Video: Uncle reveals how Joana Cipriano was murdered and later fed to the pigs.

[misty]

Without doubt the child died because she would not cooperate with her abductor and trafficker. Joana was beyond the age whereby she could be removed from her family and placed with another family and not realise what was happening to her.

I'm not quite following that scenario, John. Joana was sent to the shops but apparently never returned. How many traffickers kill a person who refuses to cooperate, especially a child?
I'd really like to know why the locum priest was never questioned.

[Carana]

I'm not quite following that scenario, John. Joana was sent to the shops but apparently never returned. How many traffickers kill a person who refuses to cooperate, especially a child?
I'd really like to know why the locum priest was never questioned.

Locum priest, Misty?

I can't remember anything about him offhand, although it does ring a vague bell.

[misty]

Locum priest, Misty?

I can't remember anything about him offhand, although it does ring a vague bell.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=3031.msg109726#msg109726

Last few paragraphs. Usually when a Priest is away from the parish a locum is seconded.

[Angelo222]

I'm not quite following that scenario, John. Joana was sent to the shops but apparently never returned. How many traffickers kill a person who refuses to cooperate, especially a child?
I'd really like to know why the locum priest was never questioned.

Never returned?

She was seen returning by a neighbour, her shoes were found in the house and both her mother and uncle have admitted she returned.

[Carana]

Never returned?

She was seen returning by a neighbour, her shoes were found in the house and both her mother and uncle have admitted she returned.

- Someone on a balcony in the village apparently saw her heading towards home.

- No one knows for sure what shoes she was wearing when she went to the shops. The only statement that I've found to the effect that her shoes (whatever those were) were in the house was by someone who didn't live there. No one asked how the witness could have known which shoes she was wearing at the time, nor even how many pairs she had.

- Re Leonor and João "admitting" that, there is no other "evidence" aside from their interrogations under less than limpid circumstances.

[Angelo222]

- Someone on a balcony in the village apparently saw her heading towards home.

- No one knows for sure what shoes she was wearing when she went to the shops. The only statement that I've found to the effect that her shoes (whatever those were) were in the house was by someone who didn't live there. No one asked how the witness could have known which shoes she was wearing at the time, nor even how many pairs she had.

- Re Leonor and João "admitting" that, there is no other "evidence" aside from their interrogations under less than limpid circumstances.

Why on earth would Joana's mother and uncle admit she came home if she hadn't?  Don't you see the irony?

[Carana]

Why on earth would Joana's mother and uncle admit she came home if she hadn't?  Don't you see the irony?

How on earth could they have supposedly been busy having incestuous sex / not given the shopping change back resulting in non-existent traces of her blood and other traces of her demise on walls and in the fridge if she hadn't?

[John]

How on earth could they have supposedly been busy having incestuous sex / not given the shopping change back resulting in non-existent traces of her blood and other traces of her demise on walls and in the fridge if she hadn't?

Minute traces of human blood were found on the door jamb even though an attempt had been made to remove them using bleach.  The uncle admitted this in his video testimony.

[Carana]

Minute traces of human blood were found on the door jamb even though an attempt had been made to remove them using bleach.  The uncle admitted this in his video testimony.

What door jamb?

Where did this bleach idea come from?

A spatter analysis would have revealed obvious cleaning attempts. Where's the evidence of this?

A black torch would have revealed not only blood but any biological trace... including sweat. In a household with 3 children and 4 adults, the odd speck of blood is hardly unusual, anyway, whoever it belonged to.

And they only got around to even waving a torch around 18 days later while everyone else continued to live there, plus the visit of other family members and friends. Without adequate forensic analysis, it's meaningless.

[misty]

Minute traces of human blood were found on the door jamb even though an attempt had been made to remove them using bleach.  The uncle admitted this in his video testimony.

Did Joao explain in that video just how he transported Joana's dismembered remains back to the house to store in the freezer?

[John]

Did Joao explain in that video just how he transported Joana's dismembered remains back to the house to store in the freezer?

Yes

[John]

What door jamb?

Where did this bleach idea come from?

A spatter analysis would have revealed obvious cleaning attempts. Where's the evidence of this?

A black torch would have revealed not only blood but any biological trace... including sweat. In a household with 3 children and 4 adults, the odd speck of blood is hardly unusual, anyway, whoever it belonged to.

And they only got around to even waving a torch around 18 days later while everyone else continued to live there, plus the visit of other family members and friends. Without adequate forensic analysis, it's meaningless.

It's all there in the very comprehensive Supreme Court Report documents but to help you...

According to João Cipriano the assault occurred in the kitchen of the family home.

Leonor Cipriano went out and purchased cleaning materials after the disappearance was reported.  Residue from these material was found in various locations including the kitchen wall and door frame.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

[Carana]

It's all there in the very comprehensive Supreme Court Report documents but to help you...

According to João Cipriano the assault occurred in the kitchen of the family home.

Leonor Cipriano went out and purchased cleaning materials after the disappearance was reported.  Residue from these material was found in various locations including the kitchen wall and door frame.

http://www.dgsi.pt/jstj.nsf/954f0ce6ad9dd8b980256b5f003fa814/bfaf1cea93ab75fb8025716200388d89?OpenDocument&Highlight=0,cipriano

That's kind of you, John.

I've been through it more than once. Could you point me to a specific part of what you're referring to?

[misty]

Yes

Do you recall what he said please, as the video link no longer works?

[sadie]

- Someone on a balcony in the village apparently saw her heading towards home.

- No one knows for sure what shoes she was wearing when she went to the shops. The only statement that I've found to the effect that her shoes (whatever those were) were in the house was by someone who didn't live there. No one asked how the witness could have known which shoes she was wearing at the time, nor even how many pairs she had.

- Re Leonor and João "admitting" that, there is no other "evidence" aside from their interrogations under less than limpid circumstances.

My memory is that someone on a balcony saw Joana climb the steps up to the village church.  There is a plaza in front of the church with three sets of steps up.  The main ones are the steps on the front (eastern side) and these are the steps that Joana is likely to have climbed because they are on her route back from the shop.

I have been in that church, two interesting things inside, for me at least. 
But more interesting to me was the fact that on the same plaza is an infant / ?junior school. 

Was that Joanas school, at a younger age and maybe currently ?   For GE users it has a blue roof, a small playground and is tucked in the northern corner of the plaza...

...  and there is a semi hidden pathway between the church and the school.  No one over looks that pathway, it is in a very quiet place and the middle part is hidden.

Did Joana vanish there?


Or did someone with access to the playground invite Joana to go in and play on the swings or whatever was there at the time?   I remember big toys such as swings, but the current GE street scene images are different to what I saw in 2010.   Or maybe it was on my second visit a couple of years later?

Was Joana abducted from that hidden pathway or maybe from the swings?  Was she with someone that she trusted?   No houses overlook that pathway, nor parts of the playground.  No reason to go there after dark, so it is very quiet.  But hidden (non overlooked) parking is immediately adjacent.

   I would love to know who the locum priest was.  Also who the teacher at the infants school was?   

Anyone know ?   I wonder if they have ben looked at?

Mainly facts ... but anything else is from my querying mind, or is in my opinion