If Madeleine walked out of the apartment which door did she exit?

[Robittybob1]

In the Tapas 7 statements there are 3 instances of the phrase "just shut".

1.   David Payne rogatory "Err and then you know the other area, the other areas I remember going into Kate and Gerry's err bedroom with Gerry and he'd perhaps you know fling a cupboard open and just have a look and, ah you know and just shut the door and you know in a vein, desperate hope that she might have been err you know in, in the wardrobe or something, and then he, you know flung him, flung himself on the floor and just you know kicking the floor and just with, you know, she's gone, she's gone, err and then as I say, I, I, after that I can't really say exactly, you know. " 
Here he is talking about a wardrobe door.

2 and 3.  Next two from J Tanner rogatory "Reply    “Erm well you couldn’t, I doubt I dead locked it cos the door’s, if you just shut the doors they locked anyway, erm so nobody could have got, if, if it was the door, if it was the road side door, if you shut it, it locked but you could further dead lock it, erm so no I doubt it, I think I would have just shut it, I don’t think I would have dead locked it”."

I think here she is describing the minimalist thing you can do to the front door "just shut it" but she does not say what action makes that happen.  It is not "just push it shut".  The way she links that with the possibility of dead locking the door I suspect the use of the key.

 

[Robittybob1]

Just found the sentence I needed to prove my point in this thread.  From Matt Oldfield's rogatory statement:

"4078 "Which then you locked behind you.'

Reply "Yeah.'

 

4078 "After you went.'

Reply "You had to lock it because it would open on the, it wouldn't shut through like a Yale lock it would close just on a, on a handle that opened it.'


It is typical of Matt to have these half finished sentences.

 "You had to lock it because it would open on the [inside], it wouldn't shut through like a Yale lock [by slamming it] it would close just on a [turn of a key], [or] on a handle that opened it.'

Matt is saying unless it was deadlocked it could be opened from the inside by using the handle.  To close it from the outside you had to use the key. 

That to me means had Madeleine  left the apartment via the front door the door would be open as she didn't have a key to close it.
The dogs revealed Madeleine likely to have wandered from the front door, the door wasn't found open, so that can only mean someone else closed it from the inside behind her and exited via the patio door.

[pathfinder73]

According to Kate, Madeleine left the front door key way on 3 May and returned using the same route at 5:40pm on 3 May 2007 so it was not unusual for the dogs to follow the same route.

"After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking."

"They arrived at the apartment around 5:40PM, earlier than usual, because Madeleine was tired, their other friends were at the beach and Gerry had an all-male tennis game at 6:00PM. At the flat they both bathed the children, and close to 6:00PM Gerry went to the tennis courts, soon after the children had finished their bath. They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/KATE-MCCANN_ARGUIDO.htm

[Robittybob1]

According to Kate, Madeleine left the front door key way on 3 May and returned using the same route at 5:40pm on 3 May 2007 so it was not unusual for the dogs to follow the same route.

"After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking."

"They arrived at the apartment around 5:40PM, earlier than usual, because Madeleine was tired, their other friends were at the beach and Gerry had an all-male tennis game at 6:00PM. At the flat they both bathed the children, and close to 6:00PM Gerry went to the tennis courts, soon after the children had finished their bath. They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/KATE-MCCANN_ARGUIDO.htm

I think that is ambiguous.  It could just mean that Gerry accessed the apartment via the front door and let the others in via the patio door. 

[pathfinder73]

"They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key."

"After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking. The veranda door was closed and locked." KM

[Robittybob1]

"They entered the apartment by the main door, with the key."

"After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking. The veranda door was closed and locked." KM

Same sort of issue here.  What is being said could still be contradictory.

In the sentences quoted the temporal order is all over the place.  ""After breakfast they got dressed and left the apartment by the main door. All children went walking. The veranda door was closed and locked." KM

If they did what you suggest the order of events would have to be:
0.  After breakfast they got dressed
1.  The verandah door was closed and locked.
2.   They all left the apartment by the main door.
3.   All children went walking.

i.e Have breakfast , get dressed, lock the patio door, leave by the front door, let the children walk.

But it isn't said in that order.  You can't do the things in the order as said by Kate. 

[pathfinder73]

When the children went down to the end garden which side did they leave the apartment?

[Robittybob1]

When the children went down to the end garden which side did they leave the apartment?

I'm not yet familiar with the place called "end garden".  Where does that phrase get used?

Gerry uses this passage:
"----- That, between Monday and Wednesday, not knowing the precise date, when they left the residence by the main door, to place the children in the respective creches, MADELEINE left[went] running to the left to the extreme opposite of the residential blocks where they were lodged, playing with the twins. That they had gone down to the furthest point away from those blocks, not knowing exactly how, the three children got into the gardens at the rear [of the blocks]. Then they followed the inside corridor [pathway] at the rear, next to the hedges[fences] up to the street that led to the secondary reception.

Kate's 6th Sept statement:
"They remained at this area an hour, maybe more, then they left the twins at the creche next to the Tapas and both of them took Madeleine to the other creche. They went via a path in front of the small reception and then through gardens and stairs, taking a short cut. This route was the one mentioned by Gerry."

They are the only two occasions that the McCanns talk about garden or gardens.

[pathfinder73]

Are you ok?

"when they left the residence by the main door" - from what you posted.

[Robittybob1]

Are you ok?

"when they left the residence by the main door" - from what you posted.

Which garden was the end garden? 

[pathfinder73]

The McCanns had one end garden so go to the opposite end garden.

[Robittybob1]

The McCanns had one end garden so go to the opposite end garden.

From what Gerry was saying I couldn't make out if it was the lest garden in Block 4 or Block 5.  For the "end" is the end not just half way down that lane.

[ShiningInLuz]

From what Gerry was saying I couldn't make out if it was the lest garden in Block 4 or Block 5.  For the "end" is the end not just half way down that lane.

To get from block 5 to block 4 you have to go up 6 or perhaps 8 steep steps.  That's a no-no for the twins.

West end of block 5.

[Robittybob1]

To get from block 5 to block 4 you have to go up 6 or perhaps 8 steep steps.  That's a no-no for the twins.

West end of block 5.

Are you saying block 4 is "6 or perhaps 8 steep steps" higher than block 5?  I hadn't noticed that in any photo yet.

You'd think a height difference like that would be noticeable.

[Robittybob1]

To get from block 5 to block 4 you have to go up 6 or perhaps 8 steep steps.  That's a no-no for the twins.

West end of block 5.

  Are those steps on both sides of the building?  The path side as well as the car park side?