Author Topic: Is this another example of a potentially crucial error by the VRD handler?  (Read 40276 times)

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Offline Angelo222

I was drawn to review the cadaver dog examination & alert in 5A following a recent discussion elsewhere.

On watching the sequence of events starting at 19m 16s on the attached link (full screen on a laptop/desktop is recommended) https://youtu.be/c4NMYPsFKb8?t=1156  right through to the time of Eddie's alert, it is very interesting to note where Eddie's nose can briefly be seen before he turns around behind the sofa & starts barking. His tail is visible, showing his position when alerting.
 I have included a still shot where you can see his nose just before the alert.


Contrast this with the commentary Grime provided on the location of the source of the alert at the time:-

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES.htm

*snipped*

"Moving onto the other rooms once he's found what he thinks he's looking for in this room, and we go into the bathroom and come into this bedroom he loses his interest because he's actually found the source that he was looking for, until we come over here and I think you've got it on video that when he first came in he was quite interested in the sofa but he didn't have access to the back of the sofa and when he's gone behind the sofa what I saw was that approximately in the centre of the wall where the window is, just along the tile area between the tiles and the wall, he's been scenting there a lot stronger than he has anywhere else and the when he's gone out there the second time he has decided yes that's what I'm looking for and that's when he has given me the bark indication."

What observations do other posters have regarding what appears to be the real source of  Eddie's alert?

Eddie appeared to be interested in a scent coming from under the settee but I agree misty, he alerted at the end of the settee by the curtains.
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline misty

Eddie appeared to be interested in a scent coming from under the settee but I agree misty, he alerted at the end of the settee by the curtains.

Thank you, Angelo.
Keela couldn't access that end of the sofa because the small table was in the way.

Offline Robittybob1

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Offline misty

Perhaps we should have a post-of-the-day thread.  That was very interesting.   8((()*/

I don't think it qualifies as post of the day but the links certainly provided food for thought. I wonder how he managed to train Morse & Lewis based on the date of the report as he was in Jersey under Operation Rectangle for the next 4 months?

Offline Brietta

@Twas from my post containing the occupancy issue.

Thank you Misty.  I have now located the offending post.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Robittybob1

Thank you Misty.  I have now located the offending post.
Topic
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John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Brietta

Topic

Yes, the redacted sentence referred to was on topic ... unfortunately it failed another necessary criterion.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Robittybob1

Yes, the redacted sentence referred to was on topic ... unfortunately it failed another necessary criterion.
"redacted"  what does that mean? 

redact

verb
past tense: redacted; past participle: redacted
edit (text) for publication.
"a confidential memo which has been redacted from 25 pages to just one paragraph"
censor or obscure (part of a text) for legal or security purposes."

OMG we are getting clever!
Moderation
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Offline G-Unit

How large a gap in both space & time should a cadaver dog be permitted between source & alert? Would a delay in alerting or a misinterpreted source of alert have an adverse effect on the collection of possible forensic evidence?

Having looked at the 'problem' highlighted it seems there isn't one. The collection of forensic evidence from the area of the couch had nothing to do with Eddie the cadaver dog's alert. The forensics were collected after viewing the filmed alerts of Keela the blood dog. She was used during the collection process also to make sure nothing was missed;

they watched the films of the searches performed by the dog specialised in detection of human blood so that they obtained an understanding of the area from where the tiles should be collected and how many tiles they should collect.

After seeing the images and in agreement with the officers of DIC of Portimao it was defined that the undersigned should proceed with the recovery of four tiles. It was also defined that this operation of recovery of the tiles would also be filmed.

After the recovery of the four tiles and the skirting board the dog specialised in the detection of traces of human blood was put into the area from where the tiles had been recovered, the English police officer who coordinated the movement of the dog, Martin Grime, having informed the undersigned that they should proceed with the recovery of another piece of tile that was close to the area from where the tile identified as number 1 had been lifted, that terminating the recovery of the tiles signalled by the dog.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/5A_EDDIE-KEELA.htm
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Offline G-Unit

There was nothing wrong with referring to the CC alert as a fiasco IMO. It seems less libellous than posts still standing which say the McCanns invented stories for the media. But hey ho.....
Would you supply a cite from the FBI that he was highly regarded, please, as his evidence was not permitted in the actual trial of Sam Parker?
Eddie was the dog in question here, with his handler. Was Eddie infallible? Would Grime claim his dog was actually trained to pick up evidence with his mouth or dig at the possible burial site of a murder victim?

I am not @Misty on twitter.

I do hope it's not me who is being accused of libelling the McCanns..
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Offline Sunny

I do hope it's not me who is being accused of libelling the McCanns..

No one was being accused of libeling the McCanns another poster was accused of possibly libeling someone else.
Members are reminded that cites must be provided in accordance with the forum rules. On several occasions recently cites have been requested but never provided. Asking for a cite is not goading but compliance.

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Offline G-Unit

No one was being accused of libeling the McCanns another poster was accused of possibly libeling someone else.

Thank you Misty. I thought this;

snip
It seems less libellous than posts still standing which say the McCanns invented stories for the media. But hey ho.....

was something to do with my posts on another thread.
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Offline Venturi Swirl

Thank you Misty. I thought this;

snip
It seems less libellous than posts still standing which say the McCanns invented stories for the media. But hey ho.....

was something to do with my posts on another thread.
Have you ever suggested that the McCanns passed on false stories to the media?
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline G-Unit

Have you ever suggested that the McCanns passed on false stories to the media?

In my opinion I have not.
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Offline Venturi Swirl

In my opinion I have not.
What, not even hinted at it?  I feel you are mistaken...
reply #671
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9913.660
« Last Edit: August 09, 2018, 08:25:26 AM by Vertigo Swirl »
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly