A look at the Bain family murders which occurred in Dunedin NZ in 1994.

[Holly Goodhead]

Here we go again.    &%&£(+

So Stephen had fibres from the green jersey underneath his fingernails?

Even if Samson's ramblings hadn't automatically alerted me to DB's guilt, I would have got there eventually. It's obvious.

Myster, best-beloved, what is the relevance of the hot water bottle?

As per usual these things are never straightforward.  Scrapings taken from RB's fingernails were never analysed and subsequently destroyed.

You can read about police bungling from page 150 onwards:

http://media.nzherald.co.nz/webcontent/document/pdf/201250/01Justice%20Binnies%20report.pdf

[Holly Goodhead]

I find the following from a psychologist and acquaintance of RB's pretty damning:

http://stuff.libsyn.com/mrs-bain-the-diary-and-the-devil

As I've previously stated the psychologist met with each family member with a view to making recommendations.  When she assessed RB she found a shell devoid of emotion.  When she heard of the shootings her first reaction was to think RB snapped from years of MB's callousness.  Thought MB was supposed to be a Christian  &%+((£

The above took place when the family was still in PNG and at a time when MB was "desperate" to resume her sex life with RB.  Well since there's no evidence she did it sounds to me RB looked to Laniet.  It all makes for uncomfortable reading: a strong Presbyterian, scout/youth worker, school teacher, husband, family man sexually abusing his young daughter but there we have it. 
 

[Holly Goodhead]

I find the following from a psychologist and acquaintance of RB's pretty damning:

http://stuff.libsyn.com/mrs-bain-the-diary-and-the-devil

As I've previously stated the psychologist met with each family member with a view to making recommendations.  When she assessed RB she found a shell devoid of emotion.  When she heard of the shootings her first reaction was to think RB snapped from years of MB's callousness.  Thought MB was supposed to be a Christian  &%+((£

The above took place when the family was still in PNG and at a time when MB was "desperate" to resume her sex life with RB.  Well since there's no evidence she did it sounds to me RB looked to Laniet.  It all makes for uncomfortable reading: a strong Presbyterian, scout/youth worker, school teacher, husband, family man sexually abusing his young daughter but there we have it.

Just Googled 'incest and profile of father abusing':

http://www.survivorshandbook.com/the-incestuous-family/

When and if incest in this family comes to light, it is greeted with disbelief and incredulity and treated as no more than a temporary aberration on the part of the father/family. Abusers have the resources to hire a competent (and often aggressive) legal team which attacks the child's credibility while emphasizing the father's community and professional status. These men are rarely found guilty and in almost all cases are free to return home—most often to abuse again.

Straight out the Bain case.  Laniet is written off as a "fantasist";  DB an inheritance killer, and RB is considered too upstanding: strong Presbyterian, scout/youth worker, school teacher.

 

[Samson]

Here is a good analysis albeit from a DB friendly website.

http://www.davidbaindonate.nz/police-errors/

As Binnie points out, you have 5 dead bodies and choice of motive, an argument about a chainsaw, David Bain, or an allegation of incest, Robin.
I truly believe a close analysis of this case is helpful to Jeremy Bamber.
5 dead bodies don't happen lightly, we must search for a motive.

Let me summarise again.
Jeremy and David had "plans" but in each case successful execution was vanishingly unlikely, each time a reliance on contact wounds and legitimate suicide trajectory, after leaving carnage all around, was mandated.
Yet on the other hand we were dealing with children being snatched, Sheila, exposure of a scandalous sexual dalliance, Robin.

Oh come on everyone, get real.
Good work as always Holly. It is easy when we start with the bodies and work outwards.

[Holly Goodhead]

Here is a good analysis albeit from a DB friendly website.

http://www.davidbaindonate.nz/police-errors/

As Binnie points out, you have 5 dead bodies and choice of motive, an argument about a chainsaw, David Bain, or an allegation of incest, Robin.
I truly believe a close analysis of this case is helpful to Jeremy Bamber.
5 dead bodies don't happen lightly, we must search for a motive.

Let me summarise again.
Jeremy and David had "plans" but in each case successful execution was vanishingly unlikely, each time a reliance on contact wounds and legitimate suicide trajectory, after leaving carnage all around, was mandated.
Yet on the other hand we were dealing with children being snatched, Sheila, exposure of a scandalous sexual dalliance, Robin.

Oh come on everyone, get real.
Good work as always Holly. It is easy when we start with the bodies and work outwards.

I wonder about the backgrounds of RB and MB.  Did one or both suffer some sort of abuse?  These things tend to be intergenerational. 

[Myster]

The fact remains, Robin had a stated and rationally explained motive. Dean Cottle turns out to b be an outstanding witness when allowed to talk, he was of sufficient means to provide Laniet with a cell phone back in those days. Robin was extremely familiar with the rifle, and the muzzle of the silencer was factually deemed to have been in contact with his left temple for the one shot inflicted. And this one shot was a perfect trajectory for a left hand reach for the trigger in a standing position. You can't get this into a "plan", as there is zero room for error in a fraught situation. And it was a rising shot when Robin was alleged to be kneeling.
All this does not prove that Jeremy Bamber was similarly cheated, but it does speak to the nonsense that the optimism of youth might be replaced by a risk all strategy.

Dean Cottle was a pimp, living off the immoral earnings of his harem of hookers, so not surprising he was able to afford numerous cell phones when the average joe couldn't.  And not exactly trustworthy, as he demanded $10,000 before he would testify, and when subpoened he absconded until a warrant for his arrest brought him scuttling to the courtroom, several days too late.

There were different interpretations and configurations of how the rifle could have been held and by whom, so not  conclusive. No need to keep repeating that there was only one way.

[Holly Goodhead]

Dean Cottle was a pimp, living off the immoral earnings of his harem of hookers, so not surprising he was able to afford numerous cell phones when the average joe couldn't.  And not exactly trustworthy, as he demanded $10,000 before he would testify, and when subpoened he absconded until a warrant for his arrest brought him scuttling to the courtroom, several days too late.

There were different interpretations and configurations of how the rifle could have been held and by whom, so not  conclusive. No need to keep repeating that there was only one way.

There were others too:

www.stuff.co.nz/the-press/news/2409317/My-father-raped-me-Laniet-told-friend

[Holly Goodhead]

I've also listened to an audio tape where a medical doctor examined Laniet and diagnosed a STD.  I think the doc also relayed the incest as told by Laniet.  I will try and find it.

This sort of thing isn't just restricted to The Fens/Broads you know!

[Holly Goodhead]

I don't know much about the other so-called inheritance killers eg Stephen Seddon but it strikes me that these cases are different from DB and JB in that the likes of SS were either diagnosed with a mental illness/personality disorder OR there was an absence of any mental illness/personality disorder/dysfunction amongst other family members.

Neither DB or JB have been formally diagnosed with any mental illness or personality disorder but the Bamber and Bain families were both extremely dysfunctional with other family members having serious issues. 

[Samson]

That Martin Van Beynen incest reporting has far too many witnesses to all be making it up or for Laniet to be repeating such egregious accusations with no basis. Robin paid her account at the convenience store for the first (and last) the day before she was murdered.
Why?
Motive to burn for Robin Bain.

I live in New Zealand, it seems a normally functioning place till you get these cases and common sense is out the window. 
There is something tragic about the time Van Beynen has wasted in farming for the wrong answer. He has a whole room of papers and files. What a moron.

[Holly Goodhead]

That Martin Van Beynen incest reporting has far too many witnesses to all be making it up or for Laniet to be repeating such egregious accusations with no basis. Robin paid her account at the convenience store for the first (and last) the day before she was murdered.
Why?
Motive to burn for Robin Bain.

I live in New Zealand, it seems a normally functioning place till you get these cases and common sense is out the window. 
There is something tragic about the time Van Beynen has wasted in farming for the wrong answer. He has a whole room of papers and files. What a moron.

As Justice Binnie said he could find the smoke but not the fire    But how deep did investigating officers dig?  Samson it seems to me this family went off the rails in PNG as per the psychologist acquainted with RB and the accounts of many others.  I know sfa about the country but the UK gov has this to say about it:

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/papua-new-guinea

PNG seems the sort of place a dysfunctional family like the Bains could fall off the radar.  Is it possible Laniet carried RB's child to term as per her claims, or had an abortion/miscarriage in PNG?  Did investigating officers visit PNG? 

Also Laniet's friend in the article above claims she observed stretch marks on LB's body.  Did the pathologist note such?  Dr Vanezis noted stretch marks on SC's body.

I also find it interesting that the psychologist mentioned above said MB was "desperate" to restart her sex life with RB.  This was whilst they were in PNG.  By the time they returned to Dunedin some years later the relationship seemed to have deteriorated further with RB banished to his filthy hovel of a caravan in the garden.  So possibly a sexually frustrated RB looked to his youngest daughter to satisfy his needs.  I've no doubt he was a strong Presbyterian and committed scout/youth leader/school teacher and devoted family man but unfortunately these things don't preclude incest/child sex abuse.   

You know this country has a long history of child sex abuse involving establishment figures as NZ's Justice Goddard was at one time overseeing the inquiry.  How did Jimmy Savile get away with abusing hundreds of children in hospitals, care homes and on BBC premises?  His reputation as a charity fund raiser went before him    Potentially the same thing with RB imo.  Not nice to speak ill of the dead when they're not here to defend themselves but can there really be so much smoke without fire?   &%+((£

I find MVB's writing on the Bain case quite balanced.  I see he studied law at Uni Auckland.

[Holly Goodhead]

I've also listened to an audio tape where a medical doctor examined Laniet and diagnosed a STD.  I think the doc also relayed the incest as told by Laniet.  I will try and find it.

This sort of thing isn't just restricted to The Fens/Broads you know!

I thought I listened to an audio recording re the above.  If I did I can't find it now but here it is in writing:

https://www.odt.co.nz/news/dunedin/laniet-found-it-not-easy-abstain-sex-four-days

[Samson]

As Justice Binnie said he could find the smoke but not the fire    But how deep did investigating officers dig?  Samson it seems to me this family went off the rails in PNG as per the psychologist acquainted with RB and the accounts of many others.  I know sfa about the country but the UK gov has this to say about it:

https://www.gov.uk/foreign-travel-advice/papua-new-guinea

PNG seems the sort of place a dysfunctional family like the Bains could fall off the radar.  Is it possible Laniet carried RB's child to term as per her claims, or had an abortion/miscarriage in PNG?  Did investigating officers visit PNG? 

Also Laniet's friend in the article above claims she observed stretch marks on LB's body.  Did the pathologist note such?  Dr Vanezis noted stretch marks on SC's body.

I also find it interesting that the psychologist mentioned above said MB was "desperate" to restart her sex life with RB.  This was whilst they were in PNG.  By the time they returned to Dunedin some years later the relationship seemed to have deteriorated further with RB banished to his filthy hovel of a caravan in the garden.  So possibly a sexually frustrated RB looked to his youngest daughter to satisfy his needs.  I've no doubt he was a strong Presbyterian and committed scout/youth leader/school teacher and devoted family man but unfortunately these things don't preclude incest/child sex abuse.   

You know this country has a long history of child sex abuse involving establishment figures as NZ's Justice Goddard was at one time overseeing the inquiry.  How did Jimmy Savile get away with abusing hundreds of children in hospitals, care homes and on BBC premises?  His reputation as a charity fund raiser went before him    Potentially the same thing with RB imo.  Not nice to speak ill of the dead when they're not here to defend themselves but can there really be so much smoke without fire?   &%+((£

I find MVB's writing on the Bain case quite balanced.  I see he studied law at Uni Auckland.

I'm sorry Holly, MVB is a blithering idiot. Beyond redemption, a defamatory time waster who hoodwinked a minister of justice, pig with lipstick Judith Collins, and a country of the blind.

[Holly Goodhead]

I'm sorry Holly, MVB is a blithering idiot. Beyond redemption, a defamatory time waster who hoodwinked a minister of justice, pig with lipstick Judith Collins, and a country of the blind.

Well DB's conviction has now been quashed and he received almost 1 million NZ dollars from the NZ gov. as an 'ex-gratia' payment.  DB has since married, had a son and recently moved to Australia so I guess its case over?

Unacceptable that so many cocks up were made during the initial investigation.   

If we looked into the backgrounds/childhoods of MB and RB I wonder what we might find.  The couple were grossly dysfunctional and imo the children should have been removed from their care.  At the time of the murders the parents had been estranged for years and both lived in squalor.  It appears both suffered from depression and mental health issues.  MB's bizarre ideas had an adverse effect on everyone.  The home schooling deprived the children of a proper education so much so by the time they returned to a mainstream school they struggled to catch up and fit in socially.  LB ended up working in the sex industry and more than likely suffered child sex abuse at the hands of her father.  SB ended up in trouble with the law.  RB murdered the family and took his own life and DB spent years in prison as a MoJ.     

[Myster]

Where on earth does it say Stephen Bain got in trouble with the law?!!!.  I notice you mention nothing about former Head girl and beauty queen, Arawa, getting on well with her teacher training and almost certainly the one in the Bain household "who most definitely deserved to stay" in preference to her dropout older brother who didn't even get on with his father!   What a hoax that computer message was!

Would Arawa have thrived and achieved what she did, had she been whisked away from her family?