Gerry and Kate's reaction to sniffer dogs didnt make sense new ninemsn article

[Mr Gray]

I call it taking the piss when he was laughing when he said it.

why do you think he said ...ask the dogs

[Robittybob1]

why do you think he said ...ask the dogs

I think Gerry had already spoken to the dogs himself earlier and knew the answers. That is as long as the dogs don't lie and are consistent in what they say.  One bark for "yes" two barks for "no".  Only trouble is asking Eddie, he never barks for anything other than a cadaver alert.
With Eddie you have to look at his tail.

[stephen25000]

Like you and Kate I watched the Levy copyrighted videos and immediately formed an opinion.

Of course you did.


What expertise do you have in dog handling , and where else have you witnessed forensic dog handling on site ?

[Mr Gray]

Of course you did.


What expertise do you have in dog handling , and where else have you witnessed forensic dog handling on site ?

i just take note of what the experts say....no inference can be drawn from an unconfirmed alert

[Brietta]

Is so called cadaver scent as transferable as we have been told it is?

For example if one took a top which had come into contact with a dead body and placed it in a bag containing an uncontaminated top ~ an uncontaminated cardigan ~ an uncontaminated vest ~  and uncontaminated socks ... every single item of clothing in that bag would be subject to cross contamination by the highly transferable cadaver scent emanating from the contaminated top.

That is what we have been told ... and Martin Grime has explained as much in his police statements.  Reminds me a bit about the warning videos showing the ease with which a kitchen can be contaminated when preparing chicken.

Every single item in that bag into which the contaminated top had been placed ~ not to mention the bag itself ~ would now reek of cadaver scent and every item including the bag would provoke a cadaver dog to display its trained response.

Kate McCann's clothing was present in the rented villa while the dog was performing its checks.

The dog did not alert.

It was only when the clothing had been removed from the villa where the dog ignored it and taken to the gymnasium where it was spread out on the gymnasium floor that the dog alerted to ...
Quote
* in two pieces of clothing belonging to KATE HEALY
* in a piece of clothing of the minor MADELEINE    End quote

The rest of the clothing which had been in the box was ignored ... as was the box itself.

• How is it possible that clothing cleared in the villa inspection produced an alert after transportation to another place?
• How is it possible that despite the known contaminant properties of 'cadaver scent' only three items from the same box and not all the contents of the box were cross contaminated?
• How is it possible there was no dog reaction to the box the three items had been carried in?
• What was the rationale in transporting the clothing contents of the villa where they had not achieved a reaction to the gymnasium where they did?

In my opinion based on the Levy edited videos I have seen it is evident that the fact that nothing connected to the dog's visit to Praia da Luz makes much sense at all.

[barrier]

Who was it that actually made the decision to bring Mark Harrison in to the investigation and was it him who brought Mr Grime in or was that on some one else watch?

[stephen25000]

Is so called cadaver scent as transferable as we have been told it is?

For example if one took a top which had come into contact with a dead body and placed it in a bag containing an uncontaminated top ~ an uncontaminated cardigan ~ an uncontaminated vest ~  and uncontaminated socks ... every single item of clothing in that bag would be subject to cross contamination by the highly transferable cadaver scent emanating from the contaminated top.

That is what we have been told ... and Martin Grime has explained as much in his police statements.  Reminds me a bit about the warning videos showing the ease with which a kitchen can be contaminated when preparing chicken.

Every single item in that bag into which the contaminated top had been placed ~ not to mention the bag itself ~ would now reek of cadaver scent and every item including the bag would provoke a cadaver dog to display its trained response.

Kate McCann's clothing was present in the rented villa while the dog was performing its checks.

The dog did not alert.

It was only when the clothing had been removed from the villa where the dog ignored it and taken to the gymnasium where it was spread out on the gymnasium floor that the dog alerted to ...
Quote
* in two pieces of clothing belonging to KATE HEALY
* in a piece of clothing of the minor MADELEINE    End quote

The rest of the clothing which had been in the box was ignored ... as was the box itself.

• How is it possible that clothing cleared in the villa inspection produced an alert after transportation to another place?
• How is it possible that despite the known contaminant properties of 'cadaver scent' only three items from the same box and not all the contents of the box were cross contaminated?
• How is it possible there was no dog reaction to the box the three items had been carried in?
• What was the rationale in transporting the clothing contents of the villa where they had not achieved a reaction to the gymnasium where they did?

In my opinion based on the Levy edited videos I have seen it is evident that the fact that nothing connected to the dog's visit to Praia da Luz makes much sense at all.

You do realise that anyone reading this forum and  wanting an independent view can check this out for themselves...

[Alfie]

The way the searches were set up was unprofessional, the fault for that lies primarily with the PJ IMO. 

[barrier]

The way the searches were set up was unprofessional, the fault for that lies primarily with the PJ IMO.

Because the dogs alerted?

[Alfie]

Because the dogs alerted?

No!  I am referring to the way clothes were boxed up and laid out on the floor of a carpark, the way the McCanns car was parked up by a police officer who could have contaminated the car, the way the car was left plastered in McCann posters, you know that sort of thing.

[Robittybob1]

Because the dogs alerted?

I have previously proven that the alert on the cuddle cat and Sean's top were ruses designed to make Kate confess.  They had no evidence value only shock value.

[stephen25000]

The absence of Madeleine is circumstantial evidence of abduction.
"You don't know if the dogs didn't alert to a body." Double negative again.

The absence of Madeleine is circumstantial evidence of accidental death.

Second sentence, you clearly didn't comprehend.

[The Singularity]

I still don't understand the fascination people have with the dogs, they are tools to find forensic evidence for processing. Yes the dogs alerted, they did their job in that capacity but didn't identify areas of forensic value. So essentially, what they were brought in for in this case didn't advance the investigation.

[Brietta]

I still don't understand the fascination people have with the dogs, they are tools to find forensic evidence for processing. Yes the dogs alerted, they did their job in that capacity but didn't identify areas of forensic value. So essentially, what they were brought in for in this case didn't advance the investigation.

The dogs might have had more chance of success had less time elapsed between Madeleine's disappearance and their deployment.

Unfortunately by the time the British dogs were called in there was little chance of finding Madeleine if that was even 
a priority as by that time I think the focus of the police investigation was firmly fixed on finding aevidence against a suspect.


Help refused for sniffer dogs

Thu, 24 May 2007

Recently, the police in Portugal declined the offer of help from a British sniffer dog team to find missing 4 year old Madeleine McCann.

Senior British Police officers have encouraged Portuguese teams to use the skills of sniffer dogs that are trained in the UK, as they are believed to be the best.

British dogs, including a Spaniel associated with the National Police Improvement Agency, undergo advanced tracking techniques that can track human scent from several miles. It is known that these dogs can track scents that are as old as 28 days.

A senior UK police officer said, "It is an absolute scandal — time is fast running out for this little girl."

"These dogs have immense capability. Their tracking skills are among the finest in the world."

"The dogs were put on standby to go to the Algarve within days of Madeleine’s disappearance."

"You would expect the Portuguese to make use of the best resources available to them, but they repeatedly ignore the offers of assistance."

He added that these dogs are exception at what they do and they can identify blood on a weapon which has been wiped off.
http://www.dogs.co.uk/news/2007/May/Help-refused-for-sniffer-dogs.html

[ShiningInLuz]

The dogs might have had more chance of success had less time elapsed between Madeleine's disappearance and their deployment.

Unfortunately by the time the British dogs were called in there was little chance of finding Madeleine if that was even 
a priority as by that time I think the focus of the police investigation was firmly fixed on finding aevidence against a suspect.


Help refused for sniffer dogs

Thu, 24 May 2007

Recently, the police in Portugal declined the offer of help from a British sniffer dog team to find missing 4 year old Madeleine McCann.

Senior British Police officers have encouraged Portuguese teams to use the skills of sniffer dogs that are trained in the UK, as they are believed to be the best.

British dogs, including a Spaniel associated with the National Police Improvement Agency, undergo advanced tracking techniques that can track human scent from several miles. It is known that these dogs can track scents that are as old as 28 days.

A senior UK police officer said, "It is an absolute scandal — time is fast running out for this little girl."

"These dogs have immense capability. Their tracking skills are among the finest in the world."

"The dogs were put on standby to go to the Algarve within days of Madeleine’s disappearance."

"You would expect the Portuguese to make use of the best resources available to them, but they repeatedly ignore the offers of assistance."

He added that these dogs are exception at what they do and they can identify blood on a weapon which has been wiped off.
http://www.dogs.co.uk/news/2007/May/Help-refused-for-sniffer-dogs.html

Is there a more reliable source than dogs.co.uk that this offer was made by the British and rejected by the Portuguese?