So what actual searching was there?

[stephen25000]

Quote from the crisis manager to has 20 years experience in dealing with people -


Did you suspect them? "My God, no, absolutely not in any way at any stage. I walked into that apartment and just saw two people who were frantic that their daughter had gone missing. Nobody could possibly, if they had anything to do with that, behave in that way for so long.

What crisis manager ?

For whatever reasons she 'disappeared', there would be panic.

[stephen25000]

Then they waited for the police and went to the station,   what don't you understand?

It is what other parents of missing children have done also.

It is you who wants to make the McCann's look different in some way for some weird reason unknown only to you.

and after the police station, what searching did they do  ?

[Benice]

Does screaming, crying, hitting headboards, and collapsing demonstrate concern for others? At the scene of an accident do doctors, firemen and policemen show concern for the injured in that manner? If one's child has an accident in the home does one collapse screaming and crying or does one show concern by controlling oneself and being practical? There's more than one way to interpret their reactions, I'm afraid.

The OC manager heard no scream.
The waiter said it was Gerry. That's the only reference to him searching that I can recall.
When did Kate wander dark streets?
When did Kate send her husband to search the beach?

Please don't quote from Kate's book, that was written with hindsight well after the event.

Do people who lose their chldren in supermarkets, on beaches etc. etc.   remain cool calm and collected and calmly start organising a search  - or are they struck with panic within seconds? 

What the reaction of people attending accidents etc where the victim is not their own child has got to do with anything is beyond me.  It has no relevance.

When my son broke his arm as a small boy - my reaction on seeing his misshapen arm  - was to faint on the spot.  No doubt that makes me a bad parent in your eyes - as I should have controlled myself for his sake.

IMO people who insist that they know how they would react in the same circumstance as the McCanns are kidding themselves.   They only THINK they know.

I see you have no explanation as to why those other parents of missing children, who have been in the same nightmare situation as the McCanns, have no criticism of them at all and fully support and believe them.

Why do you think they are wrong and you are right?     Of all people surely they are the ones who could spot a fake in no time.   To disregard their support and understanding out of hand is unrealistic IMO - and also quite insulting to them.   

[Alfred R Jones]

Note to Benice and Lace - you cannot reason with people with such entrenched, un-empathetic and downright illogical views as are displayed here, you may as give up. 

I'm just curious what this perceived lack of searching says to these people - that the McCanns just didn't like Madeleine that much and so couldn't be bothered to look for her, or that they knew there was no point looking for her but they also couldn't be arsed to put on a convincing act of looking for her either - which one is it?

[Brietta]

Only in your opinion.    Kate has returned to Portugal numerous times since 2007.  Unless she sent you her itinery you cannot possibly know whether she spent that time searching or not.

I notice that while you can ridicule the amount of searching that Kate and Gerry did actually carry out, you have no criticism whatsoever of those other parents who did not join in the searching for their missing children - in fact not even enough to be recorded on a pinhead let alone a postage stamp.  Such contrary 'logic' is inexplicable to me.   

There is little doubt that the GNR did what they could as far as searching goes ... but it quickly became apparent to them that the case was outwith their remit and would require the attention of a force within the heirararchy which had more expertise in detection skills ~ namely the Policia Judicairia.

We are told the co-ordinator took the call while at dinner.

We now know that he was also constituted arguido in the torture case brought against him in the only other case he had investigated of a missing child who also was never found.
This happened on the 4th of May ... the day after Madeleine's disappearance when searching for her was at its height.

We have seen pictures of Rebelo inspecting the scene of the crime when he took over the case and being very 'hands on' with every aspect.

When did Mr Amaral turn up in Luz to direct and co-ordinate the search? 

I think his diary may have been rather full on the 4th.  (I know the wonders of modern technology has given us telephone communications ... but not quite the same as being there in person taking control of the situation).

[Brietta]

Why don't you read the statements from the people who were there on the 3rd of May Stephen?    Who actually witnessed how the McCann's reacted, instead of making up what you think happened.

The friends were Drs.  they are experts in witnessing people who have been traumatised,  they stated the McCann's were utterly inconsolable.   

I find the remarks from you and others to be quite sickening,   these are parents whose daughter disappeared,  can you imagine what they must have gone through? 

Parents who have just lost their child for minutes in a shop,  on the beach can only slightly imagine what they went through,   you on the other hand have no empathy at all.

We had not seen the McCanns since Thursday, when suddenly they appeared by the pool. The surreal limbo of the past two days suddenly snapped back into painful, awful realtime.

It was a shock: the physical transformation of these two human beings was sickening - I felt it as a physical blow. Kate's back and shoulders, her hands, her mouth had reshaped themselves in to the angular manifestation of a silent scream.

I thought I might cry and turned so that she wouldn't see.

Gerry was upright, his lips now drawn into a thin, impenetrable line.

Some people, including Jes, tried to offer comfort. Some gave them hugs. Some stared at their feet, words eluding them. We all wondered what to do. That was the last time we saw Gerry and Kate.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann


It soon became apparent that if these parents wished their daughter to be found they would have to do the searching for her themselves.

Which is exactly what they had to do until six years into Madeleine's disappearance when the cold case into her disappearance was reactivated and became a very live one.

I doubt if there is another couple in the world who could have accomplished what they have in the search for their daughter.

Totally risible to suggest otherwise.

[Alfred R Jones]

We had not seen the McCanns since Thursday, when suddenly they appeared by the pool. The surreal limbo of the past two days suddenly snapped back into painful, awful realtime.

It was a shock: the physical transformation of these two human beings was sickening - I felt it as a physical blow. Kate's back and shoulders, her hands, her mouth had reshaped themselves in to the angular manifestation of a silent scream.

I thought I might cry and turned so that she wouldn't see.

Gerry was upright, his lips now drawn into a thin, impenetrable line.

Some people, including Jes, tried to offer comfort. Some gave them hugs. Some stared at their feet, words eluding them. We all wondered what to do. That was the last time we saw Gerry and Kate.
http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2007/dec/14/ukcrime.madeleinemccann


It soon became apparent that if these parents wished their daughter to be found they would have to do the searching for her themselves.

Which is exactly what they had to do until six years into Madeleine's disappearance when the cold case into her disappearance was reactivated and became a very live one.

I doubt if there is another couple in the world who could have accomplished what they have in the search for their daughter.

Totally risible to suggest otherwise.

But surely internet commentators who weren't actually there and who have never met the  McCanns are in a far better position to judge their behaviour and what there were capable o,f than some woman who was actually there and witnessed it all first hand .... &%+((£

[Benice]

There is little doubt that the GNR did what they could as far as searching goes ... but it quickly became apparent to them that the case was outwith their remit and would require the attention of a force within the heirararchy which had more expertise in detection skills ~ namely the Policia Judicairia.

We are told the co-ordinator took the call while at dinner.

We now know that he was also constituted arguido in the torture case brought against him in the only other case of a missing child who was never found.
This happened on the 4th of May ... the day after Madeleine's disappearance when searching for her was at its height.

We have seen pictures of Rebelo inspecting the scene of the crime when he took over the case and being very 'hands on' with every aspect.

When did Mr Amaral turn up in Luz to direct and co-ordinate the search? 

I think his diary may have been rather full on the 4th.  (I know the wonders of modern technology has given us telephone communications ... but not quite the same as being there in person taking control of the situation).

I agree Brietta.   The first few days were the most important in this case and I find it impossible to believe that having been made an Arguido in a case involving torture that Amaral was giving his full concentration to the McCann case during that extremely vital time.    IMO he would have been thinking more about his own plight - and the threat to his own future than anything else - especially as a prison sentence was not out of the question.       

In his book Amaral makes no reference at all  to how long he spent away from the case being interviewed and made an arguido on the 4th May  - in fact it's as if it never happened.

[G-Unit]

What are you talking about the OC club manager heard no scream?   Have you read the Summers and Swan book?    They interviewed the OC manager and he described the scream and that it was Kate.

The waiter did say it was Gerry searching,   the friends say he was searching too,  or are they all in on a secret pact to hide what happened in 5a?

Kate did say in her book that she asked Gerry and friend to search the beach,  which would be confirmed by the friend no doubt.

Of course I haven't read the Summers and Swan book. If John Hill heard a scream then Kate must have screamed more than once. The only scream in the PJ files was when Kate was on the balcony and was heard by the waiter Jeronimo Salcedas.

The only friend I can find who was out with Gerald was David Payne at around 4am. All descriptions of searching feature only David, Matt and Russell with Dianne and Fiona doing a quick look each. As i said, Kate's book was written with hindsight.

[Lace]

What crisis manager ?

For whatever reasons she 'disappeared', there would be panic.

This crisis manager -

Mr Woolfall has provided the first detailed account by an insider of what happened to the McCanns during the desperate days after Madeleine disappeared. He is an expert in crisis PR at the communications group Bell Pottinger and flew to Portugal as part of the Mark Warner holiday company’s emergency response team on Saturday, May 5. Madeleine vanished on the evening of May 3. - See more at: http://madeleinemccann.org/blog/2014/04/20/alex-woolfalljohn-hill/#sthash.9epBwNML.dpuf

[Lace]

What crisis manager ?

For whatever reasons she 'disappeared', there would be panic.

There is also the statement of this crisis councellor -

Witness Statement of Alan Robert PIKE
 Occupation: Crisis Counsellor  2008.05.07
 This testimony (constituted by two pages and signed by me) is the truth and in accordance with my understanding. I give this testimony with the knowledge that, knowingly making false statements may subject me to legal action.


 Date: 07 of May 2008
 Signature: __________________________________________

 I am the above reference person and live at the physical address already provided the police. I work as a crisis counsellor. DC Holliday and DC Ferguson of the Leicestershire police questioned me on behalf of the Portuguese police relative
 To my involvement with Gerald and Kate McCann whose daughter disappeared from Praia da Luz in Portugal in May of 2007.

 I have been a crisis counsellor for about 3 and a half years, and work for a private agency titled 'The Centre for Crisis Psychology' (or CCP). Before this job, I worked as a social worker for about 11 years. CCP has agreements with other agencies who can request our services, like for example, the placement to a holiday to offer assistance to someone who has suffered a traumatic event. There are many different aspects in my profession, but this one seems to me the most relevant to my testimony.

 I would say that my experience with CCP was required in order to help people abroad who find themselves confronted with tragic situations, for a total of between 30 and 60 times. I got to know Gerald McCann and Kate Healy on Saturday, May 5, 2007. I would describe my relationship with them in totally clinical terms. I provided them counselling help with regards to their emotional state provoked by the fact that they were separated from their daughter Madeleine. I spoke with Gerry and Kate very early in the morning on the 5th of May, 2007. Our services were requested by the Mark Warner agency. I travelled specifically to speak to them in person, and with the family and agency functionaries. Kate and Gerry had been awake for two nights when I got to know them.

 I do not remember specifically what they said about Madeleine's disappearance and I did not ask them about the circumstances in which the disappearance occurred. My purpose at the time was their emotional state. My role was not to question them regarding the disappearance or to investigate. Upon reflection however, they always referred to their daughter's disappearance as an 'abduction.'

 I would say that Kate e o Gerry were exhausted, anguished, confused, and angry for a few reasons, but namely with the lack of information. They were insecure as to how to help and with the lack of help and assistance. Their comportment did not surprise me. It was a comportment which I have witnessed a lot at times when a trauma is suffered. In my opinion, their reaction relative to the disappearance of Madeleine, as already stated above, was completely within the bounds of what one would expect of parents whose daughter was taken from them against their will.

 I was not there to judge the reaction of Kate or Gerry, but I would say that their behaviour was consistent, according to my knowledge of that which they were experiencing. I helped them deal with the situation and offered them face to face counselling on many occasions, since the day I met with them in Portugal and in Leicester. They and the rest of the family have access to a 24-hour telephone help line. At CCP we use a psychological method in each of clinical interventions that allows the patient to relive their traumatic experience, discuss his or her physical and emotional reactions and after provide counselling and support that helps them deal with these emotions in the short and long-term.

 Since the return of Kate and Gerry to the U.K., I have worked for them privately but my relationship here has been exclusively clinical in nature.

 This testimony was made by me and is the truth according to my understanding.
   

[Alfred R Jones]

Of course I haven't read the Summers and Swan book. If John Hill heard a scream then Kate must have screamed more than once. The only scream in the PJ files was when Kate was on the balcony and was heard by the waiter Jeronimo Salcedas.

The only friend I can find who was out with Gerald was David Payne at around 4am. All descriptions of searching feature only David, Matt and Russell with Dianne and Fiona doing a quick look each. As i said, Kate's book was written with hindsight.

Didn't a policeman see Kate and Gerry out searching at 6am that morning?

[Lace]

and after the police station, what searching did they do  ?

It was in the hands of the police,  which it should have been.

[Brietta]

I agree Brietta.   The first few days were the most important in this case and I find it impossible to believe that having been made an Arguido in a case involving torture that Amaral was giving his full concentration to the McCann case during that extremely vital time.    IMO he would have been thinking more about his own plight - and the threat to his own future than anything else - especially as a prison sentence was not out of the question.       

In his book Amaral makes no reference at all  to how long he spent away from the case being interviewed and made an arguido on the 4th May  - in fact it's as if it never happened.

Any reader of his book could be forgiven for assuming that he had spoken with Madeleine's parents when in fact he had not.

He certainly has a gift as a word-smith who can infer a situation without actually saying the words.

Did he criticise the Drs McCann for not searching? or is this entirely an internet aberration? 

I rather thought his criticism was that they had done too much searching by doing what the police ought to have done and getting her image out there.

Perhaps he might have seen it differently had he been at the scene to take control.

[Brietta]

Didn't a policeman see Kate and Gerry out searching at 6am that morning?

Yes.

However when one is cherry picking one's information certain known facts must be left out ... that includes anything which does not support the particular prejudice one might be promulgating at that particular moment in time.