Author Topic: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?  (Read 110902 times)

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Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #375 on: April 11, 2020, 11:19:04 AM »
For those who are still defending the government’s response to the horrendous virus.

https://youtu.be/NQkLRuyXwOc
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Brietta

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #376 on: April 12, 2020, 01:45:58 AM »
For those who are still defending the government’s response to the horrendous virus.

https://youtu.be/NQkLRuyXwOc

In my opinion there should be a reckoning when we come through this and return to whatever the new normality may be and I think Keir Starmer has it all to play for as he becomes a better known face to the general public.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/keir-starmer-labour-leadership-ratings-update-jeremy-corbyn-poll-a9460716.html
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Venturi Swirl

"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #378 on: April 12, 2020, 11:17:04 AM »
In my opinion there should be a reckoning when we come through this and return to whatever the new normality may be and I think Keir Starmer has it all to play for as he becomes a better known face to the general public.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/keir-starmer-labour-leadership-ratings-update-jeremy-corbyn-poll-a9460716.html

Agreed but it is a perilous path he treads. If he swings too far too the right he will lose the voters who supported Corbyn, too far to the left and he will lose the support of his centrist colleagues as Corbyn did. Interesting times ahead.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #379 on: April 12, 2020, 11:23:09 AM »
An interesting read

https://www.kcl.ac.uk/policy-institute/assets/coronavirus-in-the-uk.pdf

As the numbers dead rise and we start counting those who died in care homes and at home and not simply in hospital it will be interesting to see whether the public attitude will change.

I found this interesting.

People are more likely to agree than disagree that the government’s response has been confused and inconsistent (42% vs 31%) and that the government acted too slowly (62% vs 16%).
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Venturi Swirl

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #380 on: April 12, 2020, 03:21:35 PM »
For the second week in a row Matthew nails it

author-image
MATTHEW SYED
This is the age of ‘me, me, me’ — until we need a scapegoat, and it’s ‘them, them, them’
Matthew Syed
Sunday April 12 2020, 12.01am, The Sunday Times
Share




Save

Suppose that in 2015 David Cameron had proposed creating surge capacity to deal with a future epidemic. Suppose he had instructed officials to draw up plans for a new diagnostic infrastructure, buying surplus protective equipment and working with other nations to improve warning systems. Suppose there had even been talk of a warehouse stocked with ventilators to help us cope if a lethal microbe struck.

Do you think Cameron would have been hailed for his far-sightedness? Or do you think that the public would have been up in arms about ventilators gathering dust when money was needed here and now; that pundits would have been bemused about the rush to deal with a mutation that hadn’t yet materialised; that social media would have been awash with condemnation of long-term planning being prioritised over more urgent demands?

It is, of course, a tricky thought experiment to perform, given that we cannot unremember the times we are living through, with their social distancing and lockdowns. But we do know that successive prime ministers didn’t react fully to warnings from scientists that pandemics represented the biggest risk to humanity. Is it not plausible that they failed to do so because they knew it would have been political Kryptonite? Even Dominic Cummings, who wrote extensively about pandemics while outside politics, lost his sense of urgency when he had to write a manifesto that people might actually vote for.

And that is why I fear we may be drawing some wrong lessons from this crisis. It’s easy to blame politicians for misjudgments and logistical difficulties since the virus emerged. But we haven’t yet acknowledged that the broader failure of planning is a reflection of the chronic short-termism of the shameless chancers they rely on to secure power. In other words, us.

We once had a concept of prudence, of saving for a rainy day: the idea that to gain something of value, we needed the patience to delay gratification. Some historians argue that these values were central to the Protestant Reformation and laid the cultural roots for the rise of Europe after a long period of decline between the fall of Rome and the sacking of Constantinople — leading, ultimately, to the Industrial Revolution.


Today we live in an era of “now, now, now”. An era of dwindling attention spans, the sugar-rush detonations of computer games, the dopamine-optimised intensity of online entertainment, the summary recriminations of social media. Gratification isn’t rapid; it’s instant. I doubt any politician could have sold a policy of long-term planning for a pandemic, despite estimates in 2014 that early investment would save hundreds of billions of pounds over the course of the next hundred years.

I mean, who wants to wait a hundred years for a payback? Who wants to wait even 10? Isn’t it easier when a disaster materialises to blame Boris Johnson or some other bogeyman rather than acknowledge our own role in it? Don’t we see the same pattern with the credit crunch, as we continue to collude in the deranged pretence that it was entirely the fault of greedy bankers and nothing at all to do with those of us who took out 120% mortgages and maxed out our credit cards?

And isn’t this part of a broader pattern in which rational long-term planning is sacrificed on the altar of “nowness”? We see it in our lamentable inability to take wise (or cost-effective) decisions on large infrastructure projects, social care and pensions, not to mention antimicrobial resistance and ecological dangers.

The scourge of “now, now, now” is mirrored by that of “me, me, me”. Amid the debate about whether the government acted too late to initiate social distancing rules, I can’t help reflecting upon reports that members of the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage) were sceptical that the public would obey them. They didn’t think a campaign emphasising that people going out were risking not merely their own lives but those of the people round them would be sufficient to engender collective responsibility, at least not at first.

You may disagree with this judgment, but can you not at least glimpse their reasoning? I mean, how often do people go to A&E when they don’t need to, or make GP appointments they don’t keep? We know that such decisions cost lives, but it doesn’t prevent people from placing self-interest above the public good. Indeed, many continued to throw barbecues and parties in those first few weeks, only scaling back when the body count started rising and the police got heavy-handed. And then, of course, we blamed the police.

None of this is intended as an indictment of democracy, for, as Winston Churchill intimated, it is superior to the other systems that have been attempted. I have certainly been more than a little surprised by the dubious acclaim being showered on China, a nation that will emerge from this crisis as a pariah, however much protective equipment it lavishes upon the world. The Communist Party may have been able to enforce a total lockdown, but it also permitted wet markets, demonised whistleblowers when the virus emerged and then serially lied as the epidemic gained pace. Whatever the question, one-party systems are hardly the answer.

Yet if democracy remains our best hope, isn’t it even more imperative that we address its weaknesses? Don’t we need to reconceive of societies not merely as aggregations of individuals and families — to see the threads linking all of us to one another, and all of us to the future?

In 1976 the RAF pilot Douglas Bader spoke at a symposium at Southampton University. I hope you’ll forgive me for mentioning this, given the surfeit of Second World War references over recent weeks. For although he was ostensibly relating his experiences during the Battle of Britain, he used the occasion for a meditation on social solidarity. He made the point that this often strengthens at times of crisis — as we are seeing today with applause for the NHS, our appreciation of low-paid heroes and the upsurge in neighbourliness. The real test, he said, is whether it is sustained when the threat subsides.

“I remember a tobacconist’s shop outside Victoria station which had been bombed the previous afternoon, but in the morning there was a trestle table and a notice that said, ‘Business as usual’, and a grinning Cockney standing beside it. These are the people that we so seldom see, our compatriots who took it. If they had not taken it, if they had not built the aeroplanes and everything else, we could not have fought. We were the glamour boys up there and had something to fight back with — that was the difference.

“This is what mattered,” he concluded. “It was a united effort by everybody.”

@MatthewSyed
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #381 on: April 12, 2020, 03:53:46 PM »
For the second week in a row Matthew nails it

author-image
MATTHEW SYED
This is the age of ‘me, me, me’ — until we need a scapegoat, and it’s ‘them, them, them’
Matthew Syed
Sunday April 12 2020, 12.01am, The Sunday Times
Share




Save

Suppose that in 2015 David Cameron had proposed creating surge capacity to deal with a future epidemic. Suppose he had instructed officials to draw up plans for a new diagnostic infrastructure, buying surplus protective equipment and working with other nations to improve warning systems. Suppose there had even been talk of a warehouse stocked with ventilators to help us cope if a lethal microbe struck.

Do you think Cameron would have been hailed for his far-sightedness? Or do you think that the public would have been up in arms about ventilators gathering dust when money was needed here and now; that pundits would have been bemused about the rush to deal with a mutation that hadn’t yet materialised; that social media would have been awash with condemnation of long-term planning being prioritised over more urgent demands?

It is, of course, a tricky thought experiment to perform, given that we cannot unremember the times we are living through, with their social distancing and lockdowns. But we do know that successive prime ministers didn’t react fully to warnings from scientists that pandemics represented the biggest risk to humanity. Is it not plausible that they failed to do so because they knew it would have been political Kryptonite? Even Dominic Cummings, who wrote extensively about pandemics while outside politics, lost his sense of urgency when he had to write a manifesto that people might actually vote for.

And that is why I fear we may be drawing some wrong lessons from this crisis. It’s easy to blame politicians for misjudgments and logistical difficulties since the virus emerged. But we haven’t yet acknowledged that the broader failure of planning is a reflection of the chronic short-termism of the shameless chancers they rely on to secure power. In other words, us.

We once had a concept of prudence, of saving for a rainy day: the idea that to gain something of value, we needed the patience to delay gratification. Some historians argue that these values were central to the Protestant Reformation and laid the cultural roots for the rise of Europe after a long period of decline between the fall of Rome and the sacking of Constantinople — leading, ultimately, to the Industrial Revolution.


Today we live in an era of “now, now, now”. An era of dwindling attention spans, the sugar-rush detonations of computer games, the dopamine-optimised intensity of online entertainment, the summary recriminations of social media. Gratification isn’t rapid; it’s instant. I doubt any politician could have sold a policy of long-term planning for a pandemic, despite estimates in 2014 that early investment would save hundreds of billions of pounds over the course of the next hundred years.

I mean, who wants to wait a hundred years for a payback? Who wants to wait even 10? Isn’t it easier when a disaster materialises to blame Boris Johnson or some other bogeyman rather than acknowledge our own role in it? Don’t we see the same pattern with the credit crunch, as we continue to collude in the deranged pretence that it was entirely the fault of greedy bankers and nothing at all to do with those of us who took out 120% mortgages and maxed out our credit cards?

And isn’t this part of a broader pattern in which rational long-term planning is sacrificed on the altar of “nowness”? We see it in our lamentable inability to take wise (or cost-effective) decisions on large infrastructure projects, social care and pensions, not to mention antimicrobial resistance and ecological dangers.

The scourge of “now, now, now” is mirrored by that of “me, me, me”. Amid the debate about whether the government acted too late to initiate social distancing rules, I can’t help reflecting upon reports that members of the Scientific Advisory Group for Emergencies (Sage) were sceptical that the public would obey them. They didn’t think a campaign emphasising that people going out were risking not merely their own lives but those of the people round them would be sufficient to engender collective responsibility, at least not at first.

You may disagree with this judgment, but can you not at least glimpse their reasoning? I mean, how often do people go to A&E when they don’t need to, or make GP appointments they don’t keep? We know that such decisions cost lives, but it doesn’t prevent people from placing self-interest above the public good. Indeed, many continued to throw barbecues and parties in those first few weeks, only scaling back when the body count started rising and the police got heavy-handed. And then, of course, we blamed the police.

None of this is intended as an indictment of democracy, for, as Winston Churchill intimated, it is superior to the other systems that have been attempted. I have certainly been more than a little surprised by the dubious acclaim being showered on China, a nation that will emerge from this crisis as a pariah, however much protective equipment it lavishes upon the world. The Communist Party may have been able to enforce a total lockdown, but it also permitted wet markets, demonised whistleblowers when the virus emerged and then serially lied as the epidemic gained pace. Whatever the question, one-party systems are hardly the answer.

Yet if democracy remains our best hope, isn’t it even more imperative that we address its weaknesses? Don’t we need to reconceive of societies not merely as aggregations of individuals and families — to see the threads linking all of us to one another, and all of us to the future?

In 1976 the RAF pilot Douglas Bader spoke at a symposium at Southampton University. I hope you’ll forgive me for mentioning this, given the surfeit of Second World War references over recent weeks. For although he was ostensibly relating his experiences during the Battle of Britain, he used the occasion for a meditation on social solidarity. He made the point that this often strengthens at times of crisis — as we are seeing today with applause for the NHS, our appreciation of low-paid heroes and the upsurge in neighbourliness. The real test, he said, is whether it is sustained when the threat subsides.

“I remember a tobacconist’s shop outside Victoria station which had been bombed the previous afternoon, but in the morning there was a trestle table and a notice that said, ‘Business as usual’, and a grinning Cockney standing beside it. These are the people that we so seldom see, our compatriots who took it. If they had not taken it, if they had not built the aeroplanes and everything else, we could not have fought. We were the glamour boys up there and had something to fight back with — that was the difference.

“This is what mattered,” he concluded. “It was a united effort by everybody.”

@MatthewSyed

Priceless....over 10,000 people have died in hospital....not counting those who were at home or in a care home when they died...and it’s all our fault for expecting the government to plan for this sort of pandemic.

Maybe Mr Syed can explain why the government carry out exercises like Operation Cygnus when they are not going to act on it’s findings ?

I don’t know who’s worse....the churnalist for writing this nonsense or you for using it to justify your increasingly discredited stance.
« Last Edit: April 12, 2020, 06:12:36 PM by Faithlilly »
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Venturi Swirl

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #382 on: April 12, 2020, 06:56:51 PM »
Poor Boris still looks pretty ill in his Easter meesage today.  They are people on my timeline (all Corbyn fans) who are convinced he faked his illness.  I really think not, judging from this

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/apr/12/boris-johnson-leaves-hospital-as-he-continues-recovery-from-coronavirus

I have to admit this actually brought a little tear to my eye and I never in a million years would have thought I could  ever have been moved by anything Boris had to say!
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #383 on: April 12, 2020, 11:17:16 PM »
Poor Boris still looks pretty ill in his Easter meesage today.  They are people on my timeline (all Corbyn fans) who are convinced he faked his illness.  I really think not, judging from this

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2020/apr/12/boris-johnson-leaves-hospital-as-he-continues-recovery-from-coronavirus

I have to admit this actually brought a little tear to my eye and I never in a million years would have thought I could  ever have been moved by anything Boris had to say!

What fakery.....not Boris silly, you.

You know what brought a tear to my eye ? The deaths of those 10,000 people who didn’t get to leave the hospital and will be denied a proper funeral.

Ironic isn’t it that after Brexit nurses like Luis from Porto won’t be able to work here.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #384 on: April 13, 2020, 04:33:50 PM »
This morning - the government’s health secretary said that 19 NHS Staff had died from Coronavirus. I don’t know what he hopes to gain from this fib but it is wrong and inaccurate. Out of respect for their sacrifice we should at least remember their name and the number who gave their lives. 31 NHS staff have so far died of Coronavirus. I list their names below. RIP.

Abdul Chowdhury
Fayaz Ayache
Labeja Acellam
Alfa Saadu
Habib Zaidi
Amged El-Hawrani
Adil El Tayar
Jitendra Rathod
Anton Sebastianpillai
Mo Sami Shousha
Syed Haider
Alice Kit Tak Ong
Emilia Perugia
Daniel Souelto
Carol Jamabo
John Alagos
Liz Glanister
Glen Corbin
Thomas Harvey
Amor Gatinao
Lynsay Coventry
Cathy Sweeney
Janice Graham
Edmund Adedeji
Barbara Moore
Pooja Sharma
Bex Mack
Amreema Nasreen
Amiee O’Rourke

Remember.Their.Names.
#Superheros #NotJustANumber #NhsStaffCovidDeaths
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #385 on: April 13, 2020, 10:36:41 PM »
What fakery.....not Boris silly, you.

You know what brought a tear to my eye ? The deaths of those 10,000 people who didn’t get to leave the hospital and will be denied a proper funeral.

Ironic isn’t it that after Brexit nurses like Luis from Porto won’t be able to work here.

Luis will still be able to work here after brexit... It's the big issue sellers who wont

Offline faithlilly

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #386 on: April 13, 2020, 10:55:35 PM »
Luis will still be able to work here after brexit... It's the big issue sellers who wont

Possibly Luis will but others like him won’t, they won’t earn enough.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Venturi Swirl

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #387 on: April 13, 2020, 11:11:11 PM »
Luis will still be able to work here after brexit... It's the big issue sellers who wont
I see Faithlilly is still desperately trying to goad and insult me despite me having her on ignore.  How sad.  Of course Luis will still be able to work here, since when did Brexit mean all EU nationals would be kicked out?  The drivel some people spout.  I expect most Big Issue sellers will still be here in ten years time too.
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly

Offline Angelo222

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #388 on: April 13, 2020, 11:21:55 PM »
I see Faithlilly is still desperately trying to goad and insult me despite me having her on ignore.  How sad.  Of course Luis will still be able to work here, since when did Brexit mean all EU nationals would be kicked out?  The drivel some people spout.  I expect most Big Issue sellers will still be here in ten years time too.

I thought it was extremely interesting that the Portuguese President felt he had to personally thank nurse Luis Pitarma from Porto for looking after Boris Johnson instead of admitting shame that a Portuguese national would have to go abroad to get work.
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline Venturi Swirl

Re: Is Boris’s Lax Leadership Putting Us All in Danger ?
« Reply #389 on: April 13, 2020, 11:31:07 PM »
It’s really quite eye-opening just how many of the doctors and nurses that have been mentioned a propos of this latest crisis have been immigrants and I hope and believe it will make the people of the UK value our immigrant population alot more than perhaps we have done in the past.
"Surely the fact that their accounts were different reinforces their veracity rather than diminishes it? If they had colluded in protecting ........ surely all of their accounts would be the same?" - Faithlilly