Author Topic: What % of parents (or other caregivers) would leave Madeliene (and twins)..  (Read 8053 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

I would think it has... Basic policing

Then why ask?  And how do you know what I am alluding to?  The police make errors and oversights; they are after all human.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline misty

Oh yes I recall this case now but again its circumstances colliding ie Hughes in the vicinity and spying on the children listening to the conversation about spending a night in the tent.  Its the combi of an opportunity presenting and a vulnerable young child but the difference here is that Hughes was caught and convicted.  Also he was seen lurking and identified.  He did not have time to prepare it was that night or never. 

Well I don't know the set-up here but anyone who wanted to abduct a child from such an environment would need to enter the tent perhaps not knowing exactly who was inside including any dogs and then the child would have to be assaulted/murdered then and there and/or spirited away elsewhere which may or may not have presented difficulties.  And from what you're saying no child was actually assaulted, murdered or disappeared?

The situation with MM was far lower risk and the way in which the children were left night after night allowed the perps to plan ahead.

Hughes was convicted on the basis of certain eye-witness evidence. There was no forensic evidence linking him to Sophie, although the crime happened at a time when DNA harvesting & identification was far less sophisticated than today's methods. He did take a massive risk taking a child from a tent in which 2 other children were also sleeping.
Most petty burglaries require only basic planning & opportunity. Breaking & entering 5A was no different imo. There were no dogs, no nosey neighbours, security cameras or alarms to be bypassed and the only physical patrols were the sporadic checks by the Tapas Group. However, I don't believe Madeleine's alleged abduction was entirely opportunistic - I believe she was the target(reason as yet unknown), a plan was quickly formed & executed. It didn't necessarily boil down to knowledge of the children being left alone each night, bearing in mind that almost all the lurkers were seen during daytime hours; the absence of adult supervision just made the job less risky.

Offline ShiningInLuz

Could cadaver dogs be useful in helping Holly find this said person?

In a word, no.
What's up, old man?

Offline Mr Gray

Then why ask?  And how do you know what I am alluding to?  The police make errors and oversights; they are after all human.

Everything you are posting is pure speculation...when there's a vacuum you can put anything in...
You don't seem to have much faith in the police and think the armchair detectives here can do better... I think that's a totally ridiculous idea

Offline ShiningInLuz

Thanks.  I think I might have listened to it; is it the one presented by I think Jeremy Vine?  Anyway I'll listen again and see if it aligns with my theory and suspects.

Richard Bilton.

He has followed the case from early days.  Make up your own mind about him.
What's up, old man?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Everything you are posting is pure speculation...when there's a vacuum you can put anything in...
You don't seem to have much faith in the police and think the armchair detectives here can do better... I think that's a totally ridiculous idea

Where have I said I don't have much faith in the police?  Where have I said armchair detectives here can do better?

Where is the speculation in the following:

- No adult supervision
- No listening service
- No baby monitor
- Unlocked patio doors
- Parents leaving at same time every night for same destination and re-entering and exiting the patio doors  (which can't be locked from outside) at sort of regular intervals several times a night.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Mr Gray

Well because it isn't like searching for a needle in a haystack imo.  The key to solving the case imo is to identify who knew

- No adult supervision
- No listening service
- No baby monitor
- Unlocked patio doors
- Parents leaving at same time every night for same destination and re-entering and exiting the patio doors  (which can't be locked from outside) at sort of regular intervals several times a night.

Put all such individuals under the microscope along with any testimonies provided to date.

The speculation is that this is the key to solving the case..
The other point us we may not know all the people who satisfy these conditions...

Offline Holly Goodhead

The speculation is that this is the key to solving the case..

No it isn't speculation.  The following docu featuring experts focuses on entry/exit points and former police officer Ian Horrocks does the same:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khP0dEsZaug

https://www.bgpglobalservices.com/happened-madeleine-mccann-2/

The other point us we may not know all the people who satisfy these conditions...

I believe it is possible to identify every one and put them under the microscope. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Mr Gray

No it isn't speculation.  The following docu featuring experts focuses on entry/exit points and former police officer Ian Horrocks does the same:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khP0dEsZaug

https://www.bgpglobalservices.com/happened-madeleine-mccann-2/

I believe it is possible to identify every one and put them under the microscope.

You said it is "The key"...that is not a fact.. Speculation
You say it's possible to identify all those who meet your criteria... Not a fact.. More speculation

Offline Holly Goodhead

Hughes was convicted on the basis of certain eye-witness evidence. There was no forensic evidence linking him to Sophie, although the crime happened at a time when DNA harvesting & identification was far less sophisticated than today's methods. He did take a massive risk taking a child from a tent in which 2 other children were also sleeping.
Most petty burglaries require only basic planning & opportunity. Breaking & entering 5A was no different imo. There were no dogs, no nosey neighbours, security cameras or alarms to be bypassed and the only physical patrols were the sporadic checks by the Tapas Group. However, I don't believe Madeleine's alleged abduction was entirely opportunistic - I believe she was the target(reason as yet unknown), a plan was quickly formed & executed. It didn't necessarily boil down to knowledge of the children being left alone each night, bearing in mind that almost all the lurkers were seen during daytime hours; the absence of adult supervision just made the job less risky.

I thought he confessed to 3 individuals too including his father?

Petty burglary is surely a different crime to that of child abduction?  No one need to break into 5A since it was unlocked?  But others were sitting out on balconies and could view what was going on both in terms of planning any abduction and witnessing any abduction?

Is there any evidence the daytime 'lurkers' were involved?

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

You said it is "The key"...that is not a fact.. Speculation
You say it's possible to identify all those who meet your criteria... Not a fact.. More speculation

No I did not say it is "The Key".  I said "The key to solving the case imo is to identify who knew"

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10893.msg546207#msg546207

12 million has been spent on the case by SY alone and you want me to believe that its beyond the authorities to trace everyone who was able to observe the McCann movements? 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Mr Gray

No I did not say it is "The Key".  I said "The key to solving the case imo is to identify who knew"

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10893.msg546207#msg546207

12 million has been spent on the case by SY alone and you want me to believe that its beyond the authorities to trace everyone who was able to observe the McCann movements?

Of course it's not possible to trace everyone who observed the mccanns...

Offline Holly Goodhead

Of course it's not possible to trace everyone who observed the mccanns...

I mean observing the McCanns exiting for tapas at circa 8.30pm and the 30 mins checks thereafter all via the patio doors which can't be locked from outside so by definition unlocked?  Only a finite number of people could observe this night after night.  What difficulties do you foresee in identifying those individuals?
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Mr Gray

I mean observing the McCanns exiting for tapas at circa 8.30pm and the 30 mins checks thereafter all via the patio doors which can't be locked from outside so by definition unlocked?  Only a finite number of people could observe this night after night.  What difficulties do you foresee in identifying those individuals?

How many nights did they observe... Where did they observe from... Smithman is still unidentified...which shows it's not as easy as you think

Offline Billy Whizz Fan Club

Everything you are posting is pure speculation...when there's a vacuum you can put anything in...
You don't seem to have much faith in the police and think the armchair detectives here can do better... I think that's a totally ridiculous idea
Says the person who believes suspects and witnesses should be free to choose who records their statements and free to choose which body investigates a suspected crime!!