UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: Mr Gray on February 14, 2023, 05:58:05 PM
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I wonder how many posters are prepared to answer this question.
Do you think CB guilty beyond reasonable doubt of the rape of DM
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I don't know whether he was or not, but he was found guilty, so that's good enough for me until proved otherwise.
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I wonder how many posters are prepared to answer this question.
Do you think CB guilty beyond reasonable doubt of the rape of DM
The prosecution convinced the judges, that's all that matters.What convinces you BARD that CB killed Madeleine.
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The prosecution convinced the judges, that's all that matters.What convinces you BARD that CB killed Madeleine.
I think it's highly likely but won't be convinced until the evidence is made public. I really can't see hi making that claim on behalf of the BKA unless it's true..we'll have to wait and see
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I think it's highly likely but won't be convinced until the evidence is made public. I really can't see hi making that claim on behalf of the BKA unless it's true..we'll have to wait and see
You're going to be waiting a long time.
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In the absence of knowing what the evidence against him is, I have an open mind as to his guilt. If the evidence is of sufficient quality to allow him to be charged and brought to trial regarding offences against Madeleine McCann, a fair trial will satisfy me whatever the outcome is.
My gut reaction as an internet sleuth is that he definitely has a case to answer. But he already has five cases to answer all for serious crimes before he reaches that stage regarding Madeleine.
Of note is the fact that the recent case of a serving police officer who committed murder was preceded by incidences of him indulging in indecent exposure.
Brueckner has been found guilty of such an offence involving a child and will stand trial when two other offences of that nature will be considered. 'Flashing' is seen as indication that the offender is capable of escalating to even more serious criminal offenses. It is right and proper that the law investigates that propensity.
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In the absence of knowing what the evidence against him is, I have an open mind as to his guilt. If the evidence is of sufficient quality to allow him to be charged and brought to trial regarding offences against Madeleine McCann, a fair trial will satisfy me whatever the outcome is.
My gut reaction as an internet sleuth is that he definitely has a case to answer. But he already has five cases to answer all for serious crimes before he reaches that stage regarding Madeleine.
Of note is the fact that the recent case of a serving police officer who committed murder was preceded by incidences of him indulging in indecent exposure.
Brueckner has been found guilty of such an offence involving a child and will stand trial when two other offences of that nature will be considered. 'Flashing' is seen as indication that the offender is capable of escalating to even more serious criminal offenses. It is right and proper that the law investigates that propensity.
Sorry - got sidetracked from the actual question asked in the Opening Post.
Yes - I believe the circumstantial evidence and the victim's testimony combined with what forensic evidence remained made for a strong conviction.
What did dismay me though was the paltry sentence given for a crime which was life changing for the victim.
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Please can someone tell me who DM is.
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Please can someone tell me who DM is.
The elderly American lady, now deceased.
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I wonder how many posters are prepared to answer this question.
Do you think CB guilty beyond reasonable doubt of the rape of DM
I think without having heard all the evidence for and against him it’s impossible to give a meaningful response to the question. One has to hope that the justice system worked as it is meant to and the correct verdict was reached.
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The elderly American lady, now deceased.
Thank You. Is that the one who was convicted in Germany for a crime committed in Portugal?
Sorry, I am losing the plot.
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Please can someone tell me who DM is.
DM is the lady who CB raped in Luz in 2005.
The PJ failed to bring him to justice despite finding a hair in her bed whos DNA matched him. The BKA with the help of Grange managed to bring him to justice.Well done BKA and Grange. If the PJ had done their job properly Maddie may well be still alive at home with her family
The reason I pose the question is that some sceptics are in so much denial in the McCann case that they don't accept his conviction. You will notice gunit has failed to give her opinion on the post..as I expected.
Well done to Jassi and Barrier for addressing it
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I believe in Innocent Until Proven Guilty. If this is the woman I think it is then No Contest. Done and dusted.
Personally, I can't see Brueckner getting out for a very long time.
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Thank You. Is that the one who was convicted in Germany for a crime committed in Portugal?
Sorry, I am losing the plot.
Obit... https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/pasadenastarnews/name/diana-menkes-obituary?id=6710839 (https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/pasadenastarnews/name/diana-menkes-obituary?id=6710839)
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The prosecution convinced the judges, that's all that matters.What convinces you BARD that CB killed Madeleine.
I think it's highly likely but won't be convinced until the evidence is made public. I really can't see hi making that claim on behalf of the BKA unless it's true..we'll have to wait and see
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DM is the lady who CB raped in Luz in 2005.
The PJ failed to bring him to justice despite finding a hair in her bed whos DNA matched him. The BKA with the help of Grange managed to bring him to justice.Well done BKA and Grange. If the PJ had done their job properly Maddie may well be still alive at home with her family
The reason I pose the question is that some sceptics are in so much denial in the McCann case that they don't accept his conviction. You will notice gunit has failed to give her opinion on the post..as I expected.
Well done to Jassi and Barrier for addressing it
Thank You also.
Yes, Madeleine might never have been taken, for more reasons than one, I could add. This was gross incompetence on the part of The PJ, if it as only that.
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Thank You also.
Yes, Madeleine might never have been taken, for more reasons than one, I could add. This was gross incompetence on the part of The PJ, if it as only that.
I agree. Madeleine might never have been taken. That is true. She might not have actually been abducted.
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Thank You also.
Yes, Madeleine might never have been taken, for more reasons than one, I could add. This was gross incompetence on the part of The PJ, if it as only that.
Not only that there has been some vile abuse towards her on the net from vile sceptics who claim she was neevr raped.....all started by Amaral
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Not only that there has been some vile abuse towards her on the net from vile sceptics who claim she was neevr raped.....all started by Amaral
Well she's dead anyway so I don't think it really matters.
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Not only that there has been some vile abuse towards her on the net from vile sceptics who claim she was neevr raped.....all started by Amaral
I remember well the insinuation by a member of this forum that she invited CB in to her home for some “company” and this is after he was found guilty of rape. Sceptics are predisposed to give CB the benefit of the doubt and to have sympathy for him, which tells us all we need to know about these people IMO.
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I remember well the insinuation by a member of this forum that she invited CB in to her home for some “company” and this is after he was found guilty of rape. Sceptics are predisposed to give CB the benefit of the doubt and to have sympathy for him, which tells us all we need to know about these people IMO.
She left her door unlocked. You can't blame Brueckner for that.
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I remember well the insinuation by a member of this forum that she invited CB in to her home for some “company” and this is after he was found guilty of rape. Sceptics are predisposed to give CB the benefit of the doubt and to have sympathy for him, which tells us all we need to know about these people IMO.
I knew the lady had enjoyed a wonderful life in which her final years had been blighted by Brueckner. She obviously loved Portugal having continued to live there for so many years after she was widowed. She was unable to stay there as a result of Brueckner's actions.
The BKA got justice for her in the end; sending investigators to take her evidence in the USA because she was unable to attend the trial in person.
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Please can someone tell me who DM is.
Diana Menkes.
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Diana Menkes.
Thanks.
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So what have we got? A couple of Drug Convictions, a couple of Child Sexual Abuse Convictions and a Rape Conviction. All of which Brueckner was obviously Guilty.
I am trying hard not to allow this to affect my judgement, although it is difficult. Brueckner is a seriously not nice man and everything has to start somewhere.
There is an interesting lack of comments from Sceptics. But then who expected anything else?
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So what have we got? A couple of Drug Convictions, a couple of Child Sexual Abuse Convictions and a Rape Conviction. All of which Brueckner was obviously Guilty.
I am trying hard not to allow this to affect my judgement, although it is difficult. Brueckner is a seriously not nice man and everything has to start somewhere.
There is an interesting lack of comments from Sceptics. But then who expected anything else?
I have commented. I said Diane M might not have been raped, if only she'd just locked her door. But, apparently, fact based observations like that aren't very popular.
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So what have we got? A couple of Drug Convictions, a couple of Child Sexual Abuse Convictions and a Rape Conviction. All of which Brueckner was obviously Guilty.
I am trying hard not to allow this to affect my judgement, although it is difficult. Brueckner is a seriously not nice man and everything has to start somewhere.
There is an interesting lack of comments from Sceptics. But then who expected anything else?
Brueckner is very definitely not a nice guy. His criminal profile is almost perfect for a perpetrator of whatever befell Madeleine McCann. But none of that proves his guilt - the evidence will do that or not, if he is brought to trial on the strength of it.
I think he has been adept at covering his tracks but I think he chose the right place to get away with it for so long.
Hindsight is an exact science but my impression is that the Portuguese police were not interested given the fact that Brueckner's recent rape conviction and recent charges laid against him were historic, were investigated perfunctorily before being abandoned.
If the BKA had not been investigating Madeleine's case as a result of information received the Praia da Luz rape would never have been solved. It is sheer luck that it was solved because the remaining evidence had never been forensically tested. That one tiny piece survived, is just sheer chance.
SNIP
The 2005 rape case inquiry was abandoned five months after the horrific attack, while neither a red T-shirt stuffed in the victim's mouth nor a nylon rope used to tie her hands together were DNA tested, according to The Sun.
Official documents show Carlos Farinha, then Director of the Judicial Police's Forensic Science Laboratory, wrote in a November 2009 letter: 'We have learned by telephone that the examination is no longer necessary. We are therefore cancelling the tests and returning the material sent to us for analysis.'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8477199/Police-failed-DNA-test-evidence-led-capture-Maddies-prime-suspect.html
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I have commented. I said Diane M might not have been raped, if only she'd just locked her door. But, apparently, fact based observations like that aren't very popular.
You require a cite for the unlocked door - irrespective of the fact that Brueckner had invaded her space complete with his rape kit to carry out the premeditated and vicious assault on her.
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You require a cite for the unlocked door - irrespective of the fact that Brueckner had invaded her space complete with his rape kit to carry out the premeditated and vicious assault on her.
Victim Blaming is always a good one for Sceptics.
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Victim Blaming is always a good one for Sceptics.
Even victims have to take responsibility for their own personal security.
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Brueckner is very definitely not a nice guy. His criminal profile is almost perfect for a perpetrator of whatever befell Madeleine McCann. But none of that proves his guilt - the evidence will do that or not, if he is brought to trial on the strength of it.
I think he has been adept at covering his tracks but I think he chose the right place to get away with it for so long.
Hindsight is an exact science but my impression is that the Portuguese police were not interested given the fact that Brueckner's recent rape conviction and recent charges laid against him were historic, were investigated perfunctorily before being abandoned.
If the BKA had not been investigating Madeleine's case as a result of information received the Praia da Luz rape would never have been solved. It is sheer luck that it was solved because the remaining evidence had never been forensically tested. That one tiny piece survived, is just sheer chance.
SNIP
The 2005 rape case inquiry was abandoned five months after the horrific attack, while neither a red T-shirt stuffed in the victim's mouth nor a nylon rope used to tie her hands together were DNA tested, according to The Sun.
Official documents show Carlos Farinha, then Director of the Judicial Police's Forensic Science Laboratory, wrote in a November 2009 letter: 'We have learned by telephone that the examination is no longer necessary. We are therefore cancelling the tests and returning the material sent to us for analysis.'
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8477199/Police-failed-DNA-test-evidence-led-capture-Maddies-prime-suspect.html
Bruckner is probably just another patsy being used by the authorities to give justification to their existence. In my opinion they have found absolutely nothing so far to connect any of the many suspects to Maddie. Whoever took her away from outside no 5a really did manage a Houdini event.
PS I do agree Bruckner is one nasty piece of shit work.
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Even victims have to take responsibility for their own personal security.
How would you suggest that Madeleine could have done that?
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Even victims have to take responsibility for their own personal security.
The villa was walled.
At the time the Algarve was subject to a high level of burglaries. She was a resident of twenty years standing and would very likely have known about this. She lived alone.
If her door was unlocked as has been alleged ~ a cite is required particularly as one has been requested. If she is to be blamed for the torture and rape she was subjected to, at the very least it should be proven that her door was unlocked.
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Even victims have to take responsibility for their own personal security.
Oh right, so DM should have locked herself in her house at all times and never ventured onto the patio or the garden in case she was raped. Right you are then. Next you’ll be telling us all women should stay home cooking and cleaning and only go out when accompanied by a male chaperone.
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The villa was walled.
At the time the Algarve was subject to a high level of burglaries. She was a resident of twenty years standing and would very likely have known about this. She lived alone.
If her door was unlocked as has been alleged ~ a cite is required particularly as one has been requested. If she is to be blamed for the torture and rape she was subjected to, at the very least it should be proven that her door was unlocked.
I recall reading that she was on her patio when CB trespassed onto her premises but I can’t find the cite right now.
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Bruckner is probably just another patsy being used by the authorities to give justification to their existence. In my opinion they have found absolutely nothing so far to connect any of the many suspects to Maddie. Whoever took her away from outside no 5a really did manage a Houdini event.
PS I do agree Bruckner is one nasty piece of shit work.
Who are all these "many suspects"? There are none since the original and incompetently chosen patsies of 2007/08 any one of who would have done with Kate being the one preferred.
Brueckner is the only official suspect since then.
Individuals have been investigated over the years and have been eliminated from the enquiry for the same reason the three 77/78 arguidos were. Lack of evidence.
Brueckner has been investigated and has not been eliminated from the inquiry. They are still investigating him.
The perseverance of the BKA in this matter is admirable. How different might it all have been if the PJ had shown the same persistence in 2007 and kept knocking at doors till he answered one.
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The villa was walled.
At the time the Algarve was subject to a high level of burglaries. She was a resident of twenty years standing and would very likely have known about this. She lived alone.
If her door was unlocked as has been alleged ~ a cite is required particularly as one has been requested. If she is to be blamed for the torture and rape she was subjected to, at the very least it should be proven that her door was unlocked.
I think I confused DM with HB. HB definitely did leave her door unlocked though. Which was rather stupid of her.
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Who are all these "many suspects"? There are none since the original and incompetently chosen patsies of 2007/08 any one of who would have done with Kate being the one preferred.
Brueckner is the only official suspect since then.
Individuals have been investigated over the years and have been eliminated from the enquiry for the same reason the three 77/78 arguidos were. Lack of evidence.
Brueckner has been investigated and has not been eliminated from the inquiry. They are still investigating him.
The perseverance of the BKA in this matter is admirable. How different might it all have been if the PJ had shown the same persistence in 2007 and kept knocking at doors till he answered one.
So, he answers the door, then what? He could still have refused to say anything to the police , & they had no evidence against him, or good reason to suspect him, in particular, of having abducted Maddie. He didn't allegedly confess to Busching until 2008, you see.
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I recall reading that she was on her patio when CB trespassed onto her premises but I can’t find the cite right now.
I think she had to all intents and purposes 'retired' for the night.
SNIP
On the night of the attack, in early September 2005, she had been watching television news coverage of Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.
At around 10.30pm she went into her office to compose some emails when she was grabbed from behind, dragged up several stairs to her bedroom and tied up with a rope and raped.
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/scottish-daily-mail/20200605/281578062888282
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Oh right, so DM should have locked herself in her house at all times and never ventured onto the patio or the garden in case she was raped. Right you are then. Next you’ll be telling us all women should stay home cooking and cleaning and only go out when accompanied by a male chaperone.
What's the problem with that? There are millions of Muslim women who live by those rules.
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Victim Blaming is always a good one for Sceptics.
In order to have decent debate someone has to have a contrary opinion. Victims of crime get all the sympathy & never any condemnation. I don't think that s fair or balanced. It would be incredibly stale & boring if we all virtue signalled, so someone has to victim blame I'm afraid. There's no one willing to do it around here, so I have no choice but to fill that vacancy. Regardless of how many warning points I may obtain.
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I think she had to all intents and purposes 'retired' for the night.
SNIP
On the night of the attack, in early September 2005, she had been watching television news coverage of Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.
At around 10.30pm she went into her office to compose some emails when she was grabbed from behind, dragged up several stairs to her bedroom and tied up with a rope and raped.
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/scottish-daily-mail/20200605/281578062888282
My mistake, thanks for clarifying . He entered via the patio door apparently.
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How would you suggest that Madeleine could have done that?
Parents are responsible for keeping their children safe, of course.
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Whoops. We are wandering Off Topic again.
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Whoops. We are wandering Off Topic again.
Do you think CB is guilty.
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Bruckner is probably just another patsy being used by the authorities to give justification to their existence. In my opinion they have found absolutely nothing so far to connect any of the many suspects to Maddie. Whoever took her away from outside no 5a really did manage a Houdini event.
PS I do agree Bruckner is one nasty piece of shit work.
There's a massive mistake in your logic..BKA do not have to justify their existence. They've already convicted CB for rape when the idiot amaral said there was no rape. ..what an absolute fool he is
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Bruckner is probably just another patsy being used by the authorities to give justification to their existence. In my opinion they have found absolutely nothing so far to connect any of the many suspects to Maddie. Whoever took her away from outside no 5a really did manage a Houdini event.
PS I do agree Bruckner is one nasty piece of shit work.
Whoever took her away from outside no.5a
You really do keep pushing the idea that Masdeleine found her own way outside, don't you Angelo ? You have pushed it several times when there is NOTHING to indicate it.
Three National police forces seem to now be agreed that it was a full abduction from 5a
I wonder why you want everyone to believe that Madeleine was abducted from outside. Nothing to show it.
If Madeleine is found or returned, I can see the abductor claiming that he rescued this little girl, (what a great guy he is !) whilst he actually arranged her abduction
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Do you think CB is guilty.
I was quite confident you wouldn’t get an answer to your question!
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I was quite confident you wouldn’t get an answer to your question!
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Must say I'm impressed with Jassi and Barrier who both say they accept the verdict if the courts. I know quite a lot about the case and the evidence is overwhelming
Part of the evidence may well help to nail CB for the MM case and conviction in the other three rape cases may well provide the absolute proof of CBs involvement.
He has proof Maddie is dead...murdered by a paedophile..and evidence that convinced him and the BKA that CB is the perp. Enough to take the case to court but not enough to be sure of a conviction. If CB is found guilty in the three other rape cases he will have enough to secure a conviction 100% guaranteed..there's a link in all 4 rape cases that will prove CB murdered Madeleine McCann,..,...poor poor girl..evil evil monster
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Must say I'm impressed with Jassi and Barrier who both say they accept the verdict if the courts. I know quite a lot about the case and the evidence is overwhelming
Part of the evidence may well help to nail CB for the MM case and conviction in the other three rape cases may well provide the absolute proof of CBs involvement.
He has proof Maddie is dead...murdered by a paedophile..and evidence that convinced him and the BKA that CB is the perp. Enough to take the case to court but not enough to be sure of a conviction. If CB is found guilty in the three other rape cases he will have enough to secure a conviction 100% guaranteed..there's a link in all 4 rape cases that will prove CB murdered Madeleine McCann,..,...poor poor girl..evil evil monster
He say's, Wolters say's he has proof, Mr Gray. But he hasn't shared the concrete evidence with either the MET or Madeleine's parents. Don't you find that a little odd?
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I was quite confident you wouldn’t get an answer to your question!
So was I. But at least we are back On Topic.
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He say's, Wolters say's he has proof, Mr Gray. But he hasn't shared the concrete evidence with either the MET or Madeleine's parents. Don't you find that a little odd?
Not in the slightest and if you'd listened to everything he's said with an open mind ..you wouldn't either
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53 replies but not a word from gunit.That tells us all we need to know
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Whoever took her away from outside no.5a
You really do keep pushing the idea that Masdeleine found her own way outside, don't you Angelo ? You have pushed it several times when there is NOTHING to indicate it.
Three National police forces seem to now be agreed that it was a full abduction from 5a
I wonder why you want everyone to believe that Madeleine was abducted from outside. Nothing to show it.
If Madeleine is found or returned, I can see the abductor claiming that he rescued this little girl, (what a great guy he is !) whilst he actually arranged her abduction
It all depends on the quality of the evidence which as in the DM rape must have been depleted or destroyed by the time Brueckner stood trial and for which due process found him guilty.
Despite no DNA tests being carried out and the instruction to the forensics lab in 2009 that items from his rape kit were no longer required to be kept.
There is nothing to suggest that Madeleine woke and wandered.
The main evidence for which would have been her fingerprints around an exit point. There were none.
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53 replies but not a word from gunit.That tells us all we need to know
Mr Gray shares his wisdom with us lesser mortals again! Including predictions!
Is there any point in engaging with you? I think I'll just wait and see.
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Mr Gray shares his wisdom with us lesser mortals again! Including predictions!
Is there any point in engaging with you? I think I'll just wait and see.
You have not addressed the question asked by Mr Gray in his opening post ~
"Do you think CB guilty beyond reasonable doubt of the rape of DM"
An answer to which would actually be On Topic.
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Not in the slightest and if you'd listened to everything he's said with an open mind ..you wouldn't either
Yes, you claim there's a link between the rape cases & Madeleine's murder. Wolters has mentioned no such thing though. I asked you months ago to share a link to Wolters mentioning this link, but you never shared one, & that's because there isn't any link between the cases.
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Mr Gray shares his wisdom with us lesser mortals again! Including predictions!
Is there any point in engaging with you? I think I'll just wait and see.
Wait and see what? CB has already been found guilty. The question is - do you think he is guilty of raping the old lady or not - no amount of waiting and seeing is going to alter that verdict so you're quite safe to have an opinion now.
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Mr Gray shares his wisdom with us lesser mortals again! Including predictions!
Is there any point in engaging with you? I think I'll just wait and see.
Yes, there's no point engaging because he's convinced he's right about everything & anyone who disagrees is an idiot. Let's see how he gets on sharing a Wolters quote of the alleged link between the rapes & Madeleine's murder.
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Mr Gray seems to value my opinion as he keeps mentioning my name. I suppose my answer, like yours, is that Brueckner was found guilty by due process.
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Mr Gray seems to value my opinion as he keeps mentioning my name. I suppose my answer, like yours, is that Brueckner was found guilty by due process.
Fair enough. As with most of the cases discussed in this forum, without the full facts of the investigation and court transcripts it's difficult to have a firm opinion on the guilt or otherwise of anyone. One either trusts the process or one doesn't. I trust that the Germans convicted the right man in this case. I trust that they are on the right track with regard the other rape case also. My trust may be misplaced, but from what I've read I have no reason to believe it is.
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Bruckner is probably just another patsy being used by the authorities to give justification to their existence. In my opinion they have found absolutely nothing so far to connect any of the many suspects to Maddie. Whoever took her away from outside no 5a really did manage a Houdini event.
PS I do agree Bruckner is one nasty piece of shit work.
Why, Angelo, do you keep pushing that Madeleine being taken away frpm outside 5A ? Three different National police forces appear to agree that she was abducted from within. Do you think that you know better than their forensic experts ?
I wonder if Madeleine is found / returned the plea will be that "she was wandering around outside and was rescued by X, Y or Z (the perp), when it was just dis / misiformation". Portuguese courts seem to believe disinformation.
Giving the impression " What a good guy XYZ is ... ne rescued Madeleine! And how awful The Mccanns are !" Would look good for the perp in a court case, wouldn't it ?
Why do you keep pushing it, Angelo, when there is NOTHING to indicate that Madeleine left under her own steam and in fact there are a number of pointers, well discussed before , that she did not do that. ?
For instance had she left on her own volition, she would have had to open a window or a door. Where are the fingerprints ? There were none.
Did you realise that you are potentially helping the perps?
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Mr Gray seems to value my opinion as he keeps mentioning my name. I suppose my answer, like yours, is that Brueckner was found guilty by due process.
That I think is as good a carefully worded response as we are ever going to get.
Brueckner was investigated on suspicion of theft, torture and rape.
Brueckner was charged.
Brueckner was put on trial.
Brueckner was found guilty.
Brueckner appealed his conviction and if memory serves me well, not pleading innocence but on a procedural issue.
Brueckner's conviction was upheld.
All of which arose as a direct result of the Germans following through and checking up on information received during their inquiry into Madeleine McCann's disappearance.
A study of cold cases verified the information given to them when they found information on DM's rape.
It was all recorded on file.
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Mr Gray seems to value my opinion as he keeps mentioning my name. I suppose my answer, like yours, is that Brueckner was found guilty by due process.
I don't value your opinion at all...I like to expose people for what they are.
You haven't answered the question as I expected because you don't have the courage of your convictions.
You haven't answered the question....most of us know exactly why
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That I think is as good a carefully worded response as we are ever going to get.
Brueckner was investigated on suspicion of theft, torture and rape.
Brueckner was charged.
Brueckner was put on trial.
Brueckner was found guilty.
Brueckner appealed his conviction and if memory serves me well, not pleading innocence but on a procedural issue.
Brueckner's conviction was upheld.
All of which arose as a direct result of the Germans following through and checking up on information received during their inquiry into Madeleine McCann's disappearance.
A study of cold cases verified the information given to them when they found information on DM's rape.
It was all recorded on file.
The failure of gunit to answer the question is exactly as I expected. It really is a simple question
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I don't value your opinion at all...I like to expose people for what they are.
You haven't answered the question as I expected because you don't have the courage of your convictions.
You haven't answered the question....most of us know exactly why
As I suspected, you just want an argument, and are disappointed because I'm not interested in speculating about German justice. Just carry on speculating about my thoughts, it's very amusing. CB was convicted by the German courts; what else is there to say?
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As I suspected, you just want an argument, and are disappointed because I'm not interested in speculating about German justice. Just carry on speculating about my thoughts, it's very amusing. CB was convicted by the German courts; what else is there to say?
The title of this forum is miscarriage of justice,,,..,what that means is some don't accept a courts verdict. It's obvious you can't
give an opinion because you can't support it logically. I've looked at all the evidence and it's overwhelming. Some sceptics don't accept this..I'm sure you're one of them...the fact you won't answer supports this .
The evidence in her trial could well prove pivotal in the MM case..but you prefer pointless trivia
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The title of this forum is miscarriage of justice,,,..,what that means is some don't accept a courts verdict. It's obvious you can't
give an opinion because you can't support it logically. I've looked at all the evidence and it's overwhelming. Some sceptics don't accept this..I'm sure you're one of them...the fact you won't answer supports this .
The evidence in her trial could well prove pivotal in the MM case..but you prefer pointless trivia
What is the overwhelming evidence you refer to, I wonder?
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What is the overwhelming evidence you refer to, I wonder?
You give me your opinion as to his guilt and I'll explain...it is overwhelming
This is a debating platform
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What is the overwhelming evidence you refer to, I wonder?
Why is it you don't know about it..haven't you followed the case. It has a very important connection to the MM case and explains.why Wolters wants to try the other three cases first
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Amaral says there was no rape and his sceptic followers who think he's some kind of hero.. follow him like sheep..and before you say...no I don't hate him.,I just think he's completely out of his depth
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What is the overwhelming evidence you refer to, I wonder?
It's not statements from a couple of criminals and a hair that may well have been planted
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It's not statements from a couple of criminals and a hair that may well have been planted
I didn't ask what it wasn't, I asked what it was, but if you don't want to say that's fine.
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I didn't ask what it wasn't, I asked what it was, but if you don't want to say that's fine.
Do you understand how debate works. I ask a question..you answer.....then you ask a question. for some reason you refuse to answer a simple question......could you explain why that is. when weve sorted out why you cant answer a question but expect me to..we can move forward.
I will answer your question..i have no problem at all... but please have the courtesy if you expect answers from others that you answer theirs.
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I think I confused DM with HB. HB definitely did leave her door unlocked though. Which was rather stupid of her.
So if someone entered your home, bashed you over the head and robbed you, you would say 'ah well I did leave the door open so it's my fault'.
If you think that don't bother ringing the Police if it does happen to you.
This elderly woman was a victim.
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SY organise an appeal for information german TV. MS sees it and says he wants to talk to SY. A meeting is arranged
where MS gives information to SY implicating CB in the MM case. He also tells of seeing a video of the rape and torture of an elederly lady where CB removes his mask to reveal his identity.
SY ask the PJ to look at unsolved rape cases.
they find an unsolved rape case of an eldely lady in LUZ. She says he videod the rape. Her description of her ordeal matche taht described by MS in detail..a very detailed description. The description of her attacker matches cB.
the PJ have a hair from the victims bed..dna from this hair matches cb......
combined tahts overwhelming evidence yet sceptics cant bring themselves to accept the truth...gunit will noit aknowledge his guilt..Amaral says she was not raped...
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So if someone entered your home, bashed you over the head and robbed you, you would say 'ah well I did leave the door open so it's my fault'.
If you think that don't bother ringing the Police if it does happen to you.
This elderly woman was a victim.
Spam does think that - don't engage expecting a reasonable response.
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SY organise an appeal for information german TV. MS sees it and says he wants to talk to SY. A meeting is arranged
where MS gives information to SY implicating CB in the MM case. He also tells of seeing a video of the rape and torture of an elederly lady where CB removes his mask to reveal his identity.
SY ask the PJ to look at unsolved rape cases.
they find an unsolved rape case of an eldely lady in LUZ. She says he videod the rape. Her description of her ordeal matche taht described by MS in detail..a very detailed description. The description of her attacker matches cB.
the PJ have a hair from the victims bed..dna from this hair matches cb......
combined tahts overwhelming evidence yet sceptics cant bring themselves to accept the truth...gunit will noit aknowledge his guilt..Amaral says she was not raped...
There was mention of his name in the responses to the 2013 showing of Crimewatch in Germany, but I don't think anyone was named as coming forward with information?
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There was mention of his name in the responses to the 2013 showing of Crimewatch in Germany, but I don't think anyone was named as coming forward with information?
There was mention of his name in response to the abortive attempt to locate him in 2007. Nor was there any mention of trying to check out home invasion crimes. In particular the molestation of children in their beds and the horrific rape of DM in her home in very close proximity to the McCann apartment.
Snip
Amaral, 60, said: “I have been told by colleagues, who are retired like me, that they had come knocking on the door. That person was not at home.”
He said he was not aware if any more inquiries were made after the visit, which was made shortly after Madeleine vanished in Praia da Luz, aged three.
Amaral’s comments, in a TV interview on Portugal’s TVI, came after it emerged last week Brueckner told a judge he was a paedophile when he was in court in 2006, charged with petrol theft.
But officials in Portimao apparently failed to pass that on to the Policia Judiciaria – which Amaral was in charge of.
Lisbon-based Amaral said on TVI that police did not know Brueckner, 43, was a convicted paedophile.
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/daily-record/20200623/281956020044205
Seems opportunities were missed all round particularly in Portugal in 2007 by a force who had access to all the available information including the Praia da Luz rape two years previously and a couple of minutes distance away but who didn't co-ordinate it.
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There was mention of his name in the responses to the 2013 showing of Crimewatch in Germany, but I don't think anyone was named as coming forward with information?
Then there are massive gaps in your knowledge
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Then there are massive gaps in your knowledge
Well, as you haven't responded with an explanation of this MS responding to SY in 2013, we only have your word that he did.
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There was mention of his name in response to the abortive attempt to locate him in 2007. Nor was there any mention of trying to check out home invasion crimes. In particular the molestation of children in their beds and the horrific rape of DM in her home in very close proximity to the McCann apartment.
Snip
Amaral, 60, said: “I have been told by colleagues, who are retired like me, that they had come knocking on the door. That person was not at home.”
He said he was not aware if any more inquiries were made after the visit, which was made shortly after Madeleine vanished in Praia da Luz, aged three.
Amaral’s comments, in a TV interview on Portugal’s TVI, came after it emerged last week Brueckner told a judge he was a paedophile when he was in court in 2006, charged with petrol theft.
But officials in Portimao apparently failed to pass that on to the Policia Judiciaria – which Amaral was in charge of.
Lisbon-based Amaral said on TVI that police did not know Brueckner, 43, was a convicted paedophile.
https://www.pressreader.com/uk/daily-record/20200623/281956020044205
Seems opportunities were missed all round particularly in Portugal in 2007 by a force who had access to all the available information including the Praia da Luz rape two years previously and a couple of minutes distance away but who didn't co-ordinate it.
Thank you, but we were discussing someone Mr Gray referred to as 'MS'.
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Who is MS?
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Who is MS?
i
The only person I can think of is Manfred Seyferth.
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Well, as you haven't responded with an explanation of this MS responding to SY in 2013, we only have your word that he did.
Have a look at the title of the thread.... answer it...then we can continue. If you refuse to address the topic of the thread best you don't poston it again. You obviously have a problem answering a simple question
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Have a look at the title of the thread.... answer it...then we can continue. If you refuse to address the topic of the thread best you don't poston it again. You obviously have a problem answering a simple question
You should stop making unsupported claims.
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You should stop making unsupported claims.
Which claim is unsupported
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You should stop making unsupported claims.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence as I've shown..MS saw the video and described the rape to SY..the PJ found a rape that matched precisely..a hair matching CBs DNA had been found in the victim's bed..
Do you not agree that's overwhelming evidence
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Sometimes it's best if I say nothing. Hard though that is for me to do.
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CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence as I've shown..MS saw the video and described the rape to SY..the PJ found a rape that matched precisely..a hair matching CBs DNA had been found in the victim's bed..
Do you not agree that's overwhelming evidence
I'm not really interested in your spin. MS didn't respond to any appeals and, imo, you are exaggerating the other evidence also.
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I'm not really interested in your spin. MS didn't respond to any appeals and, imo, you are exaggerating the other evidence also.
In what way am I exaggerating the evidence..that's a falsa claim..totally false
Is this another question you refuse to answer
I have not exaggerated the evidence..your spouting sceptic junk. Fact.. explain what I've exaggerated or just confirm you're I'll informed
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In what way am I exaggerating the evidence..that's a falsa claim..totally false
Is this another question you refuse to answer
I have not exaggerated the evidence..your spouting sceptic junk. Fact.. explain what I've exaggerated or just confirm you're I'll informed
What appeal did MS respond to?
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What appeal did MS respond to?
the appeal I would have to check.........what evidence have I exaggerated...are you spouting sceptic junk...please deny or confirm.
the evidence ive quoted is spot on. MS gave specific details of the rape which matched the victims account...what exaggeration have I made.....
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the appeal I would have to check.........what evidence have I exaggerated...are you spouting sceptic junk...please deny or confirm.
the evidence ive quoted is spot on. MS gave specific details of the rape which matched the victims account...what exaggeration have I made.....
I think you should check details before you post things as facts, don't you?
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I think you should check details before you post things as facts, don't you?
I think you should post some facts instead of criticising others who do..so let's try.
MS claims to have watched a video of a rape of an elderly..he claims he found this video in CBs house in luz. He gave specific details of this rape..and from the details given the PJ identified the rape if DM..where her account matched that given by MS. Plus a hair recorded at the rape site matched the DNA of CB..
That's overwhelming evidence..do you agree or disagree
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I think you should post some facts instead of criticising others who do..so let's try.
MS claims to have watched a video of a rape of an elderly..he claims he found this video in CBs house in luz. He gave specific details of this rape..and from the details given the PJ identified the rape if DM..where her account matched that given by MS. Plus a hair recorded at the rape site matched the DNA of CB..
That's overwhelming evidence..do you agree or disagree
Well I'm not entirely convinced. I thinj I'd need to watch this video myself a few times, just to be sure that it happened.
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I think you should post some facts instead of criticising others who do..so let's try.
MS claims to have watched a video of a rape of an elderly..he claims he found this video in CBs house in luz. He gave specific details of this rape..and from the details given the PJ identified the rape if DM..where her account matched that given by MS. Plus a hair recorded at the rape site matched the DNA of CB..
That's overwhelming evidence..do you agree or disagree
It's you who wishes to discuss the rape case. It doesn't matter what evidence was used, CB was convicted. Why say MS came forward in response to an appeal by SY when that's not true? I see no point in discussing anything with someone who can't support his 'facts' with evidence.
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It's you who wishes to discuss the rape case. It doesn't matter what evidence was used, CB was convicted. Why say MS came forward in response to an appeal by SY when that's not true? I see no point in discussing anything with someone who can't support his 'facts' with evidence.
What a totally ridiculous and stupid post.
Of course it matters what evidence was presented .have you ever heard of a miscarriage of justice...if you haven't you shouldn't be posting on this forum.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence.. sceptics deny t his as you have done here claiming I exaggerated the evidence..yet YOU cannot support that claim.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence..no sceptic here including you has been able to counter that claim. Your attempt to was pathetic
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What a totally ridiculous and stupid post.
Of course it matters what evidence was presented .have you ever heard of a miscarriage of justice...if you haven't you shouldn't be posting on this forum.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence.. sceptics deny t his as you have done here claiming I exaggerated the evidence..yet YOU cannot support that claim.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence..no sceptic here including you has been able to counter that claim. Your attempt to was pathetic
There’s overwhelming evidence that smoking is bad for your health and that 6 million Jews died in the Holocaust but still there are people who are able to deny the evidence and say it proves nothing. Unfortunately you will never be able to get through to such people.
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Mayhap we can have a Miscarriage of Justice Thread if Brueckner gets convicted of, well, anything. As if we wouldn't.
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What a totally ridiculous and stupid post.
Of course it matters what evidence was presented .have you ever heard of a miscarriage of justice...if you haven't you shouldn't be posting on this forum.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence.. sceptics deny t his as you have done here claiming I exaggerated the evidence..yet YOU cannot support that claim.
CB was convicted on overwhelming evidence..no sceptic here including you has been able to counter that claim. Your attempt to was pathetic
I'm not interested in the evidence, but I am interested when it's misrepresented. When did MS contact SY following an appeal in Germany?
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I'm not interested in the evidence, but I am interested when it's misrepresented. When did MS contact SY following an appeal in Germany?
You're not interested in evidence? OK, well that explains a lot.
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You're not interested in evidence? OK, well that explains a lot.
To rephrase; I'm not interested in discussing the evidence presented in the rape case. It's over. If people want to discuss it, fine, but misrepresenting it isn't fine.
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I'm not interested in the evidence, but I am interested when it's misrepresented. When did MS contact SY following an appeal in Germany?
I admit I was wrong about MS contacting SY..I'll have another look at how his evidence came to light.
However I'm not wrong about the actual evidence in the case..MS described a rape he'd seen on a video he claimed sowed the rape if an elderly woman. His description of the details of the rape were given to the OJ who found an unsolved rape which matched the detailed description given by MS...a hair found in the victim's bed matched CBs DNA
Would you not agree that's overwhelming evidence..and proof beyond reasonable doubt of his guilt
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To rephrase; I'm not interested in discussing the evidence presented in the rape case. It's over. If people want to discuss it, fine, but misrepresenting it isn't fine.
Do not say I have misrepresented the evidence that is totally not true..if you can't show where I've misrepresented it you need to remove that accusation.
I my have been wrong about how it reached SY but I'm not wrong about the evidence...
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I admit I was wrong about MS contacting SY..I'll have another look at how his evidence came to light.
However I'm not wrong about the actual evidence in the case..MS described a rape he'd seen on a video he claimed sowed the rape if an elderly woman. His description of the details of the rape were given to the OJ who found an unsolved rape which matched the detailed description given by MS...a hair found in the victim's bed matched CBs DNA
Would you not agree that's overwhelming evidence..and proof beyond reasonable doubt of his guilt
It was Helge B who contacted SY in 2008.
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It was Helge B who contacted SY in 2008.
2017, I believe.
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To rephrase; I'm not interested in discussing the evidence presented in the rape case. It's over. If people want to discuss it, fine, but misrepresenting it isn't fine.
Discussion on this thread relates to the aggravated rape committed by Brueckner in 2005.
The victim was a 72 year old woman who filed a complaint with the GNR in Portugal at that time.
Brueckner was convicted of perpetrating the outrage by a German court in 2019/
The opening post quite simply asks members if they are in agreement with that conviction. In other words I think it asks if there was a miscarriage of justice.
Really quite simple without muddying the waters as you tend to do when presenting opinion. My opinion ;)
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2017, I believe.
You won't address the evidence because your confirmation bias is so strong you cannot accept the truth that the evidence in the trial was overwhelming.. Your ducking and diving in this thread shows how uncomfortable the truth makes you feel
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Discussion on this thread relates to the aggravated rape committed by Brueckner in 2005.
The victim was a 72 year old woman who filed a complaint with the GNR in Portugal at that time.
Brueckner was convicted of perpetrating the outrage by a German court in 2019/
The opening post quite simply asks members if they are in agreement with that conviction. In other words I think it asks if there was a miscarriage of justice.
Really quite simple without muddying the waters as you tend to do when presenting opinion. My opinion ;)
I was goaded into taking part and then an attempt was made to make me discuss the evidence. Wrongful information was quoted and I questioned it. Are members allowed to post opinion as fact now?
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2017, I believe.
Again in 2013.
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I was goaded into taking part and then an attempt was made to make me discuss the evidence. Wrongful information was quoted and I questioned it. Are members allowed to post opinion as fact now?
My opinion is that nobody on this forum can be "made to" do anything they do not wish to do. Coercion would be a rule breaker, I think.
Anyway ~ you are responding to my post which contains no "wrongful information". Funnily enough sceptics often used to deride my 'long winded' posts and cites in confirmation.
Glad you appear to concur in the necessity for which.
As I said in the post to which you responded ~
Discussion on this thread relates to the aggravated rape committed by Brueckner in 2005.
The victim was a 72 year old woman who filed a complaint with the GNR in Portugal at that time.
Brueckner was convicted of perpetrating the outrage by a German court in 2019/
The opening post quite simply asks members if they are in agreement with that conviction. In other words I think it asks if there was a miscarriage of justice.
Really quite simple without muddying the waters as you tend to do when presenting opinion. My opinion ;)
All of that is factual. Unless you know something to the contrary.
I have identified my opinion that you often muddy the waters.
So not really an opportunity to beat the rest of the world to starting WWIII just a chance to state if you are in agreement with the German court's guilty verdict on Brueckner based on evidence supplied by the GNR. Or do you think a miscarriage of justice occurred?
I pressured you for no response. You chose to, just as quite often you chose not to. I reiterate ~ no member can coerce another to do anything. It is all the choice of the individual member. If you feel the checks and balances are not being adhered to ~ you are perfectly placed to request the problem is looked at.
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Again in 2013.
Do you have a cite for that please?
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Do you have a cite for that please?
I don't know who the informant was but it is on record that Brueckner''s name was passed to the police in 2013.
Name of new Madeleine McCann suspect Christian Brueckner was passed to German police SEVEN years ago by an acquaintance who remembered him from Praia da Luiz
Brueckner's name was passed to police after e-fits were shown on German TV
The Euro News TV programme was watched by millions on October 2013
E-fits showed a ' German speaker' who was of 'vital importance' to the case
It is claimed detectives failed to act on the information passed on by a viewer
By IAN GALLAGHER and JAKE RYAN FOR THE MAIL ON SUNDAY
PUBLISHED: 22:39, 6 June 2020
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8395417/Name-new-Madeleine-McCann-suspect-Christian-Brueckner-passed-police-SEVEN-years-ago.html
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I was goaded into taking part and then an attempt was made to make me discuss the evidence. Wrongful information was quoted and I questioned it. Are members allowed to post opinion as fact now?
I've corrected that small irrelevant part which has no bearing on the facts in my post which were presented as evidence in court.
If you felt my posts were goading you should remove them but you can't because they weren't..so you're posting fact as fiction
You can't reply because you can't defend your opinion..lol. You make every excuse not to reply..he's as guilty as hell re the rape..there's no other explanation if you look at the evidence..none..proved by the fact you can't give one..lol
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Again in 2013.
His name did come up in 2013, but it's not known who named him. The German police looked into it but took no action against him.
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His name did come up in 2013, but it's not known who named him. The German police looked into it but took no action against him.
In my opinion it was Helge Büsching.
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I was goaded into taking part and then an attempt was made to make me discuss the evidence. Wrongful information was quoted and I questioned it. Are members allowed to post opinion as fact now?
It's your opinion you were goaded into taking part yet you've stated it as fact,...
Does that answer your question
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I was goaded into taking part and then an attempt was made to make me discuss the evidence. Wrongful information was quoted and I questioned it. Are members allowed to post opinion as fact now?
Members could always do what you continually do that is refuse to provide a cite and tell posters to do their own research
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i wonder why it has prove dso difficult for gunit to answer this simple question. it can only be taht she is not comfortable admitting the guilt of CB or that she in fact thinks hes innocent. Even going so far as acuusing me of exxagerating the evidence when what i stated re the evidence presented in court was 100% true.
it makes me wonder how far sceptics will go and what evidence they will ignore to try and convince themselves taht CB is somehow being set up as a patsy for the MM case.
If CB is convicted of teh abduction of MM I feel sure despite the evidence and court verdict...psters like gunit will question it.
i do understand why... how could the two best dogs in the world and the best dog handler ever known...be so wrong
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i wonder why it has prove dso difficult for gunit to answer this simple question. it can only be taht she is not comfortable admitting the guilt of CB or that she in fact thinks hes innocent. Even going so far as acuusing me of exxagerating the evidence when what i stated re the evidence presented in court was 100% true.
it makes me wonder how far sceptics will go and what evidence they will ignore to try and convince themselves taht CB is somehow being set up as a patsy for the MM case.
If CB is convicted of teh abduction of MM I feel sure despite the evidence and court verdict...psters like gunit will question it.
i do understand why... how could the two best dogs in the world and the best dog handler ever known...be so wrong
Well that isn't going to be happening anytime in the foreseeable future, so I wouldn't waste too much thought on the matter really.
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Well that isn't going to be happening anytime in the foreseeable future, so I wouldn't waste too much thought on the matter really.
Im more interested in calling out sceptics for their lack of credibility ....I agree it wont be soon....have to get the MO confirmed in the other two rape cases to strengthen the case against CM in the MM case
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Im more interested in calling out sceptics for their lack of credibility ....I agree it wont be soon....have to get the MO confirmed in the other two rape cases to strengthen the case against CM in the MM case
His MO was entering unlocked apartments, targeting single women, & raping them at knife point whilst filming.
I'm struggling to see the parallels with Madeleine's abduction personally.
So, what's the link between the Behan case & Maddie, according to you Wolters says there's a link.
I've asked you multiple times to provide a quote from Wolters, him claiming as much, but you never respond with anything.
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His MO was entering unlocked apartments, targeting single women, & raping them at knife point whilst filming.
I'm struggling to see the parallels with Madeleine's abduction personally.
So, what's the link between the Behan case & Maddie, according to you Wolters says there's a link.
I've asked you multiple times to provide a quote from Wolters, him claiming as much, but you never respond with anything.
I've posted it several times here,.....so it's strange you think I haven't... you'd never accept it anyway
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I've posted it several times here,.....so it's strange you think I haven't... you'd never accept it anyway
Try me, post it again.
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Try me, post it again.
[/quote
you are only here for a laugh so I wont be bothering.....are you not aware that HB recognised the MO in the DM case immedieately
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I'm quite aware, I'm quite aware that there's sod all connection between the rapes & Madeleine's disappearance, & I'm quite aware that, despite repeated requests, you have never provided the relevant quote from Wolters.
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I'm quite aware, I'm quite aware that there's sod all connection between the rapes & Madeleine's disappearance, & I'm quite aware that, despite repeated requests, you have never provided the relevant quote from Wolters.
Sam MO in the DM as in the HB case....as in the two other rape cases . if these 3 rapes charges result in a conviction taht wiill establish a proven MO ,..
If Wolters has a video of MM being tortured matching the proven MO that will be enough for guillty verdict. I have posted this before because several posters didnt like it, This is my theory and fits with everything Wolters has said...
you said you wouldnt believe unless you could watch the video of the rapes/torture...
perhaps you want to see the torture of MM too.
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Sam MO in the DM as in the HB case....as in the two other rape cases . if these 3 rapes charges result in a conviction taht wiill establish a proven MO ,..
If Wolters has a video of MM being tortured matching the proven MO that will be enough for guillty verdict. I have posted this before because several posters didnt like it, This is my theory and fits with everything Wolters has said...
you said you wouldnt believe unless you could watch the video of the rapes/torture...
perhaps you want to see the torture of MM too.
Still no cite regarding whatever Wolters is supposed to have said though. That's all I'm asking for. Where is it?
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“The case against the suspect Christian B for the [alleged] rape of Hazel Behan is in a good way… I am very hopeful for a charge on this case.
“We are building a picture of Christian B and the methods he uses to commit his crimes. There are parallels with the case of the American tourist who was raped, the attack on Hazel Behan, and the abduction and murder of Madeleine McCann.
“In each case the person has come into the person’s apartment or property by breaking and entering, often not through the door.”
https://inews.co.uk/news/world/madeleine-mccann-kidnap-suspect-faces-new-rape-charge-algarve-1364004
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Still no cite regarding whatever Wolters is supposed to have said though. That's all I'm asking for. Where is it?
hes made many statements....Ive not claimed anything he hasnt said...thats all you are getting...its of no imorance to me to keep you informed
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hes made many statements....Ive not claimed anything he hasnt said...thats all you are getting...its of no imorance to me to keep you informed
You have. You've repeatedly claim there's a link between the cases, when there isn't.
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You have. You've repeatedly claim there's a link between the cases, when there isn't.
There is
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There is
No, there isn't. The torture video of Maddie exists only in your imagination I'm afraid.
In the real world, the evidence against Brueckner is that he told his mates he murdered Maddie & destroyed the evidence. That's why he isn't being charged
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No, there isn't. The torture video of Maddie exists only in your imagination I'm afraid.
In the real world, the evidence against Brueckner is that he told his mates he murdered Maddie & destroyed the evidence. That's why he isn't being charged
Believe whatever you want
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Believe whatever you want
I believe Brueckner will never be charged, for the simple reason that it's obvious he won't be.