Is this another example of a potentially crucial error by the VRD handler?

[misty]

It is also a fact that cadaver dog evidence has been used in at least one trial in the UK which would certainly mean that they are considered evidence even if that evidence may need to be corroborated.  See David Gilroy case.

Martin Grime is a professional man who has many years experience working for the UK police and the FBI for any one to imply he was deliberately cuing any dog is libel IMO.

Do you have a cites for cases where Grime + Eddie located a body or helped solve a crime in an overseas jurisdiction pre-2007 which justified the "internationally renowned" reputation?

[jassi]

Has anyone on this forum made that accusation?

Who knows? Stuff gets deleted all the time.

[Sunny]

Do you have a cites for cases where Grime + Eddie located a body or helped solve a crime in an overseas jurisdiction pre-2007 which justified the "internationally renowned" reputation?

Did I say he had an "internationally renowned" reputation, whether in 2007 or not. No I did not so don't put words into my mouth. I suggest you read my post again Misty.

[Brietta]

Yes luckily it was removed today.

Hmmmm ... I must have missed that in the log.

[Venturi Swirl]

I think we have all agreed that the dogs have not been proved correct, but equally they have not been proved incorrect. Their alert is a fact. What it means is uncertain.

Those particular dog alerts can never be proven to be incorrect.

[jassi]

Those particular dog alerts can never be proven to be incorrect.

Indeed, they will remain for ever in the suspicious category - unless Madeleine makes a surprise live appearance.

[misty]

Did I say he had an "internationally renowned" reputation, whether in 2007 or not. No I did not so don't put words into my mouth. I suggest you read my post again Misty.

You stated that he had several years experience with the UK police & FBI. Was all that work done using Eddie?
Sometimes the dog may not be all that it is cracked up to be. For instance, in 2004 this is how Eddie was reported in the media:-
https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/wuff-justice-doggy-sleuths-on-the-trail-of-murder-victims-1-2543216

 The two officers set out looking for high-drive working dogs, which they could train to be the best, and found two border collies – Frankie and a similar dog. Their first deployment was to investigate the murder of Barnsley man Shane Collier, but only Frankie proved suitable, and the other dog had to be retired early. That was when they began to train up springer spaniel Eddie instead, a dog whose owner was finding him simply "unmanageable".

By 2008. Eddie's origins were reported to be a specialist dog breeder.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Nigel/id157.htm
 (How can a dog sniff through concrete? BBC News
 
Page last updated at 13:23 GMT, Tuesday, 26 February 2008
 
WHO, WHAT, WHY?
The Magazine answers...

"Eddie was bred by a specialist search-dog breeder and Keela came from the West Midlands Police breeding programme.
 
Both live with Mr Grime and have a normal life outside of work. He is currently training two new dogs, Morse and Lewis."


2 words jumped out at me from the Yorkshire Post article - "business plan".

[misty]

Hmmmm ... I must have missed that in the log.

@Twas from my post containing the occupancy issue.

[Sunny]

@Twas from my post containing the occupancy issue.

I am glad you admit that so I retract my apology to you Misty.

Back on topic. When I made my post about Martin Grime I was not distinguishing pre 2007 or post 2007 I was simply making the point that he seems to be highly thought of even by the FBI.  Did I mention that all the work was with Eddie? You are putting words into my mouth again. Please desist.  Where is a sensible moderator to or modify your posts.  I also see the @ Misty. are you a twitterer?

[ShiningInLuz]

You stated that he had several years experience with the UK police & FBI. Was all that work done using Eddie?
Sometimes the dog may not be all that it is cracked up to be. For instance, in 2004 this is how Eddie was reported in the media:-
https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/wuff-justice-doggy-sleuths-on-the-trail-of-murder-victims-1-2543216

 The two officers set out looking for high-drive working dogs, which they could train to be the best, and found two border collies – Frankie and a similar dog. Their first deployment was to investigate the murder of Barnsley man Shane Collier, but only Frankie proved suitable, and the other dog had to be retired early. That was when they began to train up springer spaniel Eddie instead, a dog whose owner was finding him simply "unmanageable".

By 2008. Eddie's origins were reported to be a specialist dog breeder.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/Nigel/id157.htm
 (How can a dog sniff through concrete? BBC News
 
Page last updated at 13:23 GMT, Tuesday, 26 February 2008
 
WHO, WHAT, WHY?
The Magazine answers...

"Eddie was bred by a specialist search-dog breeder and Keela came from the West Midlands Police breeding programme.
 
Both live with Mr Grime and have a normal life outside of work. He is currently training two new dogs, Morse and Lewis."


2 words jumped out at me from the Yorkshire Post article - "business plan".

Perhaps we should have a post-of-the-day thread.  That was very interesting.   

[Sunny]

Perhaps we should have a post-of-the-day thread.  That was very interesting.   

That is a matter of opinion. Someone telling me what I posted when I didn't will never make post-of-the-day IMO.

Mind you this is interesting about a 2 and a half year old Eddie

SNIFFING out tiny traces of blood in murder cases and tracking down buried human remains is a job only two specialists in Britain are qualified to do. Two-and-a-half-year-old springer spaniel Eddie and partner Frankie – a four-year-old border collie – are experts who come second to none in their line of work. Their keen noses take them under floorboards, through rivers and woodland, and into lofts and caves. They are fully passported, and have been transported far and wide by plane and helicopter. And their professionalism and success rate are such that when the FBI called on their services recently, they were simply too busy to help.

Read more at: https://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/wuff-justice-doggy-sleuths-on-the-trail-of-murder-victims-1-2543216

[misty]

I am glad you admit that so I retract my apology to you Misty.

Back on topic. When I made my post about Martin Grime I was not distinguishing pre 2007 or post 2007 I was simply making the point that he seems to be highly thought of even by the FBI.  Did I mention that all the work was with Eddie? You are putting words into my mouth again. Please desist.  Where is a sensible moderator to or modify your posts.  I also see the @ Misty. are you a twitterer?

There was nothing wrong with referring to the CC alert as a fiasco IMO. It seems less libellous than posts still standing which say the McCanns invented stories for the media. But hey ho.....
Would you supply a cite from the FBI that he was highly regarded, please, as his evidence was not permitted in the actual trial of Sam Parker?
Eddie was the dog in question here, with his handler. Was Eddie infallible? Would Grime claim his dog was actually trained to pick up evidence with his mouth or dig at the possible burial site of a murder victim?

I am not @Misty on twitter.

[Sunny]

I was talking about Grime not Eddie but you have already provided a cite that the FBI wanted Grime and a 2 and a half year old Eddie.

It wasn't your reference to the CC episode that I was referring to when I said I retract my apology it was the following sentence.

[Venturi Swirl]

Indeed, they will remain for ever in the suspicious category - unless Madeleine makes a surprise live appearance.

No, even if Madeleine turns up alive it will still be impossible to prove them incorrect.

[Angelo222]

No, even if Madeleine turns up alive it will still be impossible to prove them incorrect.

That would be a miracle.