Brexit has well and truly begun!

[John]

Not a chance. The DUP have said they will support her as they don't want Jeremy Corbyn in power and the Conservatives will not vote to oust themselves either.

Corbyn must have thought he was in with a chance.  Anna Soubry just called him,  "the most useless leader of the opposition they have ever had" 

[Venturi Swirl]

Sir Bill Cash MP, speaking in Parliament on the 'Withdrawal Agreement', says the EU is nothing more than an attempt to create a German Superstate.  I happen to agree with Sir Bill, Germany has got too big for its boots again and should have its powers in Europe trimmed.

Hyperbole and scaremongering is not limited to Remainers or people on internet forums then. 

[Venturi Swirl]

Does anyone think Theresa May will lose the confidence vote tonight.

The vote is not in Theresa May but in the government, and no, I don't think the government will lose the vote as most sane MPs realise that a general election now with the prospect of Chairman Corbyn in charge of Brexit is enough to cause an outbeak of mass suicide amongst the electorate. 

[Venturi Swirl]

They seem to have asked those who voted leave if they voted to leave the single market as well as the EU. The one third who said yes probably knew the two things were linked. Did the other two thirds understand this? Even Boris Johnson seemed to think the UK could pick and choose which EU institutions they left or stayed in. If the politicians didn't understand what the vote was about they need to resign imo.

Are you now suggesting that the ever-so bright leave voters and politicians didn't understand what they were voting for?  Surely not!!  You seem to have done a complete volte-face, and haven't even had the decency to thank me for my numerous cites earlier.  No change there then!

[Venturi Swirl]

Boris Johnson backtracking madly following the referendum. He seemed to be trying to soften the blow for some reason.

That's because being a bright lad he knows  deep down what a disaster leaving the EU will be for our country economically

[G-Unit]

Are you now suggesting that the ever-so bright leave voters and politicians didn't understand what they were voting for?  Surely not!!  You seem to have done a complete volte-face, and haven't even had the decency to thank me for my numerous cites earlier.  No change there then!

The voters voted to leave the EU. The single market didn't appear on the ballot paper, so why should they know if they voted to leave that? Obviously they did, because it's one part of the EU. I never said they were experts on the various parts of the EU; I'm certainly not. What I did say is that they are bright enough to recognise spin and scaremongering when it occurs.

Boris Johnson isn't a details man either, but has less justification for his ignorance.

[Venturi Swirl]

The voters voted to leave the EU. The single market didn't appear on the ballot paper, so why should they know if they voted to leave that? Obviously they did, because it's one part of the EU. I never said they were experts on the various parts of the EU; I'm certainly not. What I did say is that they are bright enough to recognise spin and scaremongering when it occurs.

Boris Johnson isn't a details man either, but has less justification for his ignorance.

What you did say was this:

"It's not triggering Article 50 that created the mess, it's the fact that instead of preparing for leaving the EU the government spent the time trying to make a deal. Why? No-one asked them to do that".

Which would suggest to me (unless I'm very much mistaken) that you think the government was wrong to try and broker any sort of trade deal with the EU, but instead revert to WTO terms after two years.  This you seemed to think is what people voted for when they voted leave, and that no one wanted a negotiation with Brussels.  However, in all the spin and scaremongering from the Leave campaign where was it ever spelt out that this is precisely what was being advocated? Many prominent leavers are now claiming that no deal is what they always wanted all along, having conveniently forgotten what they'd previously advocated in the run up to and immediate aftermath of the referendum.. That was the point being made by the Daniel Finkelstein article which I posted and which you called into question, demanding cites and names.  Now that I have provided those you seem to be deflecting somewhat rather than acknowledging that both he and I have a valid point.  I expected nothing more tbh. 

[Carana]

Point being that the UK will trade with the EU on our terms. We will continue to buy French and German cars, French and Italian wine and Belgium chocolate on our terms. If we don't like them there are alternatives.

"Our terms"?? What do you mean by that?

The UK will not be able to pick and choose which products it wants from which EU countries, for the simple reason that the EU is a trading bloc. There's either a global deal with the entire EU (which generally takes around 10 years, although perhaps a little less in the case of a former member if it remains closely aligned) or it's WTO terms.

If, as an independent WTO member, the UK offers concessions to the EU on specific goods, it will have to offer the same terms to every other WTO member.

That doesn't even touch on issues surrounnding the service industry (80% of the UK economy) nor the mess facing UK exporters to the EU (or elsewhere).

[Sunny]

Corbyn must have thought he was in with a chance.  Anna Soubry just called him,  "the most useless leader of the opposition they have ever had" 

With all the mess that the Tory's are in you would have expected a competent Labour leader to make inroads into the polls.  He does not appear to be a competent Labour leader IMO.

[Venturi Swirl]

With all the mess that the Tory's are in you would have expected a competent Labour leader to make inroads into the polls.  He does not appear to be a competent Labour leader IMO.

You can say that again. 

[Angelo222]

With all the mess that the Tory's are in you would have expected a competent Labour leader to make inroads into the polls.  He does not appear to be a competent Labour leader IMO.

Corbyn has spent the last two years doing all he can to get a Labour government. He isn't interested in doing any deals with the EU or offering any support to the government.  He is pursuing a scorched earth policy but it won't work, Theresa's government will win the no confidence motion tonight and carry on regardless making Corbyn look weak and a non entity.

[Sunny]

Corbyn has spent the last two years doing all he can to get a Labour government. He isn't interested in doing any deals with the EU or offering any support to the government.  He is pursuing a scorched earth policy but it won't work, Theresa's government will win the no confidence motion tonight and carry on regardless making Corbyn look weak and incompetent.

All he wants is power - at whatever cost to the country. He is so clear on this IMO. I have read too that he is actually a Brexit supporter but Jeremy comes first - the country somewhere down at the bottom, at least that is how it would appear to me.

[Carana]

With all the mess that the Tory's are in you would have expected a competent Labour leader to make inroads into the polls.  He does not appear to be a competent Labour leader IMO.

I'm afraid I can't cope with Corbyn any more than Farage.

He could have clearly supported Remain or even a 2nd referendum or a revocation of Art. 50, but even now is shuffling around. From what I've read, a reason could be because he has grand plans of nationalising whatever he can (true or not) and the EU has conditions surrounding that.

[Venturi Swirl]

Corbyn has spent the last two years doing all he can to get a Labour government. He isn't interested in doing any deals with the EU or offering any support to the government.  He is pursuing a scorched earth policy but it won't work, Theresa's government will win the no confidence motion tonight and carry on regardless making Corbyn look weak and a non entity.

He will be forced into a corner to push for a Second Referendum, which he doesn't want to do.  Poor love.

[Angelo222]

He will be forced into a corner to push for a Second Referendum, which he doesn't want to do.  Poor love.

A second referendum won't change anything because parliament will still want their say in the end and we all know how it is split right up the middle.