same as the decaying pig Eddie was trained on at first,   in fact he goes on to say that it was impossible for the dogs to tell the difference between the two and it was impossible to train the dogs to tell the difference between the two.

Now we are to think that Eddie is a super dog better than any other cadaver dog that has been trained in Britain because he had training in America too,   even though it really means nothing.

People who have forensic knowledge of what these dog will or will not alert to have said that an alert by a cadaver dog when there is no body to be found needs to be taken with caution as the dog may be alerting to the scent of something such as a bloody rag or a sanitary pad that could have been in the place where the dog is alerting.

Eddie alerts to blood,   there is no doubt in my mind that Eddie alerted to blood on the key fob as Keela alerted to it too.

Therefore Eddie could well have been alerting to something that had had blood on it in the bedroom,  and was not there any more but the scent remained,    or from something that could have been walked in from the garden and had settled in the grout of the tiles,   or the scent could have gathered in the bedroom from the garden.

So the alert in the bedroom can only be taken with a pinch of salt in my opinion.