Former Portuguese detective Gonçalo Amaral wins appeal in damages trial.

[carlymichelle]

or evidence supporting the parents 'innocence' ...stale mate! The parents  told a story,there is nothing to back up their claim about abduction.

exactly   miss taken  imo the suprme court   wont go ahead but oh well its something for the supporters to cling too its been a  bad week for them hasent it??

[G-Unit]

It's interesting that the judge in the lower court based her judgement on Amaral's alleged misdoing in relation to his previous occupation. His misdeeds were not recorded in the proven facts, they related mostly to the arrangements for selling the books and video and media interviews. Very few proven facts related to the McCanns and those that were were often qualified.


13. Because of the statements made by defendant Gonçalo Amaral in the book, in the documentary and in the interview to Correio da Manhã, authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann suffer permanent anguish, insomnia, lack of appetite, anxiety and irritability, preoccupation and indefinable fear? 

       Proved.

Although she says proved, she then says;

13.  The judge adds that this psychological state is predates the book launch, the documentary and the interview and was not caused by them.

14 Authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann feel a deep shame and an indescribable ill-being because they are considered, by most people who know the theories of defendant Gonçalo Amaral, as having responsibility in the death of their daughter, being so cowardly that they have hidden her cadaver, simulating abduction, all of this to avoid criminal prosecution? 

       Proved

She then adds;

The Judge states that it is not possible to determine what most people who have read or seen Mr Amaral's thesis actually think.

[Brietta]

In chapter four of his book Mr Amaral goes on at some length about Calpol.

The effect of which on the Portuguese psyche was still reverberating in 2014.


**snip
A Belfast couple whose daughter was seized by cops in Portugal because they gave her Calpol have opened up about their holiday hell after being told by police: “We don’t want another Madeleine McCann.”
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/maddie-mccann-police-took-our-baby-because-we-gave-her-calpol-belfast-couples-portugal-holiday-hell-30375896.html

[Lace]

Taken by a paedophile gang, wasn't it?  - Of which OG have found no trace, I believe.

What the McCann's may have thought had happened to Madeleine is neither here nor there,   distraught as they were,  every scenario would have gone through their minds,   or can you not understand what parents feel when their child disappears.    No doubt the parents of Sarah Payne would have thought the same [sadly it was true]

[Miss Taken Identity]

Taken by a paedophile gang, wasn't it?  - Of which OG have found no trace, I believe.

I recall that stirring a conversation with friends as to why he would claim that, there was one offered:

" If that child is found dead or alive , sexual abuse will most probably be evidenced imo, and one wonders if this is someone giving off hints to expect it to be found"  another " I suspect the child is dead and sexual abuse  would have taken place but not neccisarily by stranger peadofile gang it has hall marks of..." the conversation ceased.
 I asked the person of the second quote what they meant, they explained, and gave instances where this had similar markers but only offered  it up as an opinion.
 
Makes a strange read to then hear the family claim she came to "no harm"- except the harm caused by the book!

I agree Sr Amaral never accused the parents of killing Maddie. That is a disgraceful slur.

[ferryman]

or evidence supporting the parents 'innocence' ...stale mate! The parents  told a story,there is nothing to back up their claim about abduction.

Stale-mate be damned.

You don't need proof of innocence.

You need proof of guilt.

Against the McCanns, there is none.

[ShiningInLuz]

In my opinion there appears to be a fundamental misunderstanding in Portugal of the use of the media in a missing person case.

The three learned judges have missed the entire purpose of such media interviews ~ which in Britain are conducted under the auspices and control of the police ~ an assistance from which the McCanns did not benefit.

The learned judges seem to evidence a total failure of comprehension of the purpose of the McCann media appearances which I find extraordinary.

The reasoning behind the learned judges reaching the conclusion that the McCanns were therefore expressing an opinion and pushing their theory ... giving Mr Amaral the right to publish a book about his ... is I think an extraordinary conclusion to reach.
It shows imo a totally different set of attitudes and thought processes regarding what to do in the event a child goes missing alien to most Western democracies, and leads one to wonder how any foreign national can expect a fair hearing in a civil case such as this one.


quote ~ "By proceeding in this manner, they opened the way for anyone to equally express an opinion about the case, contradicting their thesis – without losing their right to exercise a legitimate, and constitutionally consecrated, right to an opinion and a freedom of expression of thought." ~ end quote

I would have to disagree with you on this one, Brietta.

There was a  McCann led PR/media campaign which breached Portuguese law (IMO) and which did not fit any UK model of police-led media relations.  I believe it was both unfortunate and counter-productive.

On the topic of whether Portugal could learn a bit about the use of public appeals - I would agree with you that Portugal could learn a lesson from best practice elsewhere.

Trouble is, views have got so entrenched over the disappearance of Madeleine that I'm not sure that anyone is learning a lesson from it.

[Brietta]

The same principle in two different trials. That should give a clue which way this is likely to go.

Interesting you should think that, Alice.  Do you think they will be refused leave to appeal?

[Miss Taken Identity]

It's interesting that the judge in the lower court based her judgement on Amaral's alleged misdoing in relation to his previous occupation. His misdeeds were not recorded in the proven facts, they related mostly to the arrangements for selling the books and video and media interviews. Very few proven facts related to the McCanns and those that were were often qualified.


13. Because of the statements made by defendant Gonçalo Amaral in the book, in the documentary and in the interview to Correio da Manhã, authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann suffer permanent anguish, insomnia, lack of appetite, anxiety and irritability, preoccupation and indefinable fear?

       Proved.

Although she says proved, she then says;

13.  The judge adds that this psychological state is predates the book launch, the documentary and the interview and was not caused by them.

14 Authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann feel a deep shame and an indescribable ill-being because they are considered, by most people who know the theories of defendant Gonçalo Amaral, as having responsibility in the death of their daughter, being so cowardly that they have hidden her cadaver, simulating abduction, all of this to avoid criminal prosecution?

       Proved

She then adds;

The Judge states that it is not possible to determine what most people who have read or seen Mr Amaral's thesis actually think.

You are absolutely correct G.

The Judge mentioned his profession- judicial secrecy was out with her remit of that hearing. If something was to be done about Amaral breaking such law then it had  more to do with police making a case against Sr Amaral and not people on a tinertnet forum. Has he been arrested for that heinous crime yet?

"authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann suffer permanent anguish, insomnia, lack of appetite, anxiety and irritability, preoccupation and indefinable fear? "  all this suffering whilst enjoying the good life and him working with very ill, vulnerable patients well I never!

[stephen25000]

Stale-mate be damned.

You don't need proof of innocence.

You need proof of guilt.

Against the McCanns, there is none.

Crime unknown.

No evidence of anything no matter your bluster on abduction.

[G-Unit]

When the last appeal was made to the Supreme Court Isabelle Duarte seems to have based it on this;

In the appeal, the lawyer argues that the Appellate Court “did not take into consideration facts that have never been questioned throughout the process” and stressed that “those elements were not analysed” by the higher judges, in order to annul the Civil Court of Lisbon’s decision after the injunction that was requested by Madeleine’s parents.

“The Appeallate Court did not take into account that the book was made to make money, to deepen the McCann couple’s pain and to damage the investigation”, stressed Isabel Duarte, who has not yet returned Gonçalo Amaral’s book to the publishers Guerra & Paz, for the former inspector’s work to return to bookshops.
http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2010/11/mccanns-appeal-to-supreme-court-to.html

She seems to have a very questionable definition of a 'fact'. How on earth did she propose to prove what Amaral's intentions were? No wonder the Supreme Court rejected the application if that's what she thought was relevant. Even the judge in the 'libel' case didn't rely on any of those 'facts'.

[pegasus]

In chapter four of his book Mr Amaral goes on at some length about Calpol.
The effect of which on the Portuguese psyche was still reverberating in 2014 (snip)
http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/sunday-life/news/maddie-mccann-police-took-our-baby-because-we-gave-her-calpol-belfast-couples-portugal-holiday-hell-30375896.html

Some UK papers get the facts wrong about that Brietta.
For factual accounts, without ridiculous spin and lies to discredit the excellent portuguese police, I suggest you consult TVI, or Publico, english translations of both are at http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2014/06/the-case-of-irish-baby-girl.html

[G-Unit]

You are absolutely correct G.

The Judge mentioned his profession- judicial secrecy was out with her remit of that hearing. If something was to be done about Amaral breaking such law then it had  more to do with police making a case against Sr Amaral and not people on a tinertnet forum. Has he been arrested for that heinous crime yet?

"authors Kate McCann and Gerald McCann suffer permanent anguish, insomnia, lack of appetite, anxiety and irritability, preoccupation and indefinable fear? "  all this suffering whilst enjoying the good life and him working with very ill, vulnerable patients well I never!

When Gerry first returned to work he didn't have contact with patients at first, I believe;

It is planned that Dr McCann will be involved in direct contact with patients in clinic after one month.

After the New Year, "as long as we and he are happy with his progress", the heart specialist will return to clinical care, Dr Skehan said.
http://www.standard.co.uk/news/gerry-mccann-returns-to-work-saying-he-is-not-expecting-any-significant-developments-in-the-hunt-for-6697318.html

He must be strong to do his job properly despite not eating or sleeping, being anxious, preoccupied and irritable. I bet he was a joy to be around. Mind you, he was able to function quite early on. Wednesday 16th May;

That day, Gerry played tennis with Seddo, David
and the Mark Warner tennis coach. There was no
way I could have done this. As well as being acutely
aware that the last time I’d played tennis was the last
day I’d seen Madeleine, I was far from ready to take
part in anything that could be classified as
pleasurable. Although I’d been for a run two days
before, to me, as I’ve said, this seemed a necessity
rather than a pleasure, and there is no doubt there
was an element of self-punishment to it. All
recreational activities seemed inappropriate,
verging on disrespectful, and because they weren’t
yet right for me, I found it hard to understand how
Gerry could enjoy them, either.
Kate McCann. Madeleine

[Brietta]

I would have to disagree with you on this one, Brietta.

There was a  McCann led PR/media campaign which breached Portuguese law (IMO) and which did not fit any UK model of police-led media relations.  I believe it was both unfortunate and counter-productive.

On the topic of whether Portugal could learn a bit about the use of public appeals - I would agree with you that Portugal could learn a lesson from best practice elsewhere.

Trouble is, views have got so entrenched over the disappearance of Madeleine that I'm not sure that anyone is learning a lesson from it.

There is provision in the Portuguese Constitution for the secrecy laws to be considerably relaxed in cases of missing children to allow publicity.
I cannot at the moment find the relevant article but it has been published on the forum some time in the past by Carana, I believe.

Mr Amaral could have requested permission from the magistrates to revoke the secrecy law ... he did not ... and that was the genesis of the McCann media campaign.
They did what they knew the authorities should have been doing but were not.

The entrenched views regarding the McCanns have emanated from the many headed hydra spawned by one individual and proves the effectiveness of his campaign against the McCanns ... I have given another example of this phenomenon regarding the experience of a Belfast couple and calpol for their child.

Our differing opinions probably stem from many things ... but the way things are shaping up I think we may well be heading to the place where a disinterested view may settle things.

We are where we are because of a book which if the author had wished to express his freedom of expression could imo have achieved that without riding roughshod over the rights of others.
Which leads one to wonder.

Do you think it is doubtful if the McCanns are allowed the right to a fair hearing in Portugal?  Bearing in mind it is against the Portuguese Constitution (article 15, I think).  If so that would be a sorry state of affairs.

[Brietta]

Some UK papers get the facts wrong about that Brietta.
For factual accounts, without ridiculous spin and lies to discredit the excellent portuguese police, I suggest you consult TVI, or Publico, english translations of both are at http://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2014/06/the-case-of-irish-baby-girl.html

Thank you but no thank you, Pegasus.

There is a full discussion on the forum about this and photographs which prove the absurdity of the claim that the little girl was thrown from a balcony into a pool.