Author Topic: Who killed Bambi ?  (Read 32769 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #300 on: January 04, 2019, 05:30:03 PM »

 I get that there would be no point in threatening the potential career of those who are never likely to have one so are you saying that the wrist slapping/threat tactic is only used on those who fit the middle class criteria? Is no other 'class' let off a first offence with just a warning?

IF EP were previously aware of Jeremy's 'cottage industry' it may just have been that it wasn't considered big enough to concern them, OR was it the MM and CB presented themselves as more likely candidates for their interests?

Well JM certainly appears to have had a successful career in education.  What makes you think the others haven't? 

I guess the police deploy whatever tactics they feel appropriate and can get away with in order to get the desired results.  Someone who has never done an honest days work and has no intention of doing so is unlikely to be bothered by reputational damage, criminal record. 

According to JM EP were aware of JB's 'cottage industry' as the drug squad visited pre murders.
 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #301 on: January 04, 2019, 05:35:06 PM »
It's small time Holly and it's just your 'hunch'. However, he sold it to the others, they had nothing to do with the murder and blackmailing them all into sending an innocent man to prison just isn't likely.

It isn't just my 'hunch'.  Too many anomalies exist for it not to mean something.   I agree the prosecution witnesses had nothing to do with the murders but that doesn't mean to say the police didn't deploy brutal tactics in order to get them to testify. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline APRIL

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #302 on: January 04, 2019, 06:07:09 PM »
Well JM certainly appears to have had a successful career in education.  What makes you think the others haven't? 

I guess the police deploy whatever tactics they feel appropriate and can get away with in order to get the desired results.  Someone who has never done an honest days work and has no intention of doing so is unlikely to be bothered by reputational damage, criminal record. 

According to JM EP were aware of JB's 'cottage industry' as the drug squad visited pre murders.

It would be too much of a coincidence to imagine that the drug squad visited -IF they did, indeed visit, OR if Jeremy told her they visited?- so close to the murders that the drugs investigation was linked in with it. You mention the "stash" that Julie kept. How much adds up to a "stash"? You mention the money bags she got from the bank. How many? Did she specify or did she just ask for some money bags?

Offline Caroline

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #303 on: January 04, 2019, 07:07:01 PM »
It isn't just my 'hunch'.  Too many anomalies exist for it not to mean something.   I agree the prosecution witnesses had nothing to do with the murders but that doesn't mean to say the police didn't deploy brutal tactics in order to get them to testify.

Evidence? Also, given that the details of the drug taking were never a secret, why haven't ANY of them come forward to complain about their treatment at the hands of EP?
« Last Edit: January 04, 2019, 07:09:27 PM by Caroline »

Offline Caroline

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #304 on: January 04, 2019, 07:18:15 PM »
Without evidence (which doesn't include assumptions) your suggestion that JM's friends were coerced is nothing other then a hunch. Her friends coming forward is a problem if you believe JB is innocent because they had no motive to do so. There needs to be a reason why they would - clearly they MUST have been coerced because ......... ?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #305 on: January 04, 2019, 08:51:21 PM »
Evidence? Also, given that the details of the drug taking were never a secret, why haven't ANY of them come forward to complain about their treatment at the hands of EP?

Why would they come forward if they were sold hard on the idea SC could not have shot herself twice and only JB knew of a way to enter and exit leaving the property apparently secure from within.  A jury found JB guilty primarily on the silencer evidence which had nothing to do with anyone's testimony so why rock the boat?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #306 on: January 04, 2019, 09:05:26 PM »
Without evidence (which doesn't include assumptions) your suggestion that JM's friends were coerced is nothing other then a hunch. Her friends coming forward is a problem if you believe JB is innocent because they had no motive to do so. There needs to be a reason why they would - clearly they MUST have been coerced because ......... ?

I don't think I've ever claimed it was anything other than a theory? 

There's no evidence anyone came forward.  The police may have deployed a range of tactics eg bugging/surveillance and were one step ahead in knowing what the friends were up to in terms of their drug habits.

The usual motives for providing testimony are altruistic, financial and self-preservation.  If the 'friends' were sold the idea JB was responsible and not SC (it was one or the other) then the first applies to all.  The second applies to JM and the latter applies to all if they were led to believe any drug related charges were negotiable if they testified against JB ie escape a possible fine/custodial sentence/criminal record.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Caroline

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #307 on: January 04, 2019, 10:08:21 PM »
I don't think I've ever claimed it was anything other than a theory?

There's no evidence anyone came forward.  The police may have deployed a range of tactics eg bugging/surveillance and were one step ahead in knowing what the friends were up to in terms of their drug habits.

The usual motives for providing testimony are altruistic, financial and self-preservation.  If the 'friends' were sold the idea JB was responsible and not SC (it was one or the other) then the first applies to all.  The second applies to JM and the latter applies to all if they were led to believe any drug related charges were negotiable if they testified against JB ie escape a possible fine/custodial sentence/criminal record.

It isn't just my 'hunch'.  Too many anomalies exist for it not to mean something.  I agree the prosecution witnesses had nothing to do with the murders but that doesn't mean to say the police didn't deploy brutal tactics in order to get them to testify.

I think the above is a suggestion than it is MORE than a theory/hunch when in fact it's a complete hunch. Now you're implying that they employed such tactics as bugging devices when there is absolutely no evidence of such. Were they to employ these tactics, it would have been to catch out Bamber, not JM's friends.

A jury found JB guilty primarily on the silencer evidence which had nothing to do with anyone's testimony so why rock the boat?

So why waste time and effort on coercing JM's friends?

You usually have pretty strong arguments (although I may not always agree with them) but this one is a none starter.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #308 on: January 07, 2019, 03:59:14 PM »
I think the above is a suggestion than it is MORE than a theory/hunch when in fact it's a complete hunch. Now you're implying that they employed such tactics as bugging devices when there is absolutely no evidence of such. Were they to employ these tactics, it would have been to catch out Bamber, not JM's friends.

So why waste time and effort on coercing JM's friends?

You usually have pretty strong arguments (although I may not always agree with them) but this one is a none starter.

The fact you see it as a non-starter doesn't make it so.

JM's WS's refer to JB's cottage being bugged on morning of 7th Aug.  We know for sure JB was placed under surveillance around mid-Sept.  The WS's of JM and SB also refer to the drug squad.  Imo the reference to bugging and drug squad originate from EP not JM/SB.  If the police suspected JM of knowing more than she was letting on they may well have bugged the telephone and/or the house in general she shared with SB et al. 

Inconsistencies over the way various witnesses were treated with regards to producing, possessing and selling drugs and other more minor criminal offences are imo pivitol to the case:

- One of the first things JB does upon being told by EP his family are all dead is walk off to the field growing the opium poppies and return clutching a bunch telling Dr Craig the farm has a licence to grow them for the pharma industry.  This doesn't makes sense.  Firstly the first UK pharma company to receive gov authorization for growing opium poppies was early 21st century.  Secondly a licence is not required by farmers to grow opium poppies for the pharma industry.  The pharma company requires it as they are responsible for turning a benign plant into a powerful pain killing drug via a chemical process.

- If JB was lying for whatever reason(s) about this then why wouldn't EP take him to task and use it at trial?

- Dr Craig, Chief Sup Harris and DI Miller were all aware opium poppies were growing at WHF.  No doubt other officers were aware too.  Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris make reference to such in WS's and actually take a look at the field/poppies.  DI Miller mentioned to MM that JB grew opium poppies. 

- In JM's WS's she makes ref to smoking marijuana on the night of 6th Aug when JB called at circa 10pm.  Other references to recreational drugs include:

- Taking cocaine in a hotel room with a friend called Stephanie and a couple of guys.
- JB growing cannabis inside and outside his cottage
- Tending to JB's cannabis plants ie watering
- JB growing cannabis between the barns at WHF
- MM bringing over seeds for JB to cultivate
- JB looking for distributors
- JM selling on campus
- JM stating the drugs squad had been to JB's cottage pre murders to take a look at his cannabis plants and he destroyed.
- Importing from Holland with JB and BC albeit small quantities

Despite all the above it appears EP did not take any action but did over OCP with JB charged at the local magistrates court.  It doesn't even appear JB was asked about drugs during his interviews under caution despite the fact when he was arrested he had cannabis on his person and immediately handed it over.  At trial jurors heard about JB's/JM's involvement in the OCP burglary and JM's cheque fraud but nothing about the drugs.

Conversely when MM was interviewed under caution he was asked extensively about his involvement with drugs.  He told DI Miller he purchased some cannabis from work colleagues and was told this in itself was a criminal offence.  He was also told his cannabis plants had been taken from his home for analysis and he may face criminal charges.  He was asked/told about JB growing opium.  He was asked whether or not Christine Bacon used cannabis and if so when.  She clearly had nothing to do with the murders and yet had her home searched and was taken in for questioning and kept in custody overnight.  She then testified against JB at trial by general character assassination. 

Imo the likes of JM eta al along with the likes of Christine Bacon were all coerced by EP into believing a) JB was responsible and b) if they didn't cooperate they would face drug related charges.   
« Last Edit: January 07, 2019, 04:01:47 PM by Holly Goodhead »
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Caroline

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #309 on: January 08, 2019, 01:42:49 AM »
The fact you see it as a non-starter doesn't make it so.

JM's WS's refer to JB's cottage being bugged on morning of 7th Aug.  We know for sure JB was placed under surveillance around mid-Sept.  The WS's of JM and SB also refer to the drug squad.  Imo the reference to bugging and drug squad originate from EP not JM/SB.  If the police suspected JM of knowing more than she was letting on they may well have bugged the telephone and/or the house in general she shared with SB et al. 

Inconsistencies over the way various witnesses were treated with regards to producing, possessing and selling drugs and other more minor criminal offences are imo pivitol to the case:

- One of the first things JB does upon being told by EP his family are all dead is walk off to the field growing the opium poppies and return clutching a bunch telling Dr Craig the farm has a licence to grow them for the pharma industry.  This doesn't makes sense.  Firstly the first UK pharma company to receive gov authorization for growing opium poppies was early 21st century.  Secondly a licence is not required by farmers to grow opium poppies for the pharma industry.  The pharma company requires it as they are responsible for turning a benign plant into a powerful pain killing drug via a chemical process.

- If JB was lying for whatever reason(s) about this then why wouldn't EP take him to task and use it at trial?

- Dr Craig, Chief Sup Harris and DI Miller were all aware opium poppies were growing at WHF.  No doubt other officers were aware too.  Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris make reference to such in WS's and actually take a look at the field/poppies.  DI Miller mentioned to MM that JB grew opium poppies. 

- In JM's WS's she makes ref to smoking marijuana on the night of 6th Aug when JB called at circa 10pm.  Other references to recreational drugs include:

- Taking cocaine in a hotel room with a friend called Stephanie and a couple of guys.
- JB growing cannabis inside and outside his cottage
- Tending to JB's cannabis plants ie watering
- JB growing cannabis between the barns at WHF
- MM bringing over seeds for JB to cultivate
- JB looking for distributors
- JM selling on campus
- JM stating the drugs squad had been to JB's cottage pre murders to take a look at his cannabis plants and he destroyed.
- Importing from Holland with JB and BC albeit small quantities

Despite all the above it appears EP did not take any action but did over OCP with JB charged at the local magistrates court.  It doesn't even appear JB was asked about drugs during his interviews under caution despite the fact when he was arrested he had cannabis on his person and immediately handed it over.  At trial jurors heard about JB's/JM's involvement in the OCP burglary and JM's cheque fraud but nothing about the drugs.

Conversely when MM was interviewed under caution he was asked extensively about his involvement with drugs.  He told DI Miller he purchased some cannabis from work colleagues and was told this in itself was a criminal offence.  He was also told his cannabis plants had been taken from his home for analysis and he may face criminal charges.  He was asked/told about JB growing opium.  He was asked whether or not Christine Bacon used cannabis and if so when.  She clearly had nothing to do with the murders and yet had her home searched and was taken in for questioning and kept in custody overnight.  She then testified against JB at trial by general character assassination. 

Imo the likes of JM eta al along with the likes of Christine Bacon were all coerced by EP into believing a) JB was responsible and b) if they didn't cooperate they would face drug related charges.

She didn't say his cottage was bugged she said Jeremy was paranoid about it.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #310 on: January 10, 2019, 11:00:29 AM »
She didn't say his cottage was bugged she said Jeremy was paranoid about it.

I didn't say she said his cottage was bugged.  I said she referred to his cottage being bugged which she does:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1112

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=284.0;attach=1114

This clearly makes no sense.  If JB really thought his cottage was bugged he was hardly likely to incriminate himself by discussing his involvement, albeit indirectly via MM, and then tell her they shouldn't discuss in the cottage again in case it was bugged!  If he really thought his cottage was bugged he would suggest a trip to the local boozer or a walk along the seawall etc.  If JB was as loose with his tongue as she apparently claimed then it begs the question why not get a recorded confession out of JB?   
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline adam

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #311 on: January 10, 2019, 11:21:03 AM »
Did Julie ever say Jeremy discussed himself & MM at his cottage ?

Thought they always discussed it while outside. They both spent a lot time away from the cottage after the massacre.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #312 on: January 10, 2019, 11:55:28 AM »
Did Julie ever say Jeremy discussed himself & MM at his cottage ?

Thought they always discussed it while outside. They both spent a lot time away from the cottage after the massacre.

Yes see the links above.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline adam

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #313 on: January 10, 2019, 12:27:23 PM »
Yes see the links above.

That was straight after the massacre. The police would not have decided to or had a chance to bug the cottage.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Who killed Bambi ?
« Reply #314 on: January 10, 2019, 12:30:38 PM »
That was straight after the massacre. The police would not have decided to or had a chance to bug the cottage.

It would seem unlikely but the point is this is what JM claimed JB told. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?