Could an intruder have opened the shutter and climbed in the window?

[pegasus]

"In both the April burglaries entry was gained via a window"
http://www.theportugalnews.com/news/madeleine-mccann-leads-pour-in-after-bbc-crimewatch/29660
BTW that was 5L and 5G. Same block as 5A

[mercury]

Do you think the open window at 5L was staged too?

No as I have no knowledge or opinion on it, btw it has been suggested by a UK forensic specialist that 5a could have been staged, not me personally
I tend to take professionals' views into account sometimes

 

[pegasus]

No as I have no knowledge or opinion on it, btw it has been suggested by a UK forensic specialist that 5a could have been staged, not me personally
I tend to take professionals' views into account sometimes

 

Which UK forensic specialist professional?

[pathfinder73]

In your theory was the shutter first opened before the 7 adults rushed from restaurant toward 5A?  Or after?

Before the others rushed to 5A but only 3 went inside - the McCanns and DP.

[Miss Taken Identity]

Which UK forensic specialist professional?

The moving timeline, and all the claimed activity by the Tapas group (that fail safe -child safe 'checking' system in place, so approved by supporters) What TIME did this 'intruder' commit this heinous crime? apart from the tanner sighting time... Well, within a few seconds to bang in steal a sleeping child jump back out the window, without leaving so much of a foot print or a scuff mark..... nice tidy child snatcher.

[pegasus]

The moving timeline, and all the claimed activity by the Tapas group (that fail safe -child safe 'checking' system in place, so approved by supporters) What TIME did this 'intruder' commit this heinous crime? apart from the tanner sighting time... Well, within a few seconds to bang in steal a sleeping child jump back out the window, without leaving so much of a foot print or a scuff mark..... nice tidy child snatcher.

The question is: Can the window and shutter be opened from outside without force?
It is a scientific question - absolutely nothing to do with timelines, or child-checking, or sightings, or the illogical assumption that someone got as far as entering the apartment.
It is answered by looking at the mechanical design of the window and shutter and nothing else.

[Benice]

The moving timeline, and all the claimed activity by the Tapas group (that fail safe -child safe 'checking' system in place, so approved by supporters) What TIME did this 'intruder' commit this heinous crime? apart from the tanner sighting time... Well, within a few seconds to bang in steal a sleeping child jump back out the window, without leaving so much of a foot print or a scuff mark..... nice tidy child snatcher.

Why do you keep insisting that the intruder came in or went out of the window or both - and then scoffing at the idea?    That was the McCanns first and perfectly normal assumption from how they found the room.     Later they accepted that other means of entry/departure were possible.  It would appear that you have missed that.

[Miss Taken Identity]

The question is: Can the window and shutter be opened from outside without force?
It is a scientific question - absolutely nothing to do with timelines, or child-checking, or sightings, or the illogical assumption that someone got as far as entering the apartment.
It is answered by looking at the mechanical design of the window and shutter and nothing else.

This was looked at closley. I think Pathy put up a video of this a while back, it may still  be on another thread...

Experts looking at all scenarios.

[pegasus]

Before the others rushed to 5A but only 3 went inside - the McCanns and DP.

So we agree that the shutter was already physically open before the moment when 6 people left the table.
We just disagree on who opened it, and from which side.

[Benice]

The question is: Can the window and shutter be opened from outside without force?
It is a scientific question - absolutely nothing to do with timelines, or child-checking, or sightings, or the illogical assumption that someone got as far as entering the apartment.
It is answered by looking at the mechanical design of the window and shutter and nothing else.

Gerry found (to his horror)  that the shutters could be raised from the outside.    We also know from (Pat Brown's?) video that the shutters could be raised from the outside.  A person was filmed doing exactly that.

[pegasus]

This was looked at closley. I think Pathy put up a video of this a while back, it may still  be on another thread...

Experts looking at all scenarios.

IMO the child bedroom window was not locked.
Same as some of the windows in other t9 apartment - not locked - see T7 rogs.

[pegasus]

Gerry found (to his horror)  that the shutters could be raised from the outside.    We also know from (Pat Brown's?) video that the shutters could be raised from the outside.  A person was filmed doing exactly that.

GM that night, and PB's video on later date, each solve only the first stage of the 3 stage method.
Both failed to solve the full 3 stage method.
See first half of Heriberto video - the correct solution - all 3 stages - very easy.

[Miss Taken Identity]

Why do you keep insisting that the intruder came in or went out of the window or both - and then scoffing at the idea?    That was the McCanns first and perfectly normal assumption from how they found the room.     Later they accepted that other means of entry/departure were possible.  It would appear that you have missed that.

It was the parents who insisted- all over the papers!

I can scoff at the stupid attempt to cloud the fact the parents did wrong by their dughter regarding her safety. trying to hoodwink and failing.

Later? how much later? after it was discovered that the doors were left unlocked? Have they ever suggested that?  They were very reluctant to mention that as it would leave people wondering if the door was unlocked Mddie could have 'woke n wandered;  venhimatly denied by both parents as a possibility.


Ofcourse the window /shutters are a red herring. We have seen on anothr thread- Gerry goes to check Maddie- noticed the door was open NOT WINDOW OR SHUTTERS. he leaves a few min later JT sees a fleeing abductor.

Seems I didn't miss that part? eh.

[Benice]

It was the parents who insisted- all over the papers!

I can scoff at the stupid attempt to cloud the fact the parents did wrong by their dughter regarding her safety. trying to hoodwink and failing.

Later? how much later? after it was discovered that the doors were left unlocked? Have they ever suggested that?  They were very reluctant to mention that as it would leave people wondering if the door was unlocked Mddie could have 'woke n wandered;  venhimatly denied by both parents as a possibility.


Ofcourse the window /shutters are a red herring. We have seen on anothr thread- Gerry goes to check Maddie- noticed the door was open NOT WINDOW OR SHUTTERS. he leaves a few min later JT sees a fleeing abductor.

Seems I didn't miss that part? eh.

That was in 2007.   Most of us have moved on since then.

[Miss Taken Identity]

That was in 2007.   Most of us have moved on since then.

Admission the parents were lying about the jemmied shutters? and suggesting the abduction took place via a window?  ... lets pretend they didn't say that- re write history. Glad you all moved on.